Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: Stopped on motorway for speeding
FightBack Forums > Queries > Speeding and other Criminal Offences
loan-ranger
I had just joined the motorway. The slip road was short and I had to join the motorway in between a lorry and another car.
The lorry sounded its horn as I got onto motorway. I put my foot down and overtook the congestion, which was around 10 vehicles. I felt intimidated by the big lorries.
I spotted a flashing police car behind me which was going very fast to get to me.
When I spoke to the copper, he said that he needed to drive in excess of 130 miles per hour to catch me up.
If I was speeding, it was only as an overtaking procedure. My speed was not over 80mph at any point.
I need to attend court in next couple of days. The only evidence they have given to me is the original hand written ticket from the policeman at the time. On that ticket it says I was travelling at 110mph.
I have 6 points on my licence already.
southpaw82
What's your question?
Logician
QUOTE
If I was speeding, it was only as an overtaking procedure. My speed was not over 80mph at any point.


Overtaking is not a defence to speeding. It is very unlikely that the police would decide to chase you if you were going no faster than 80mph. You seem to be heading for another 6 points and a 6 month totting ban unless you have good exceptional hardship argument to put forward.
loan-ranger
Such as?
peterguk
QUOTE (loan-ranger @ Tue, 29 Jul 2014 - 00:13) *
Such as?


You'd probably know if being without your car was going to cause EXCEPTIONAL hardship to others. You are supposed to suffer, that's part of the punishment.

Don't be tempted to make up any stories - they have a habit of finding out.

So, example - taking sick mother to hospital 3 times a week.

ETA

Your speed control when joining motorways could onbviously do with improving. Getting hooted by a lorry suggests driving without due care. Together with being intimidated by large lorries, maybe some further driver training might be of use?
loan-ranger
Is there any chance I could get off?
I haven't been supplied with any evidence apart from the original ticket that the policeman issued to me. Should I have been supplied with this evidence?
peterguk
QUOTE (loan-ranger @ Tue, 29 Jul 2014 - 00:18) *
Is there any chance I could get off?


On what basis? You admit to speeding.

Have you entered a plea by post?
loan-ranger
When I got stopped, the policeman said that his speed was in excess of 130. I said to him that it doesn't mean I was travelling at that speed.
I am going to court this week. Can I be prosecuted even though they don't have any material evidence.
peterguk
QUOTE (loan-ranger @ Tue, 29 Jul 2014 - 00:24) *
When I got stopped, the policeman said that his speed was in excess of 130. I said to him that it doesn't mean I was travelling at that speed.
I am going to court this week. Can I be prosecuted even though they don't have any material evidence.


The officer's statement will be their evidence. You could try suggesting you were travelling at a lower speed and ask for a Newton Hearing. Did he show you any devices he had fitted in the car?
loan-ranger
I have always assumed that the speed limits were 10% + 3mph ie 80mph on the motorway. My speed never exceeded 78 or 79 mph.
Should I fight this or not?


No devices were shown to me, but it was one of those motorway police cars.
captain swoop
Speed Limit is 70. 10% +2 is the ACPO guideline before enforcement for Cameras etc.

78 or 79 is speeding.
southpaw82
QUOTE (loan-ranger @ Tue, 29 Jul 2014 - 00:31) *
I have always assumed that the speed limits were 10% + 3mph ie 80mph on the motorway. My speed never exceeded 78 or 79 mph.
Should I fight this or not?


No devices were shown to me, but it was one of those motorway police cars.


If the speed limit was eight that's what it would say on the signs. The national speed limit for motorways is 70, not 80.
peterguk
...
Sparxy
Where abouts was this?
loan-ranger
The court papers say speeding in excess of 70mph. The policemans original ticket says my speed was 110mph.
Do you think I will get 3 points or be disqualified by receiving 6 points?

The court papers say speeding in excess of 70mph. The policemans original ticket says my speed was 110mph.
Do you think I will get 3 points or be disqualified by receiving 6 points?

On the motorway
peterguk
QUOTE (loan-ranger @ Tue, 29 Jul 2014 - 00:44) *
The court papers say speeding in excess of 70mph. The policemans original ticket says my speed was 110mph.
Do you think I will get 3 points or be disqualified by receiving 6 points?


You won't get 3 points for 110.
Sparxy
Wasn't the M5 J5 slip by any chance?
loan-ranger
How does a Newton hearing work?

It was a1.
No roadworks.
loan-ranger
Peter, I am a considerate driver. I never sound my horn in anger nor do I ignore other road users. I would slow down to let somebody in my lane. I can't say that everyone is like me. I have seen road rage and I think it's pathetic. Take a chill pill baitch!!!!

