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FightBack Forums > Queries > Speeding and other Criminal Offences
_rich
In mid-January I was caught doing 35 in a 30.

I've since returned the NIP admitting I was driving and been offered a speed awareness course.

Some stalling and a bit of lethargy on their part and I find myself 3 weeks away from 6 months since the date of offence.

I'm currently awaiting the go ahead for booking my course. Given that so far, they've offered me at least 14 days to reply at each stage and it takes at least a further week for them to process anything I send them it looks as though we'll easily reach 6 months. So, two questions:

1. If they haven't submitted anything to a court, even though I've admitted fault returning the NIP, am I in the clear?
2. Are they likely to submit whatever papers they need to a court without coming back to me first to tell me that I've screwed up with the speed awareness course and must either accept the conditional offer or be taken to court? (i.e. can I know I'm in the clear at 6 months or will I have to wait yet further for a summons?)

Thanks in advance.
The Rookie
1/ No, they have 6 months to commence proceedings, that doesn't entail actually getting you into court
2/ Very much so yes, I'll bet the next you hear is a summons.

Simon
_rich
1. You say no, but it sounds like you agree?
2. They've said the next thing I'll receive is instructions on how to book a speed awareness course. If I receive these after the 6 month period will I be able to confirm if the proceedings have been started and what happens then if they have started but I book a course and attend it?

Thanks
The Rookie
1/ As you aren't yet 6 months from the offence (January + 6 months is the same day in July) they can still lay info, you can still be summonsed, so NO you are not in the clear.
2/ You can phone the court nearest to the location of the alleged offence and see if any information has been layed, they may lay the info and then 'activate' it if you don't take the course, cancel it if you do. I'm surprised yo have an offer of a course as many areas don't offer them once you get past about 4 months from the offence.

Simon
Gan
If you get a COFP you're home and dry. By the time 28 days are up for accepting, it's too late to lay the information. If they lay the info before 28 days are up it's abuse of process.

Rather than the hassle of the course and unravelling everything if they summons after you've paid for it - have you considered waiting to see if they summons? Plead guilty and ask for the fine/points that you would have had if they'd sent the normal COFP instead of messing you about with the course arrangements.
andy_foster
QUOTE (_rich @ Fri, 24 Jun 2011 - 22:27) *
2. They've said the next thing I'll receive is instructions on how to book a speed awareness course.


Depending on what exactly they have told you, it would seem to be an abuse of process to lay an information while an offer of a speed awareness is course is still open.

QUOTE
If I receive these after the 6 month period will I be able to confirm if the proceedings have been started and what happens then if they have started but I book a course and attend it?


If they were to offer you a course after laying an information, but before serving the summons, that would seem to be a very clear abuse of process.
The Rookie
QUOTE (andy_foster @ Fri, 24 Jun 2011 - 23:33) *
If they were to offer you a course after laying an information, but before serving the summons, that would seem to be a very clear abuse of process.

Would it? On what basis do you say that Andy, as I'm not conviced it would be.

Simon
andy_foster
When laying an information, the intention must be to serve the summons without undue delay. The decision to prosecute must have already been made. If the service of the summons is delayed while an offer of a course is made, the information would have been laid protectively, which is a huge abuse of process. Obviously, we can never know the actual intent, so what matters is that there would be a reasonable perception of bad faith.
_rich
UPDATE:

Today I've received a letter telling me I have 21 days to book a speed awareness course or the offer will be withdrawn. The end of the 21 day period is several days past 6 months from the date of offence.
Gan
How convenient

jobo
are you going to go along, might be interesting to go and disrupt it, sorry ask questions
desktop_demon
Well that should present the ticket office with a conundrum! There is a legitimate expectation to be allowed 21 days to respond. And that would then preclude a prosecution. I hope the person who thought that one though gets promotion.
Gan
QUOTE (jobo @ Thu, 30 Jun 2011 - 19:06) *
are you going to go along, might be interesting to go and disrupt it, sorry ask questions


That's would cost him.

Wouldn't it be more satisfying to call the scammers after 21 days and tell them why he isn't going to do the course - having checked, of course, that they didn't lay the information ?
_rich
QUOTE (Gan @ Thu, 30 Jun 2011 - 19:23) *
having checked, of course, that they didn't lay the information ?

How do I do this - look up courts in the local yellow pages for the camera partnership and just ring round?

(I wouldn't know where to turn up to to disrupt any course - I haven't selected a course location even yet).
jobo
QUOTE (Gan @ Thu, 30 Jun 2011 - 18:23) *
QUOTE (jobo @ Thu, 30 Jun 2011 - 19:06) *
are you going to go along, might be interesting to go and disrupt it, sorry ask questions


That's would cost him.





its a day out ! cost him more if he went to alton towers
Gan
If that's his idea of a day out, he may as well do the Advanced Excel course at my local Chamber of Commerce next month.

The food should be better and there's always a chance of getting off with one of the other delegates.

_rich
Two potential spanners in the works I've thought of:

1. I didn't receive the original NIP (moved house). So there was a delay in identifying the driver. From what I've read though that won't move the 6 month date just for a speeding offence.

2. They offered me the chance to book a course with them or elsewhere online. I replied (wish I'd kept a copy of what I wrote now) as I couldn't log into the online system (didn't contain a record of my driver's license number) to say I didn't want to book the course as I wanted to review the alternate venues. No monies sent. Their reply says 'You have requested to transfer your workshop...' when actually I don't believe I did. Does this mean they think I've accepted doing a course, forfeiting a conditional offer and so they will lay information before a court expecting me to book? As regards the 21 day period running out it just says that would render the workshop offer as invalid and the offer (it doesn't say conditional here) being withdrawn.

(I'd rather do a speed awareness course than an Excel one!)

Knew this wouldn't be simple. smile.gif
jobo
i dont really under stand number 2 ?

but as i understand it, you have an offer of a course in you hand that runs out in 21days after posting, they should not lay info whilst that offer stands, obviously your earlier intervention has encouraged them to extend the offer
_rich
FWIW, to complete this thread, I didn't take any further action and I never heard anything else from it.
Logician
Thanks very much for coming back to tell us what happened. It sounds as though it finally landed on the desk of someone who had a calendar!
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