Hi I have received a letter from pcn re: parking in a disabled bay at meadowhall. I am the registered keeper but was not driving.

I am disabled and had a valid blue badge and timer, and also my tax disc is disabled if they bothered to look!!! I have looked on their website but on the photo my grandaughter has put her hairbrush on the dashboard which has pushed the actual badge under the timer.

I had this scenario in december 2012 but Meadowhall customer services sorted it out for me after sending a photocopy of my badge, but it took nearly a year and loads of threatening letters. Unfortunately the driver and I didn't ever find a fine ticket on the car, although PCM have a picture of it on the windscreen, and I have now just received this letter.

I have no idea what I need to do now, should I appeal? I wondered if someone would mind giving me some help and advice? Thank you.

PS. They have taken picures of the rear seats of my car with my granddaughters car seats in. What are they for? I find it a bit intrusive.

Read this thread for starters - lots of similarities... Trubster will probably be along later too.

Thank you. I think Trubster advised me last time but that was before the protocol changed.

ive sent you a pm

Sadly they stoop very low on Planet PPC. Your granddaughter could have been sitting in the seat when they took the photos.It doesn't stop them. There isn't (as far as I know someone please correct
me if Im wrong)) any law against this. This could be used as evidence against you because in their tiny minds they wouldn't comprehend the fact that you could be disabled and have children or be disabled and
be travelling with your grandchildren. They would perceive it as parents with kids parking in a disabled parking space. Don't get caught up in this and stick to the cold hard facts.
However if I caught one of them taking pictures of my car while my children were inside theyd get an earful.

Obviously very low!!! Well they had also seen my disabled badge, albeit partly covered, and tax disc, taking photos of both back seat rows in my people carrier through blacked out windows would seem to be a bit excessive, especially since it is only a few months ago that I had to send a copy of my blue badge to meadowhall, so there is already proof of my disability. They must just be sat waiting to pounce on any little thing. Its very rare I go to Meadowhall now as all this hassle puts me off. Unfortunately I had to pick up my laptop from apple after a repair so I had no choice!!!

Probably yes. The more tickets the more cash.
Yes this must irritating as you've already sent a copy of your blue badge to Meadowhall but as you know youre onto a winner with the advice on here so youll have to accept these things come along every now
and then to bother us....like an episode of flatulence but it will soon pass and go away

every PPC has the same goal
maximise revenue

Thanks for all the replies. Hopefully trubster will see this and advice me what to do now.

what letter have you had off them? please email it to me, I will PM my email address.

Myself, SRM and Kirbyinfurnesslad (who has beaten me to it ) are very clued up with the horrific procedures these jokers use. The one thing to do, is not panic. If you have the confidence to do it, take them to court... it is discrimination and harassment, and if you read through my thread (quoted above and in my signature) you will see how easy it is.

Hi trubster, have done as requested, thanks. I have read through your thread a couple of times and you did a great job. I'm not sure if I totally understand all the legal stuff though. I put my hands up to the badge being obscured by the timer, but you can see there is a badge and there is a disabled exempt tax disc, so they could use some nouse??? I thought I was done with this last year when my last one was sorted, but here we go again!!! Also there was no notice on my car, so don't know what happened to it.

Lovely word nouse. However it has no relevance in any shape or form when referring to what an employee of a PPC could use.

(Trubster - just wondered if you received the email, can't pm you as your box is full.)

There is a time limit for me to reply to the original letter of 28 days from 1 April, do I need to write a 'representation', and if so can someone tell me what I need to put in it please?

Also, as Meadowhall car park is free, where is the actual loss to anyone, as I presume this is what I am being fined for?

Yep, you have a standard NTK, Send in a self written appeal to PCM (online if you can) - do not mention who was driving.

Use words like "A blue badge was on display, a disabled person was using the car and by continuing to harass me, you are breaching the equality act and I will be taking this matter further. Cancel the charge now or issue a popla code for me to use the slam dunk GPEOL appeal."

Dont forget to add "I have nothing further to add to this appeal" and they shouldnt ask you what colour top you were wearing while they think about it for another 30 days,

Thanks trubster, will draft an appeal asap x

Just went onto the web page cited on my letter and it says do not use this page for tickets at meadowhall or bluewater???

Visit My Website

is there any other way to send them my appeal online, please?

http://www.paymypcn-uk.co.uk/live-pgcns-user/

Enter PCN number and VRM, then it should give you the option to view images and appeal.

Remember... No naming drivers Like the mafia, we don't like Grass's

Sorry due to school holidays I've left this until the last minute. Trubster, without appearing dumb, is it actually called the slam dunk GPEOL appeal, please?

Hi Trubster, could you or any other advisor please check out this apeal before I submit it. Also does it matter that the blue badge displayed was partially obscured? Thanks.

In appealing against pcn xxxxx I would like to inform you that a blue badge was on display, a disabled person was using the car, and that the car was also displaying a tax disc with the tax class 'disabled'. Also a copy of the valid blue badge is held by Meadowhall management.