No offence.
The Rookie
If you were considerate would you pull out in front of a vehicle such that the driver felt they needed to sound the horn?

I really think you need to take a serious look at your driving and attitude, if you feel intimidated by lorries just driving along normally, the road isn't for you, the speed limit is just that, a LIMIT.

That said, a Newton plea is where you plead guilty to the offence (exceeding the 70mph speed limit), but dispute the facts of the case (the alleged speed), this may involve a full hearing much like a trial, or the CPS may accept you version of events, but not 80 when 110 is alleged. If your version of events isn't credible then the bench will ignore it.
roadrunner 163
How long did the officer follow you for? was it yards or miles? did you carry 100mph+ and is there any chance the police caught this on camera. If the bib did 130 to catch you then its a traffic car, they almost always have cctv facilities, its debatable if they used them or not.

If you did do 100+ and they can prove it then a newton hearing is just going to pi$$ the magistrates off. If you didn't then plead guilty and contest the facts. then a trail date will be set for you and the bib to attend and give evidence about your speed.
Don't forget, the bib will have some structure and rational to the speed they measured and submitted in their statement of facts. You replying I didn't wont wash.

110 will see you teetering on the edge or possibly a short ban, circa 14-28 days.


****

have you submitted a plea yet?
loan-ranger
No plea submitted.
I overtook the congestion which was around 160 meters in total.
I was travelling within limits when the police car was in my lane behind me.
If they need to be directly behind me for their equipment to operate properly then that never happened.

I have seen the after effects of a lorry crashing on a motorway. That scares me. Should I stop driving?
I have never crashed. Does that make me a good or bad driver?
southpaw82
QUOTE (loan-ranger @ Tue, 29 Jul 2014 - 23:06) *
If they need to be directly behind me for their equipment to operate properly then that never happened.

They don't.

QUOTE
I have never crashed. Does that make me a good or bad driver?


Neither. Though with your limited experience you're not a good driver, on an objective scale.
peterguk
QUOTE (loan-ranger @ Mon, 28 Jul 2014 - 23:45) *
I had to join the motorway in between a lorry and another car. The lorry sounded its horn as I got onto motorway.


You're asking if you're a safe driver? Ask the lorry driver.

loan-ranger
Why am I being attacked?
Is it because I have shown weakness?
How can you assess my driving abilities from those simple statements?
Bullies!!!!
I was told that police frequent this site.

I'm guessing now ............. Errrrm

So unless I go on a police training course I cannot be a good driver? Right?

Is Lewis Hamilton, or Jensen button good drivers?
Sparxy
QUOTE (loan-ranger @ Tue, 29 Jul 2014 - 23:45) *
Why am I being attacked?
Is it because I have shown weakness?
How can you assess my driving abilities from those simple statements?
Bullies!!!!
I was told that police frequent this site.

I'm guessing now ............. Errrrm

So unless I go on a police training course I cannot be a good driver? Right?

Is Lewis Hamilton, or Jensen button good drivers?


QUOTE (Highway Code - 259 Joining the motorway)
When you join the motorway you will normally approach it from a road on the left (a slip road) or from an adjoining motorway. You should:

* give priority to traffic already on the motorway
* check the traffic on the motorway and match your speed to fit safely into the traffic flow in the left-hand lane
* not cross solid white lines that separate lanes or use the hard shoulder
* stay on the slip road if it continues as an extra lane on the motorway
* remain in the left-hand lane long enough to adjust to the speed of traffic before considering overtaking.


You're not being bullied, just given the facts. If the lorry had to sound their horn, there was a reason. The vast majority of lorry drivers are some of the most courteous people on the roads. They will more than likely move out of the way (into lane 2) if they are able to!

I'm sure I am not alone when I say that a "good driver" would have the "learning" attitude to be able to acknowledge a mistake, learn from it, so that if it happened again in future they would act differently. I believe your attitude so far in this thread has come across as resistive. Everyone makes mistakes from time to time. I wouldn't use accident rate as a marker for being a "good driver" - even the most highly qualified drivers have probably had, or been close to, an accident at some point in the past or will have in the future.

