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Kandi
Hello everyone. Was hoping to find a "Waning-Newbie posting" Insert but no joy. I have a lazy eye and much as I may be interested in the info, find it really hard going focusing on dozens and dozens of different posts and topics for too long a time.
Consequently I have never really managed to get to grips with forums - like many people I also tend to start looking at them when I am in a panic and there has suddenly been yet another deadline to adhere to.

So - If I am doing something wrong, please tell me, but please be nice about it. "Everything is Difficult before it is Easy".


I've just received an invoice in the post from Highview Parking. "The Driver", stayed longer than they should have in Tesco Car Park.

In the days of ignoring these Private parking Charges - I imagine a lot of people blatantly just ignored the signs and parked anyway. Because they ignored all correspondence they never had to justify why they were parked under a huge great notice!

Now that we have to appeal - I assume we have to have a reasonable argument! eg., If I just overstayed my time in Tesco because I felt like it, I'd have no grounds for appeal would I?

In my case I had just been to the dentist, injections and so forth - parked in Tesco, popped into town to the bank and another errand, intending to then go into Tesco on the way back to the car.
However I felt really unwell and had to go and sit and have a cup of tea and wait until I felt better - I took painkillers and was pretty much nodding off. I then carried on back to Tesco, still feeling rough and actually ended up sitting in the car with the door and windows open for at least an hour. I totally forgot about the 3 hour limit.
Is that a reason to appeal?, do you think?

What if I had just gone shopping and forgot the time - what would I do then? Just pay it???
Or make up some story?
(Dentist isn't a story and I can supply appointment sheet?

Also if it does go to court and I was found guilty - do I pay the original £70, the early bird £40 or whatever horrendous sum it has increased to because I didn't pay it in the first instance??

I hope that makes sense!


(I plan to appeal to the shop, then the Parking Co asking for POPLA details, then POPLA, etc., etc.,)



kommando
QUOTE
(I plan to appeal to the shop, then the Parking Co asking for POPLA details, then POPLA, etc., etc.,)


Nearly there,

1. Appeal to shop

2. Soft Appeal to PPC and request POPLA code if rejected using any lame read or concocted excuse, see link below to parking pranksters site and look at his Highview appeals.

3 POPLA but using advise from this forum which are currently getting 100% satisfaction.

All in 3rd party and never admitt name of driver.

and read this for detailed advice and excellent entertainment http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/

the most relevant post on PP's blog http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/20...ng-take-on.html

And the court action is not criminal but civil so you will never be found guilty, the worse you did (and you didn't) was breach some silly terms and conditions not the law.

If you lose at court which is highly unlikely as a win at POPLA is a shoo in currently then it would be typically a cost of £160 to £250 depending on the imagination of the PPC, the court case would be won by yourself any way with a good defence but the POPLA route is stress free in comparison.
Kandi
Nearly there, [color="#00FF00"][/color] LOL

1. Appeal to shop

Do you think my real justification is justification enough - in this case for the shop? I'd like it to stop there if poss as I'm worried about missing letters whilst I'm away.
I am just about to email the shop but thought I'd better check on my reason first with you guys.



2. Soft Appeal to PPC and request POPLA code if rejected using any lame read or concocted excuse, see link below to parking pranksters site and look at his Highview appeals.

If I have to appeal to Highview, is it sufficient to email? Providing I get a reply. Or do I need to post it and get a signature as proof of receipt.



3 POPLA but using advise from this forum which are currently getting 100% satisfaction.

How do I get help from here? What part of the site do I request help on?



All in 3rd party and never admitt name of driver.

Understood.



and read this for detailed advice and excellent entertainment http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/

Yes, another member advised me to - Read the Highview one. Will read some others when I am less rushed. I don't understand why the PPC's bother pursuing him. It's bad publicity for them, makes them look idiots and uses up their time.

Most of all, if they didn't bite - he would have no blog. Are they truly stupid or am I missing something?



the most relevant post on PP's blog http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/20...ng-take-on.html

That page doesn't seem to be there any longer ...



And the court action is not criminal but civil so you will never be found guilty, the worse you did (and you didn't) was breach some silly terms and conditions not the law.

That's what I meant really.



