I got a speeding ticket doing 39 in a 30 zone.

I sent back the form asking the police to provide the last time the camera was calibrated and also a picture of the driver in my car.

I got a letter back from the police with a certificate of calibration of the camera which is dated 14th August 2012 (8 months old), also with the following statement
“The photographic evidence has been reviewed, there I no driver identification. The photographic evidence is to prove the offense not to identify the driver; that is the responsibility of the user/keeper.”

So with an 8 month old calibration of the speed camera and the fact they have not got a picture of the driver – can I bypass this ticket in anyway ?
There are 3 people insured on the car (me / wife and my mum) the policy is fully comp.
Honestly I do not know who was driving !! surly as i have 3 named drivers I am legally allowed to give the car for use to two other people, one being the wife who does not need to sign it in or out !!
Can anyone help me respond to the new police letter ASAP.

Thanks in advance.
Gerome

Assuming you are the registered keeper, then the onus is on you to name the driver at the time of the offence. If the NiP was (as it should have been) received by you within 14 days, then it will be expected that 3 adults will be able to confirm who was at the wheel such a short time before. There is a defence of not knowing who the driver was, but this will only succeed if a dedicated effort has been made. this is a very high hurdle, if it were not, then everybody would say I don't know who was driving.

If found guilty of failing to name the driver the result will be 6 points, a high fine & VERY high insurance premiums for 5 years. I would suggest a meeting of the 3 potential drivers, a review of information that could help, who was working/shopping/taking kids to school etc.

At that speed a SAC will likely be offered, circa £90 but no points. My advice is to not go down the "I don't know" route, many have tried it, very few, apart from those with VERY deep pockets (eg the Hamiltons) have succeeded.

The calibration at 8 months old is fine.

That is true - you are not expected to keep a register. (Although is recommended for company vehicles)

However, now you have been made aware of an alleged offence you have to name the driver. If you cannot do so then you will almost certainly be issued a summons for failing to furnish details (sentence detailed above) and if you can show that you couldn't name the driver using reasonable diligence then you will not face punishment. This is difficult to do though and the bench will be very sceptical. The rear photo doesn't give you any 'bypass'.

What have you done since receiving the notice to establish the driver? The date, time and place should be a big help...

The last case I saw in court like this the keeper ended up £3500 lighter and 6 points heavier.

Good luck with that.

And what happened at the appeal against sentence? Or was that the cost of a 2nd rate lawyer who promised to get them off, I believe quite a few solicitors claim to have an almost 100% success rate defending such offences.

If the Hamiltons solicitor only ever defended the one case, then he could correctly state that as being true, other than that, I find it very unlikely



Is there any link to that case?

That was after the appeal.


As it was only concluded on Friday, no.

You're not obliged to keep records of who was driving, but having received the NIP you are required to use reasonable diligence to identify the driver, or to explain convincingly why you couldn't. This is not impossible, but it's not easy either, and courts will tend to start from the point of view that three grown adults should be able to remember car journeys they made a few days earlier if they put their minds to it. Saying "dunno, the photo doesn't show the driver" doesn't really cut it. What else have you done/could you do to work out who was driving? If there was a £1000 prize for correctly identifying the driver rather than a £1000 fine for failing to do so, what would you do?

Ultimately credibility is important in defending these cases, and I don't think that the fact that you asked for a calibration certificate helps you with that. A calibration certificate is obviously not going to help you work out who was driving, and if you come across as someone who is looking for any loophole to get off a speeding ticket rather than someone who genuinely tried and failed to work out who was driving, you're sunk.

Another thing to consider is that unless this was in Scotland, at 39 in a 30 the driver will probably be offered a speed awareness course (about £80, an afternoon off work and no points) if you can identify him/her. Defending an s172 charge on the other hand will likely cost more than the curse in terms of time and general hassle even if you win, and if you lose it's 6 points and fine, costs and increased insurance premiums which could easily run into 3 figures. So if you can identify the driver it's very much in your interests to do so.

If you still can't be sure of who was driving your options are
(1) decide between you who was most likely to be driving and name that person or
(2) reply giving the names of all three possible drivers and an outline of what you've done to establish which of you it was and why it didn't work. Expect to be summonsed for failure to identify, and be prepared to defend your position in court.

the police did not send me any pictures of anything !! they just sent the statment of which i typed into my post.

so i guess i just take the 3 points ?

Were you the driver?

They don't have to at this stage. They usually do mind under the 'to assist in the identification of the driver' ruse.

If the offence was not in Scotland, then the driver once named would most likely be offered a speed awareness course instead of points. So it really is to your advantage to work out who was driving.

As already stated, they do not have to & they have already informed you that as the camera (probably a Gatso) was facing the rear of your car, then the photo would not be of any help to you.

No, you return the S172 naming the driver, you previously stated you did not know who it was, so as I suggested earlier, get together, work out what you were all doing on that day & at that time & when you work out who it was, name them on the S172, the named driver will then receive their own NiP, which should be returned naming themselves as the driver, again, as previously mentioned, the driver will (should) be offered a course for that speed which will mean no points to the driver, unless the offence took place in Scotland.