Got forwarded to here from MSE so have Copy and pasted my post from there. Apparently here is a better place to be answering this question

Thanks guys
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Hi guys,
Walked out today to find my car was gone. It had been towed because of a parking violation, contravention 02 - waiting, loading or unloading when prohibited. My total fine was £180 which had to be paid to get my car back. £30 for the parking offence and £150 because it was towed.
My fault on the bad parking. I read the parking meter sign saying 9:30am-4:30pm mon-sat however I totally missed the sign saying no loading mon-sat 7am -6:30pm.
I don't often park on the main street so never thought to read the no loading sign, I didn't think it was relevant however I now know that it is. Although it's confusing me slightly as to when I CAN park there, paid or not because it says you have to pay between half 9 and half 4.. but there's no loading (except by vans/lorries - 9:30am-4pm) from 7am-6:30pm - the yellow line goes right through the parking bays.


I've read into how to appeal and on what grounds an appeal is valid. although I must admit it is all a slight confusing. Below are links to pictures I have taken where the offence took place.

Valid reason to appeal?

* There is no t-bar between the double yellow line and the yellow line. which according to 'ticketfighter' website it must have for a ticket to be vaild, however I was on a single yellow anyway so this might be useless?

* No kerb markings with either 1 or two stripes.

* there is a break in the yellow line.


The pictures below show the three of these.
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Opinions? Second opinions? all welcome please. Do I have a case? as the fine has been paid it would seem silly not to challange it as it can't increase any further, can it? Does my appeal have to be in writting? It seems like this could be a long drawn out process. Although obviously worth it.


Thanks for your help


P.s. I had to break up the links to the photos as I couldn't send links as a new memeber.
p.p.s the offence was in Scotland, if that makes any difference to anything

Can you post pictures showing all sides of the original PCN brittle,
conceal the vehicle registration, PCN number and any personal details
but leave the time, date and location visible.
Please don't deface the originals when redacting them, put pieces of
paper over the text or use photo editing software.

After that is done images of all the other documents are likely to
be needed.

Hosting the pictures offsite and linking them to your post so the photos are
visible in the thread helps people quickly assess them without having
to click on links.

The gap in the yellow line is unlikely to be enough, but here are the pictures
in case somebody spots something.








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There is lots of potential here but a lot of confusing info.

''parking meter'' - the times are interesting but we see no pics of signs and there are no parking 'bays' visible in pics??

missing kerb blips v helpful.

We don't know where this was.

We need ALL paperwork not just the PCN (priority)

We need more comprehensive pics

The removal fee seems high for out of London unless it's been increased recently.

You need to consult FAQs 'Read this first' on how to post images. we are only seeing the limited pics courtesy of qafka's intervention.

ok I will go back tomorrow and take more pics. as it's dark now
will upload pics of the parking ticket just now

The area is glasgow btw
parking bays are so badly wore away. they are there though and will get better pics tomorrow to show this.
the last pic of the roads shows one of the four corners of the parking bay that is there


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I can pick a few holes in that appeal document.

Reference to RTA 1991 is hardly helpful by its brevity and does not follow the wording of the law.

Near the end - timescale - ''been informed'' --- errrrrr --- is there a finish to that sentence? (again the law says more and actually makes sense.)

---

Some signs are combo with parking facility, waiting restrictions and loading restrictions on same post and some are separate as your opening post implied was the case where you were. Please confirm which.
we need pics of the one nearest you and any other nearby with a description of where exactly, in relation to the car.

- and kerb blips, as you said -- but get pics in context with a background to identify where in street.

If it's for a load ban then the sign needs to be accompanied by yellow blips on the kerb like this: http://www.ticketfighter.co.uk/images/cctnewham.jpg

Without them I'm pretty sure there's no contravention?

See are there any signs? And get pics.

MORE PICS:

more of the fadded/broken line


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NO LOADING sign



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PAY HERE AT MACHINE sign


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car parking space lines


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as for pics of the location, the pic of the broken line ( far away one pic) had to be cropped to remove my gf from the pic and has a whole shop front and door number in the picture



Thanks alot for the help so far. Will start writting my letter of appeal this evening, hopefully.



Totally forgot to add a possibly key point : the offence was at 8:34am. which means perhaps removes any problems with the signs bailing me out of this one?

Ok good. You will need a longer shot of a larger section of kerb to make your case that there are no kerb blips in the vicinity. You've only shown short sections with no perspective of surroundings so far.

The no loading sign. I'm not convinced is compliant with Regs but haven't checked.
I'm fairly sure it must be accompanied by a waiting restriction - yellow sign. There are certainly some combination signs on streetview with waiting and loading restricrtions and parking facility all ons same post as I said - but seemingly, from what you've shown, not where you parked.

We still don't know where exactly you parked? In making a case you are going to have to put all of this in context -- where you were, where each sign is, etc. as I explained. So far, the images individually achieve nothing. Paint the full picture.

The document errors I'll detail later.