If you lose at court which is highly unlikely as a win at POPLA is a shoo in currently then it would be typically a cost of £160 to £250 depending on the imagination of the PPC,

I hope not :-( Can't afford the £40!!



the court case would be won by yourself any way with a good defence but the POPLA route is stress free in comparison.

I'm sorry I don't understand this bit.
It sounds to me like you're saying it's either/or? either court or POPLA?

I understood that if POPLA did not accept my appeal - I'd have to either go to court or pay the PPC what figure they want - either way that would prove very expensive for me.

Could you clarify that bit for me?



I'm sorry to be questioning even the basics here but if I'm going to do it I want to understand what I'm doing and do it right.

emanresu
Here's a trick for you to understand the game.

http://en.parkopedia.co.uk/parking/sw1a_1aa/

This is a list of parking around Buckingham Palace - one of the most expensive spots in London. £58 / day. So if you have overstayed in a Tesco car park why are they so much more expensive that BuckPal?

Or another way. If you overstay in Kensington & Chelsea the Council will ask (maximum) for £135. This is penal. It''s designed to be penal which is why it's called a Penalty Notice.

Under Civil law (private parking) there cannot / never can be a penal charge which is why these always fail.

However there will be a lot of smoke and mirrors in an attempt to make you think you should pay but there is no need.

Use that site to enter the car parking postcode and see what the local rates are per hour. Then calculate your overstay and see if the maximum you could possibly owe is anywhere near what they ask for - or is it penal.
cabbyman
There may be some points in my thread that can help you, here:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=78520&st=0


We are still awaiting the POPLA decision due on 18th June!!!!
Kandi
Thanks for the advice Emanresu and Cabbyman - rest assured all your advice is helpful and knowledge is power :-)

Hopefully Kommando will see my reply - I don't know if you can "tag" people on forums to alert them that you're talking with them?

I'm just very frustrated, mostly because of lack of time (Going away and may not have internet). At the moment I really need to try to find answers to my specific questions which are real basics. I have to email the shop today so anyone who can tell me whether my genuine reason about the dentist is good enough to send to the shop? - see my original post #1 and the questions to Kommando's kind reply #3 - would really be helping me. Also the basic question of whether I can email the PPC or do I have to send a proper letter and get it signed for? and also if I did then need to do a POPLA appeal where I go on this website to get help?

I'm not at all ungrateful - obviously the more I understand about the system the better, but as this is my first experience I would really like to get my questions answered in case I make some silly mistake!

It is a fascinating stuff but I'm still on milk here. Could I have some milk and save the juicy steaks for when I've cut my teeth? I am genuinely interested, pls don't think otherwise and I appreciate every reply, but I am panicked over my time constraints.
SchoolRunMum
Right, Highview do not do Court and are easily seen off (hope you read the Parking Prankster's blogs on Highview and what he actually put in his first appeal to them each time?!)

And Tesco CAN cancel these fake PCNs for customers.

So try the Tesco thing first. BUT don't 'send something' to the shop itself. Either go in dressed smartly (deliberately to look professional and like you mean business). Insist on a 'quiet word' with the Store Manager (do not accept a 'Duty Manager' from the meat counter or wherever). Be assertive and wave the letters and your other recent Tesco receipts around a bit, in front of customers and requiring the Store Manager to cancel it if he wants to keep your family's business.

Here are just two of many reports where this was successful in Supermarkets by speaking to the right person (Store Manager only) in person or by phone, in a polite, professional but insistent manner:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showth....php?p=62433673

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4534485

Or take a leaf out of this person's book on MSE and get your fake PCN cancelled by emailing a complaint to the CEO of Tesco, here you go:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/....php?t=4694547

Tesco CEO's email addy is on that thread. Go straight to the top and get the stupid threat cancelled like that other poster did. You are NOT telling anyone about your mitigating circumstances by the way (or if you do mention the dentist and your pain, DO NOT say whether or not you actually shopped at Tesco!!). This isn't a 'please let me off, here's my excuse' email to Tesco - it's a complaint about the unwelcome and intimidating harassment by their agent. When emailing the CEO explain that you simply want your faith restored in Tesco's good name by having this threat cancelled, but if they do not you do NOT give them permission to share your name and address details with Highview but will be adding a complaint on the Tesco facebook page too if this is not resolved. After all, lay it on thick, you are someone whose Clubcard record will {presumably} show you to be a very regular customer...

