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jacob30
Hi.
I'm a driver of bendy bus. My vehicle is 18m long. I'm always reduce my speed before lights when approaching on late green. Usually doing 20 mph, however sometimes I'm only a few meters from line when lights change to amber. I can put foot on brake but as effect of that some of my passengers may fell on the floor. If i carry on about half of the bus passing line and other half is behind when lights change to red. Should I be fined when catch by red cam. What do U think about this situation?
Gan
It's a good question
Every bus or coach that I've ridden on has carried on with the light changing to red before the bus has passed the line.

According to my estimate, 20 mph is 9 m/s
Assuming the amber is on for three seconds, you'll just make it if you're within 9 m of the line when it changes

If the red cameras don't activate until the red has been on for two seconds you can probably stretch it by another 9m (wouldn't risk 18m) and assume that most of the drivers waiting for the green will recognise the bus and not jump the lights

If you're more than 18 m away when they change to amber you should be able to stop without much drama - about 0.23 g

It would make sense if bendy-buses had transponders to stop lights changing when they're within 20m or so
StuartBu
QUOTE (Gan @ Wed, 22 May 2013 - 22:55) *
It's a good question
Every bus or coach that I've ridden on has carried on with the light changing to red before the bus has passed the line.

According to my estimate, 20 mph is 9 m/s
Assuming the amber is on for three seconds, you'll just make it if you're within 9 m of the line when it changes

If the red cameras don't activate until the red has been on for two seconds you can probably stretch it by another 9m (wouldn't risk 18m) and assume that most of the drivers waiting for the green will recognise the bus and not jump the lights

If you're more than 18 m away when they change to amber you should be able to stop without much drama - about 0.23 g

It would make sense if bendy-buses had transponders to stop lights changing when they're within 20m or so


Those things were suggested ( either to keep them on green or change them to green)onTomorrows World for Fire Engines etc years ago but I dont think anything came of it . I thought it was an excellent idea.
Jimzzr
QUOTE (jacob30 @ Wed, 22 May 2013 - 21:44) *
Hi.
I'm a driver of bendy bus. My vehicle is 18m long. I'm always reduce my speed before lights when approaching on late green. Usually doing 20 mph, however sometimes I'm only a few meters from line when lights change to amber. I can put foot on brake but as effect of that some of my passengers may fell on the floor. If i carry on about half of the bus passing line and other half is behind when lights change to red. Should I be fined when catch by red cam. What do U think about this situation?


Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the offence occurs if part of the bus crosses the line on red. Therefore provided you have managed to stop the vehicle before the lights go red, you should be OK just sitting there blocking all the traffic until they go green again. I think you ought to be OK even if it's a box junction provided your exit was clear when you entered it.

They seem to have got rid of these thing from londons roads now, but I used to see the rear of these buses crossing on red all the time (it's not exactly a rare event for normal buses). I can only the guess that the police must have turned a blind eye
johnjo42
No Jim you are not wrong, you are spot on correct. If any part of the vehicle crosses the white line while the red light is showing, an offence is committed.
The only safe way is to approach the lights being ready to stop much earlier than you would otherwise do.
JJ
The Rookie
The trouble is with a long vehicle like that, the slower you go (sub 20mph) the bigger the risk of still crossing when the lights are red.

However in those circumstances I would expect a special reasons argument to prevail.
Mortimer
It is one of the anomalies that if taken literally could cause all sorts of congestion problems. As it is the drivers responsibility that the whole vehicle can proceed through before the red light is lit, the only safe way to ensure a legal passage through the lights would be for long vehicles to stop before the stop line irrespective of whether the lights are currently green or red, and wait for the next change to green. Then and only then can they be assured of having enough time to proceed completely through the junction.

Can't see that happening though, can you?
Gan
Therefore provided you have managed to stop the vehicle before the lights go red, you should be OK just sitting there blocking all the traffic until they go green again. I think you ought to be OK even if it's a box junction provided your exit was clear when you entered it.

That was my understanding of his legal position

The only safe way is to approach the lights being ready to stop much earlier than you would otherwise do.
Which makes him a major obstruction at every set of lights even if he doesn't have to stop

The trouble is with a long vehicle like that, the slower you go (sub 20mph) the bigger the risk of still crossing when the lights are red.

Approaching at 20 mph with a set of stop or go rules seems the best compromise to avoid stitching up the traffic
Could the timing of the amber lights be tweaked to the maximum legal tolerance on routes with these buses ?
JP1978
QUOTE (jacob30 @ Wed, 22 May 2013 - 21:44) *
Hi.
I'm a driver of bendy bus. My vehicle is 18m long. I'm always reduce my speed before lights when approaching on late green. Usually doing 20 mph, however sometimes I'm only a few meters from line when lights change to amber. I can put foot on brake but as effect of that some of my passengers may fell on the floor. If i carry on about half of the bus passing line and other half is behind when lights change to red. Should I be fined when catch by red cam. What do U think about this situation?


Excellent advice in previous threads but maybe enquire of your employer about the CCTV that is hopefully used on your bus.

Find out how long its kept for, highlight your fears and find out if its accessible to drivers to defend such an instance. Some neanderthals who process such 'offences' just see black or white and wont understand the difficulties a driver of such a vehicle encounters.
Johnxxx
QUOTE (Gan @ Wed, 22 May 2013 - 22:55) *
If the red cameras don't activate until the red has been on for two seconds ...

Two seconds is the maximum possible delay, many red light cameras are only delayed by 0.5 or 1 second - mainly on "high speed" roads (speed limit >35mph). There is no specific delay or guidance on 30mph roads.
QUOTE
It would make sense if bendy-buses had transponders to stop lights changing when they're within 20m or so

I don't know where the OP is located but in the greater london area there are special sensors in the road ahead of the lights which are supposed to extend the green period if a "recognised" bus is approaching. I don't think that this is the same as for emergency vehicles - they seemed to rely on a sensor mounted on top of the traffic light post.
fedup2
I drive Artics and come across this problem often and no matter what you do your going to end up with the rear going through reds no matter how hard you try to avoid it especially on very short cycled lights.





roythebus
Me and mrs bus were sitting behind an artic one day at a green filter light on the A217. By the time the tractor unit had moved away, the light had changed to amber then red. By the time the rear of the trailer went past the red light, the camera must have flashed about 6 times taking pictures of the side of the trailer! the phase simply wasn't long enough for a long heavy vehicle to pass fully on green.
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