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SleeperSy
NIP Details and Circumstances
What is the name of the Constabulary? -
Date of the offence: - July 2009
Date of the NIP: - 4 days after the offence
Date you received the NIP: - 6 days after the offence
Location of offence (exact location as it appears on the NIP: important): - East Smithfield W Of Thomas More St W/B E1 (2608)
Was the NIP addressed to you? - Yes
Was the NIP sent by first class post, second class or recorded delivery? - First
If your are not the Registered Keeper, what is your relationship to the vehicle? -
How many current points do you have? - 0
Provide a description of events (if you know what happened) telling us as much about the incident as possible - some things that may seem trivial to you may be important, so don't leave anything out. Please do not post personal details for obvious reasons - 36 mph in a 30. Gatso.
I replied to the NIP giving my name as the driver. Shortly afterwards I receved and letter (I think this was a COFP) and within that I was given the option to go on a speed awareness course and not receive points.

I opted to go on a speed awareness course. Unfortunately as I had been on a speed awareness course within the previous 2 years, I receved another letter stating that I could not take this option. Sorry I cant find this letter.

I today receved a summons to go to the magistares court on 9th Feb 2010. The summons was dated 22 December 2009, was sent second class and the postmark is 18th January 2010.

My question is this:

Do I have a case that they did not start proceedings against me within 6 months of the offence, as the offence took place in July 2009, and therefore they would have had to inform me of proceedings by 18th January 2010. Sending it second class on this day it would never of reached me in time. The only evidence I have is the enverlope which is franked 18-01-10 sidcup.

The summons is dated 12-09
Also enclosed witness statement from a PC with the gatso images dated 12-09
and a witness statement dated 10-09 staing that I admited to being the driver on the NIP.


I get the feeling that theses people have a back logue and are just getting them out on time. Or in my case a day or so late.

In the summons, if I plead not guilty, they will set a new date.

If I take it all the way whats the likely outcome points wise.


NIP Wizard Responses
These were the responses used by the Wizard to arrive at its recommendation:
Have you received a NIP? - Yes
Are you the Registered Keeper of the vehicle concerned (is your name and address on the V5/V5C)? - Yes
Did the first NIP arrive within 14 days? - Yes
Although you are the Registered Keeper, were you also the keeper of the vehicle concerned (the person normally responsible for it) at the time of the alleged offence? - Yes
Were you driving? - Yes
Which country did the alleged offence take place in? - England

NIP Wizard Recommendation
Based on these responses the Wizard suggested that this course of action should be considered:
  • The law requires you to provide the information requested in the Section 172 notice within the 28 day period, naming yourself as the driver. If you are considering obtaining formal legal advice, do so before returning the notice.

    You should note that there is nothing to be gained by responding any earlier than you have to at any stage of the process. You are likely to receive a Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty (COFP) and further reminder(s). If you want to continue the fight, you should ignore all correspondence from the police until you receive a summons. You need to understand from the outset that while you will receive much help and support from members on the forums, you will need to put time and effort into fighting your case and ultimately be prepared to stand up in court to defend yourself.
SUMMONS DOCUMENTS PART 1








southpaw82
The summons doesn't have to be served on you within six months of the offence, the police merely have to lay an information (apply for a summons) within six months. The summons can be served on you at any time after that.
desktop_demon
Hmmmm. Can the OP scan, "wash" and post the Gatso photos? or PM them to me if preferred. Its always nice to do a quick secondary check to make sure the photos are admissible in evidence at trial.

The summons can be sent "a short while" out of time - but it should not be excessively delayed for a summary trial. It is the "information" (date on the summons) that should be laid by teh police within 6 months of the alleged offence.

if the OP pleads NG to the summons then the hearing for plea will be held as stated (usually) but the OP need only send in a postal plea of NG (if desired). The usual course of events is for the bench to adjourn the trial to a later date, to allow parties to prepare their case.

If the OP is convicted the likely outcome, points wise, is 3 points (and a fine determined by the OP's level of income).

If the OP were to consider pleading not guilty what would be the basis of the OP's defence? While I admire all persons who are willing and able to defend their case I would not like the OP to be spurred on just to be convicted and gain a higher fine.

edit: there may just be an issue of "legitimate expectation" regarding the speed awareness course. if the OP was offered the course and accepted it then there may be some reasons why the OP should not be summonsed. I have not heard of this argument being tendered by any party but one must expect to be able to rely on the offers made and accepted by those in authority. So there may be some mileage is investigating if the OP should have been allowed to go on the course once offered. Whatever the OP does he should keep that letter offering the SAC.
SleeperSy
Thanks for the quick replies - im not too concerned about the amount of fine - just the points.

I will wash the gatso pics and post them tommorow - so you can have a look in the second pic, the number plate is hard to see. I always belived its impossibe for them to corroborate the gatso speed with white lines, as the car is of high ground clearance so how do you know how far past I was in each picture, only the complete ones ive past, which would make my speed 33



sy

Desktop

On the offer of a speed awareness course, it states that you cannot aplly if you have had one in the previous 2 years. I ottited to see this.

Sy

SUMMONS DOCUMENT PART 2




SleeperSy
EVIDENCE DOCUMENTS




JDMEngineer
do u have Gatso pics mate?
SleeperSy
Posted all the info I have now.

Edited hopefully properly - Thanks Fredd.

I want to plead not guilty.

In section 3 of the summons, it states that if I want the police wintesses to attend, I have to give notice within seven days of receiving the summons. I received the summons on 20 th Jan but it was dated in mid December.



If I request this and my case collapses in court - what will my cost be?



Is there anything in the papers a rye?