You have only 28 days to appeal to Highview so do diarise to come back here on say, day 21 to discuss that email if you haven't had any joy from Tesco themselves. And was the Highview Notice received at your house within 14 days of the incident? Important.
Kandi
Thank you SchoolMumRun.

I cannot get to the store now, so maybe I should write to the CEO after what you've said.

I'm just having trouble with the email now you've said, don't give your reason why you went over. I'm not at all well atm and what I could normally do reasonably OK I am struggling with especially as I have to go away Thurs so time is worrying me.

I'm worried that I won't get it sorted in time if I have to also email Highview and if they send me letters I won't get them.

Is it OK to send the email to Highview at the same time as I send en email to Tesco CEO - to hedge my bets and save time. If I wasn't going away I wouldn't be quite so worried.
SchoolRunMum
QUOTE (Kandi @ Mon, 15 Jul 2013 - 19:38) *
Thank you SchoolMumRun.

I cannot get to the store now, so maybe I should write to the CEO after what you've said.

I'm just having trouble with the email now you've said, don't give your reason why you went over. I'm not at all well atm and what I could normally do reasonably OK I am struggling with especially as I have to go away Thurs so time is worrying me.

I'm worried that I won't get it sorted in time if I have to also email Highview and if they send me letters I won't get them.

Is it OK to send the email to Highview at the same time as I send en email to Tesco CEO - to hedge my bets and save time. If I wasn't going away I wouldn't be quite so worried.




Yes that's fine to do.

In both of them say that the charge is punitive, not a genuine estimate of any 'loss' at all - and the signs were not compliant with the BPA Code of Practice as there isn't a clear one at the entrance and the wording isn't readable from a car as a driver enters the site. In the Highview one just add a sentence at the end asking for a POPLA code if they reject the appeal and in the Tesco one make it more of a complaint about harassment by their agent when you are ill and you are a regular customer. Ask the CEO of Tesco to cancel it as you feel intimidated by their agent and it's making you feel like never shopping at Tesco again...

You do not even have to talk about the overstay AT ALL!
Kandi
Need your expertise now guys! :-(

I wrote to the CEO of Tesco - they won't cancel the charge because I haven't kept my receipt, nor have I been using my Clubcard so I have no poof that I shopped there.

A member of Pepipoo kindly helped me with an appeal letter to send to Highview - copy below. but they have emailed back saying it does not constitute an appeal.

See both emails below. Please could someone give me a couple of lines to add to my email which will make it constitute an appeal, so that I can just resend it?

I am away from home and don't have full time internet access so I will get back on here when I can.

Many thanks

K

My email to Highview

Dear Sirs,

With regard to your invoice Ref : 0714130628006. Dated 09 July 201.

I deny all liability to your company. Please accept this as my letter of appeal and as such,
I would ask you to confirm cancellation of this charge.

Should you reject this appeal I will require within 35 days, a POPLA verification code in order for me to appeal independently - as per Version 2 of the BPA Code of Practice.

The appeal will be deemed accepted if there is no POPLA code on any rejection that you supply within the timeframe stipulated above.


Yours Faithfully




Appeals (PCN) <appeal@appealpcn.co.uk>
22 Jul (2 days ago)

to me
Dear Madam,

Thank you for your correspondence concerning the above Parking Charge Notice. We are fully aware that this is a standard text.

We can only provide a POPLA code if the driver has made an appeal, outlining any mitigating circumstances that they believe to apply, and we have rejected it. A demand to either cancel a charge or provide a POPLA code does not constitute an appeal. If you wish to make an appeal, please do so, so we may accept or reject it accordingly. We will hold the charge for a further 14 days.

Yours faithfully,

Highview Parking Limited
cabbyman
I would give them one last chance:

Please provide a POPLA reference if you will not accept my appeal. I will enter no further correspondence with you.

Await the opinion of others before you send it.
SchoolRunMum
Really not sure why you didn't put a bit more 'appeal' into that appeal seeing as if you read every other Highview thread on here you would have been expecting that. All you needed was 'the driver did not see your so-called signs, which I am aware are not compliant with the BPA Code of Practice Appendix B (entrance signs). I also contend you have no case as you have suffered no loss whatsoever. The vehicle was not parked inappropriately; as such, the parking 'charge' notice (ticket) also exceeded the appropriate amount and I am not liable for it. These are the 3 boxes I will be ticking in my P.O.PLA appeal so as you can see, you MUST consider this a challenge. POPLA code now or cancel. Your response will be added to my complaint about you, already sent to the DVLA and BPA AOS Compliance Manager and to my local Trading Standards office.'
Kandi
Hello

Firstly massive thank yous for your replies.