The police do visit this site, so this thread could possibly end up appearing in court.
mickR
in defence of the OP id just like to mention that wwhile most HGV drivers will give you space to enter from the slip there are plenty of @rsehole HGV drivers who dont. the one in the OPs case could well have been Mr @rsehole. However.... it doesnt explain the need to accelerate past 10 cars... unless it was the truck from "The Duel" rolleyes.gif
loan-ranger
I am amazed at how I am being accused now. Wow.
The road joining the motorway started from a point lower than the motorway itself. Ie it was uphill. I could not see any oncoming traffic because there was bushes there.
As soon as the traffic upon the motorway was visible, I was travelling at a constant approach speed of say X mph. The motorway was (at that point) chockablock. It would have been impossible for me to speed up and overtake the congestion because it would mean that I would have needed to go on the hard shoulder.
There was a gap in the lane. The slip road was running out. I moved in.
Saying that a lorry sounded their horn is a bit unfair as I can't 100 percent recall whether it was a lorry or a car. It was definitely the sounding of a horn. Alpha male I presume. There was definitely lorries in the wave packet of congestion at that point. Lorries were overtaking lorries. (Not allowed in some countries btw).
At the first available opportunity I manovered my vehicle into the overtaking lane, increasing my speed at a constant rate.. I continued to accelerate and made my way into the overtaking overtaking lane or fast lane for short. I stopped increasing my speed and continued at a constant velocity until the congestion in the overtaking lane had come to an end. I indicated (msm). I left the fast lane.. The congestion in the leftmost lane was now behind me. I moved into that lane.

I'm a bit lost here now. Should I have not joined the motorway? Maybe I should have stopped on the slip road and got my red triangle out with my fluorescent waistcoat on? I'm really unsure of what you guys wanted me to do.
Thanks for the positive comments. I can see the regulars here got some ego problems, but then that has always been the problem with the police.
It wasn't me that bullied you at school. Get over it.
See you in court?
Please feel free to be angry
Lol
sgtdixie
OP, you may be surprised to know very few contributors to this site are serving police officers. But you come across as a new driver who has little experience or confidence driving. You will get the prosecution evidence before any trial but you need to be honest with yourself and is about your speed. They say 110. It is perfectly possible in some circumstances for them to be a few mph out but given the speed limit is 70 this isn't a question of guilt merely level of culpability. You need to be aware that a follow check can be 100% accurate of done properly and that is what they will no doubt state.

I would also point out that racing drivers are exceptionally gifted at their job. That is racing on a track. That doesn't mean they are good drivers on the road, just as a good road driver is unlikely to be a good racing driver.
Esmerobbo
You say you saw a gap and moved into it, this was when the horn was sounded? If so someone thought you may not have had the space to move into the flow of traffic. If your manoeuvre was safe and you had the space then why did you not simply move with the flow of traffic until it evened out a little before making progress and overtaking.

I am not a serving or ex police officer, but reading your posts it seems clear you may not be as good a driver as you believe you are.
Rallyman72
OK, I have seen idiots that try to stop another car from merging into traffic but they are few and far between, I've only seen it once on joining a motorway but quite frequently on dual carriageways so I have a deal of sympathy for that but there is almost always the option to slow slightly and pick another gap.

I'm afraid that the OP's posts come across to me with an attitude - I'm right and you are all wrong.

The attempt to draw a parallel with highly competent competition drivers is about as flawed as you can get because the skill sets are so different to driving on the road. A competition driver will see a move as safe when an ordinary member of the public may see it as dangerous. Who is correct?

There appears to be a lack of awareness on the part of the OP - was it a car or lorry that hooted? What is the national speed limit? Was it the A1 or the A1M? For joining a motorway Highway Code rule 259 says
QUOTE
Joining the motorway. When you join the motorway you will normally approach it from a road on the left (a slip road) or from an adjoining motorway. You should:

give priority to traffic already on the motorway
check the traffic on the motorway and match your speed to fit safely into the traffic flow in the left-hand lane
not cross solid white lines that separate lanes or use the hard shoulder
stay on the slip road if it continues as an extra lane on the motorway
remain in the left-hand lane long enough to adjust to the speed of traffic before considering overtaking.
It seems that this is not, from your own description, what you did.

There is at least one if not two previous offences (6 points from what?).

There isn't 'bullying' on here, just questioning in a similar vein to that which might take place in court.

The volunteers on this forum, for that is indeed what they are, range from lay persons like me through to legally qualified members and, yes, one or two police officers but only a very small number. I hold an MSA Competition licence by the way and organise motorsports events, that doesn't automatically make me a good driver but I do learn from and I am aware of the times I make mistakes.
loan-ranger
I have tried to describe what happened as simply as possible. My fashion sense isn't in question nor should my driving competence be dissected. I passed my driving test.
I can see a bunch of people making holes in what I have said. I respect your opinions, however too many assumptions are being made. This is called gaslighting, and is a trait of dsm iv.
Thanks for your help.
southpaw82
That's quite enough of that.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2019 Invision Power Services, Inc.