By continuing to harass me you are breaching the equality act and if this persists I will have no option but to take this matter further. You can either cancel the charge now or issue a popla code to me to enable me to use the GPEOL appeal.

I have nothing further to add to this appeal

Challenge done on line this morning. Will wait for their response!!!

Hi Vix

Trubster is busy elsewhere at the moment. However, assuming that you used the draft previously posted, your appeal is almost certainly sufficient for PCM to reject it - which is the objective - so that you can then make a full POPLA appeal. It is important that a fully worded appeal goes to POPLA in order to secure a win.

It is clear that Meadowhall's Equality Act policies are4 either non-existant or are poor (probably the latter).

PCM may not even issue a POPLA code as they jumped ship to the IPC just after you got your PCN. So you may be stuck between a rock and hard place when they reply and will need to complain to the BPA and the Meadowhall. One poster (not trubster) has in fact had a meeting with Meadowhall only last week and they are aware they have a problem there with PCM being overkeen to ticket disabled people's cars and not making reasonable adjustments. It was a poster on here or MSE forum who had PCM on their back for several 'tickets' which PCM were then told to cancel and add their car reg to an exempt list!!

PCM appear to moved on 1 April so this should be BPA from the dates. But they won't be keen to give up a POPLA code I suspect...

Quick reply received from PCM. Have attached the letter sort of refusing my appeal, unless I tell them who was driving? Can you advise please trubster? Thanks

Write back and tell them you are under no obligation to name the driver

What will happen then, please? Having read the information above re PCM should I try and contact Meadowhall? I don't like the sound of "between a rock and a hard place"?

You will get an IAS code to do a second stage appeal. Write back and say you are the registered keeper and as POFA 2012 includes potential liability for keepers, you are entitled to appeal when you go the NTK - and you are not a third party.

State that you know they have only just had a meeting with another disabled person who was victimised in the same way and if they don't cancel this PCN or send you a valid IAS appeal code by return you will report them to the IPC and to the Centre Management...again.

Thank you very much SchoolRunMum, is this preferable to contacting Meadowhall at this point?

Nope, do both. Send a pm to this poster who just had that meeting I was telling you about:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=89521

and tell Meadowhall that they are getting a local reputation as being disabled-unfriendly as their PPC breaks the Equality Act and harasses disabled people.

OK. Thanks so much will get on the case tomorrow.

Sorry... Missed the action again.

Will this not have to go to popla as PCM was a BPA member at the time of the ticket? Either way IAS will still grant it on GPEOL as the signage and conditions you are alleged to have breached are the ones that matter. They can't change it from a breach to a charge after the event.

Yes, it would be POPLA but they won't want to give up a code now if they can avoid it.

Hi, not done anything yet as been at hospital. Not sure what I should be doing now after reading the new posts. what's the consensus of opinion? Thanks

Come on, just do what was advised already - we are only musing about what independent appeal you might or might not be offered. It doesn't change anything and I thought you were sending a pm to the Blue Dragon and that you knew what to send.

I guess you won't be offered POPLA but we'll see and it won't matter. In any case Meadowhall will cancel it which is why you want the contact & details from The Blue Dragon.

No point people wasting their time and repeating themselves

I contacted him by pm yesterday as suggested, as I found his thread on MSE. Sorry, I didn't intend wasting anyone's time, I was a little confused as to whether the changing status of PCM made a difference to what I should be doing. I am grateful for everyone's time helping me and just wanted to make sure I was doing the right thing. Am awaiting a reply to my pm to the blue dragon sent yesterday, have also pm'd him on here, and meanwhile will do as schoolrunmum instructed. Thanks

Sent you a pm. I have another meeting on the 14th with the actual owner of pcm to dicuss what needs to change about their system.

Could I please accompany you to this meeting?, this could turn out to be extremely useful

Thank you very much Blue Dragon. Good luck for your meeting.

I thoroughly recommend that KIFL comes along.

Return letter to PCM sent recorded delivery today, (thanks schoolrunmum for the help) and have emailed meadowhall with copies of my correspondence with PCM. (Thanks blue dragon for the details). Will be back when a response is received from either source.

Click to view attachmentSecond response from PCM accusing me of refusing to disclose the driver and now demanding £95 received today. Had acknowledgement of receipt of my email to Meadowhall and given them my reg and pcn number but not heard back yet. Can they refuse to give me the POPLA code? What should I do now, please?

Denying the keeper an appeal seems to be at direct odds to recent BPA guidance:



I would remind them of this and give them one more opportunity before reporting them.

One more chance? They've had enough now surely?

I'd be wading in to the BPA, cc'd to the DVLA, and Trading Standards too.

Well indeed - perhaps I'm too generous...

Just received an email from Meadowhall management saying my ticket is cancelled. So much for PCM's threats and rhetoric. Really think they should be stopped flouting BPA's rules so blatantly though. Thanks for the help everyone.

Excellent news. Well done.

Good stuff.

Thank you