The email of appeal which I sent to Highview was literally word for word what another member had generously given me.

The reason for that and why I wasn't able to devote a lot of time to looking at looking at all the other Highview threads was, as I mentioned, that I was due to go on a trip and needed to act upon this quickly. In addition I am unwell at present and whilst at another time I may have felt able to expend more mental energy on it, that simply isn't possible at the moment.
I did what I could with the advice, time and energy available to me.

I feel like I've failed an exam. Whilst I fully support the cause here and appreciate the time and effort members put in I am unable to match their enthusiasm and commitment at this time.

Once again I am grateful for the latest advice and shall press on and report back. Any further comments are very welcome and appreciated. My apologies that I have not been able to go through every thread. I thank those who have appreciated my need to fast track this time.

I omitted to say that I do not know the car park in question well and have not been able to go back there to check out the signage but I am pretty sure it was clear enough. Because of my situation that day I simply forgot the time and had actually spent a good part of the time sitting in the car !
SchoolRunMum
You haven't failed, this was only a mock! POPLA is the real 'exam' but you need your 'candidate number' for entry!!! {i.e. POPLA code}.

But you said you'd been ill...do you mind me asking if this is a long-term condition affecting you for more then 12 months and would it have slowed you down that day? If so then you're covered by the Equality Act 2010 and can have longer to shop by law:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8488737.stm

Someone with a long-term medical condition (even depression and other non-mobility issues) meets the definition of disability under the Act (no need for Blue Badge of course, this is contract law on private land, not a statutory fine). SO do you fit that definition, if you don't mind me asking? If so you can email the CEO straight back and point out Tesco and their agent have breached the Equality Act 2010 by not making a reasonable adjustment to a person who needs it. Copy that article to him (as you can see, Tesco knew about it 3 years ago...).
Kandi
Thank you SchoolRunMum. Sorry about the delay replying. I don't think the disability thing would wash because once they refused on the basis I had no proof I shopped there - I explained that I was new to the are and had had to walk to town to go to the bank, then had a funny turn, and that I spent ages just sitting in the car once I returned, until I felt OK to shop. But they are saying that the car park is for "Tesco shoppers only", and I've shot myself in the foot by saying I had gone into town before I took unwell.

I will have to re-appeal to Highview I think using the additional info you've given me.ie.

'the driver did not see your so-called signs, which I am aware are not compliant with the BPA Code of Practice Appendix B (entrance signs). I also contend you have no case as you have suffered no loss whatsoever. The vehicle was not parked inappropriately; as such, the parking 'charge' notice (ticket) also exceeded the appropriate amount and I am not liable for it. These are the 3 boxes I will be ticking in my P.O.PLA appeal so as you can see, you MUST consider this a challenge. POPLA code now or cancel. Your response will be added to my complaint about you, already sent to the DVLA and BPA AOS Compliance Manager and to my local Trading Standards office.'

Sadly the Tesco signs are all visable and numerous.So I can't say the driver didn't see them, they'd have to be too short sighted to drive not to see them. Also I don't know whether they are compliant with BPA code of practice Appendix B?? and I'm not up to doing loads of reading and trying to absorb that kind of detailed information to be confident that I am in the right. I just hope I can copy and paste the remainder of your paragraph and that will suffice. I just want an end to this - as I've said, it's not a game to me and I can't take it in my stride due to my condition. It's just more stress for me. More deadlines to remember , more that I have to try to sort out when I have extreme difficulty in focus and concentration. As such things take me a long time and there are other matters I need to attend to so I hold my hands up that I am looking for the quickest, simplest way out of this.