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I'm bemused why you would interpret a permissive sign for parking during certain hours to mean you could park outside those hours -- but -- since you have been done for the yellow line with claimed loading restrictions it is not relevant to the case.

this is the first I've seen the thread since I last posted, I stayed at my GF's last night and took the photo's this morning
so that's why they aren't exactly as I should have took them. There is a better one of the location though that I had to crop to remove the GF from. more shall be taken.

basically I took the sign 9:30 - 4pm to mean after 4pm parking was free, untill 9:30am the following morning. As I said though, in the original post that, I accept is totally my fault for not paying attention to both signs, I don't often park in these areas.

with regards to the signs, just so I know.. when CAN you park there? I assume the no loading sign ( indicated with the yellow line) would have priority say over the parking bay? what it seems to be is from 7am-9:30 am you can't park there and again from 4pm-6:30pm? Which isn't what the sign says? is it? the reason I disregarded the loading sign was because to me it contradicted the parking sign so thought it had no relevence to parking totally my fault

Concentrating on the detail is good but an overview of the location is especially helpful so
can you pinpoint the actual parking place on StreetView, thanks.

Woodlands Road StreetView

There is a silhouette of a sign that appears to be twisted away from the road,
how does that relate to the parking bay and what does the sign say.

gafga I was right outside chillies 2nd or 3rd parking space up from the corner of willlowbank st. after that it's double yellows for a few cars length and then spaces again

I'm just on google earth right now, going to take a screenshot and point out where everything is and what everything says

Thanks for the quick replies

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Streetview of where I was

You're right because I believe it requires a yellow no waiting sign as well -- which is present, as I said, in other parts of the street -- but not seen or apparently present where you were.

There isn't one on the chillies stretch of road, after each turning there might be one, I don't know but they're under different times for parking so would it still be relevent?
the parking signs are different before and after the willowbank st turning. I believe it's 8-6 to the left of willowbank st and to the right is where I was parked, outside chillies. unsure of the loading times to the left, though could ask my GF to check on her way back from uni this afternoon if it helps? *
I automatically assumed that because there was different parking times before and after the chillies stretch they would all have their own set of signs with each restriction for that part of woodlands road


* looking on google earth there doesn't seem to be a yellow sign anywhere in the vicinity?

It does show one facing the shops, having been twisted as qafka said. Can you get a recent shot of that?

--
I'm no sign expert but I really think there needs to be a 'waiting' restriction signed. I can't find where the Regs say it but surely you can't have a loading restriction without a waiting restriction.

Contravention is 'waiting, loading or unloading.' You cant have been the latter two by virtue of the car being removed - hence must be the waiting the contravention refers to.
--- but there is no signed waiting restriction so no contravention is my thinking.

the sign that has been twisted to face the shops is the white no loading sign shown in post 8, the photo with the yellow van in the back ground.

This is the whole thing that I don't get. does loading mean waiting(parking)? If so in what language does it mean that?


from ticket fighters.
lord know what I'd have been unloading given the fact I'd been stopped there since the night before.





ok..

Implies no loading means no parking too, fair enough but no further forward to understanding when parking is allowed there if there's no loading between 7am-6pm

The definitive article is the Traffic Regulation Order for the location.

You obtain (ideally) or view -- via the Council. Anyone by right and don't bother mentioning the PCN.

ok, looking to get a draft done of the letter I shall be sending to them with my appeal.
These are the grounds I feel the appeal should be granted:


Is what I have this far, does it seem alright?

Wait for more opinions.

We also need to cover the doc flaws - which I'll explain when I get time.

Will do .
That'd be brilliant you're helping me an awful here, thanks Neil

Anyone else any insight into this ? Need to get my appeal in ASAP

Your draft appeal so far looks fine as a start but you do need some more input about the appeals document flaws, brittle. But you have time don't you? What date did you actually collect the car? you must count that as day one and then add 27 days, that's your time by which you must make sure they have your appeal.

Why? You have until early February?

I'm a bit busy this week - at Adjudication.

AIUI, a parking place is a parking place 24/7. It has its own restrictions and signs. The sign in that place means that outside of the restricted times on the sign this place may be used by stationary vehicles free of charge. If the council want to restrict its use outside of those times then they're required to sign it to that effect in the parking place. This means a yellow and black no waiting and or no loading sign and kerb blips.

20.26 Where waiting is prohibited at certain times
(e.g. peak hours) and limited waiting, or waiting by
specified classes of user, permitted at other times, a
white bay marking (diagram 1028.3, 1028.4, 1032 or
1033 as appropriate) should be used with a single
yellow line to diagram 1017 continued through the
bay. Where loading is prohibited, the kerb markings
to diagram 1019 or 1020.1 must also be used. An
upright sign to diagram 639.1B should be provided



I'd argue that the sign is incorrect, no restrictions apply outside the parking hours and that contravention did not occur.

HCA

I figured the 28 days was the case had to be sorted in this time? rather than just an appeal sent in? I didn't want to leave it too late so as that if they knocked back the first appeal i'd have time to reply?

Tbh, I've never had a parking ticket before and got two in the space of a month. first one I just paid though, so this is all new to me

Sorted? Do you mean resolved? - No - 28 days to submit your representations. That's until early Feb.

Your strongest point is 'no contravention' as HCA said, due to signage as we discussed.

I can just add bits about the duff docs at the weekend.

Yeh, the way I thought it worked was that you had 28 days to appeal, once an appeal had been lodged the remainder of the 28 days had been frozen untill a reply was sent out. no idea where I head that right enough.
I'm starting to write my appeal letter but also busy with work so plan to have it finished and sent by tuesday if anything else can be added to the no contravention then absolutely fantastic, if not it'll be ok. yourself and others have helped out more than you neeeded to