I do really appreciate your help so thank you again.
Nelseman
Can you say which Tesco's store this was at via Private Message? The signs may be plentiful but that doesn't make them compliant with the BPA COP, one Highview often fail with is the location of the entrance sign. I've come across a few in my local area which don't comply in there siting. I haven't gone through a POPLA appeal, but there are plenty of usually valid reasons that would result in a successful appeal, not sure if the numerous failures to comply with POFA that highview are guilty of can be used at POPLA, hopefully someone with POPLA experience will guide you through putting together a suitable appeal.
Nelseman
What was the date on the original notice, As Highview say you haven't had you letter recognised as an appeal, I'd put another appeal in regarding their non compliance under POFA to pursue the registered keeper. I can supply a sample letter but without seeing the original notice (but I think from what I've seen it will be the same as one's I've successfully appealed against. I'll PM you the letter. send it in by Email to highview
Nelseman
sample appeal letter sent, let me know if you have any questions.
Kandi
QUOTE (SchoolRunMum @ Wed, 24 Jul 2013 - 23:50) *
You haven't failed, this was only a mock! POPLA is the real 'exam' but you need your 'candidate number' for entry!!! {i.e. POPLA code}.

But you said you'd been ill...do you mind me asking if this is a long-term condition affecting you for more then 12 months and would it have slowed you down that day? If so then you're covered by the Equality Act 2010 and can have longer to shop by law:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8488737.stm

Someone with a long-term medical condition (even depression and other non-mobility issues) meets the definition of disability under the Act (no need for Blue Badge of course, this is contract law on private land, not a statutory fine). SO do you fit that definition, if you don't mind me asking? If so you can email the CEO straight back and point out Tesco and their agent have breached the Equality Act 2010 by not making a reasonable adjustment to a person who needs it. Copy that article to him (as you can see, Tesco knew about it 3 years ago...).



Hi SchoolRunMum

Did you see my post #15 and if so, do you agree that whilst I do have an ongoing health issue, I don't think they would wear it, in view of the info have already given them about having to nip into town, prior to having a funny turn ...

Your input is appreciated as always
SchoolRunMum
Been on holiday and now have a pressing family issue, sorry.

But OF COURSE a person who meets the Equality Act 2010 definition of disability (Google it) has to be allowed a reasonable adjustment for parking. I have given you a link to the BBC article explaining it and somewhere on here are some POPLA appeals I have written about disabled overstay situations.

And in many car parks you do not have to shop in Tesco to use their car park so stop crossing off solid appeal points and draft that POPLA appeal from others you can read if you trawl through the threads on this forum. You only have 28 days maximum counting from the date of their rejection letter.
cabbyman
My submission to POPLA linked in post #5 above was a winner and POPLA upheld my appeal.

Have a look at that and see what you can make of it. I've done most of the work for you. Tailor it to your own circumstances and post the draft here for fine tuning.
budget1
have read with avid interest all feedback.....sadly im no exception to the rule of the worried well.. same old chestnut our pals at highview...long and short looks like it has cost me more than a fine... facts..ticket issued 11/6...last.. sent to registered keeper . my friend...mr anon...for my part i was the the driver..therefore liable in friends eyes...rightfully so.? however friend and i major fallout as a result sadly...now gone up to £110 as a result...i phoned highview to eliminate my ex pal of any liability..was told account frozen for 14days by way of an awaited emailed response from me.? aas yet they aint had it..due tomorrow at latest... the usual threats of blacklisting of my mate caused the fallout?
RSVP.
respectfully BUDGET1 ohmy.gif
bama
start your own thread
Magandang_Buhay
QUOTE (Kandi @ Sat, 13 Jul 2013 - 17:19) *
Because they ignored all correspondence they never had to justify why they were parked under a huge great notice!

Now that we have to appeal - I assume we have to have a reasonable argument!


Maybe it's worth pointing out that there is nothing to say one has to appeal or enter into any correspondence.
budget1
QUOTE (bama @ Wed, 21 Aug 2013 - 09:28) *
start your own thread

not sure what you mean if thats giving a blow by blow account happy to do so if helps others..but in the interests albeit..my selfish self this is not helping current situ..shall i enter into correspondence..or not . please advise . budget1?You've started a duplicate thread! " /> fair to point out i feel they have no way of proving who was driving vehicle at the time.. ive no doubt my ex mate may have protested his own innocence.. no way of knowing as he is in a huff tongue.gif
nigelbb
Forum rules. One case. On thread. Otherwise it gets bloody confusing not knowing who is being advised to do what or which case is being referred to. So...start your own thread.
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