Thanks


Sy
Fredd
I'd just point out that you've left times, dates, reference and serial numbers scattered all over those documents. If your intention was to avoid your case being identified then you've failed dismally and should remove/edit them ASAP!
susie_mcg
By accepting the speed awareness course, albeit in error, has the OP not already admitted responsibility therefore a NG plea could be a waste of time?
oldstoat
If you have accepted a Speed Awareness course I presume you are not actually admitting the offence but opting to take a course to avoid a conviction in a court of law. I suppose theoretically you are still Not guilty as you have not actually been convicted
The Rookie
QUOTE (susie_mcg @ Thu, 21 Jan 2010 - 18:30) *
By accepting the speed awareness course, albeit in error, has the OP not already admitted responsibility therefore a NG plea could be a waste of time?

No, acceptance of either a SAC or an FPN is not an admission but merely disposes of the allegation.

Simon
SleeperSy
QUOTE (Fredd @ Thu, 21 Jan 2010 - 17:58) *
I'd just point out that you've left times, dates, reference and serial numbers scattered all over those documents. If your intention was to avoid your case being identified then you've failed dismally and should remove/edit them ASAP!



Thanks Fredd,

Most of my teachers and all of my family say I fail dimally in everything I do - so at least im consistant. Hence why I drive a Suzuki Vitara.

Edited now.

Sy
intendedpersecution
Err.. just a thought.. I notice the copyright sign, not to be reproduced etc..  but unless you have signed a waiver your car is your property and can't be used without consent?  Or have they thought of that??
Glacier2
It is against the law to reproduce the pictures. The Scamerships own the copyright.
srg
QUOTE (Glacier2 @ Sat, 23 Jan 2010 - 18:01) *
It is against the law to reproduce the pictures. The Scamerships own the copyright.


And Lincolnshire Scammers have certainly tried to enforce it before. Not sure about the met.
Teufel
are the photos copyright ? i dont think so

they are not artistic works - thye are automated repetitive photos for the purpose
of collecting vehicle images for the purpose of law enforcement

in any case

is there a defence under s45 CDP act ?

45 Parliamentary and judicial proceedings
(1) Copyright is not infringed by anything done for the purposes of parliamentary or judicial proceedings. .
(2) Copyright is not infringed by anything done for the purposes of reporting such proceedings; but this shall not be construed as authorising the copying of a work which is itself a published report of the proceedings.

would enforecment of a opyright restriction be a restriction of art6 HR ?

probably
SleeperSy
QUOTE (srg @ Sat, 23 Jan 2010 - 18:06) *
QUOTE (Glacier2 @ Sat, 23 Jan 2010 - 18:01) *
It is against the law to reproduce the pictures. The Scamerships own the copyright.


And Lincolnshire Scammers have certainly tried to enforce it before. Not sure about the met.


When you say they enforce it - do you mean that they will come on here, trace me and pursue me for breach of copyright?

Thanks

Sy.
SleeperSy
Also, does a Gatso have to be corroborated? I.e. the white lines confirm the Gatso radar speed? Is there any mileage in pursuing that the car only passed 3 full lines as its hard the judge from angles how close I was to the first and last? Shall I get the PC who certified the photos on the stand and ask him about trigonometry?





jeffreyarcher
There's nothing original, artistic, independent or creative in the photographs to copyright.
In any case, as jobo has pointed out, S45 CDPA exempts this use.
Unsurprisngly, Mr. Barker has not been pursued by Sussex scammers, notwithstanding their desire to suppress any evidence of their cameras' inaccuracies, and the photos are still there.
nemo
QUOTE (SleeperSy @ Sat, 23 Jan 2010 - 21:46) *
Also, does a Gatso have to be corroborated? I.e. the white lines confirm the Gatso radar speed?

The primary measurement of a Gatso Type 24 is required to be verified by means of a secondary check which must be accurate to +/-10%.

This check can be undertaken through the use of marks painted onto the road surface, or by using photogrammetry to determine the distance travelled. Note that the latter method does not require the presence of any timing marks.
Gan
How far apart are those lines ?

The car has passed no more than four of them in 0.5 seconds.

If they are five feet apart his speed is 40/44 x 30 = 27 mph
Rallyman72
QUOTE (Gan @ Sun, 24 Jan 2010 - 09:54) *
How far apart are those lines ?

The car has passed no more than four of them in 0.5 seconds.

If they are five feet apart his speed is 40/44 x 30 = 27 mph


Unfortunately the marks are not set a standard distance apart, it seems to vary from site to site. I recall reading elsewhere that they are often 6 feet apart (33mph) or 2 metres apart (39 mph). The OP really does need to go back and measure the lines remembering to take the measurement from centre of line to centre of line (or 'front' edge to 'front' edge) and taking care because of traffic. Using these measurements both secondary checks (feet or metres) are within 10% (just) of the alleged speed.
SleeperSy
QUOTE (nemo @ Sun, 24 Jan 2010 - 06:30) *
QUOTE (SleeperSy @ Sat, 23 Jan 2010 - 21:46) *
Also, does a Gatso have to be corroborated? I.e. the white lines confirm the Gatso radar speed?

The primary measurement of a Gatso Type 24 is required to be verified by means of a secondary check which must be accurate to +/-10%.

This check can be undertaken through the use of marks painted onto the road surface, or by using photogrammetry to determine the distance travelled. Note that the latter method does not require the presence of any timing marks.




QUOTE (Gan @ Sun, 24 Jan 2010 - 09:54) *
How far apart are those lines ?


The car has passed no more than four of them in 0.5 seconds.

If they are five feet apart his speed is 40/44 x 30 = 27 mph


Thanks guys. My flimsy case is this, please pull it apart, but I need some reason the take it all the way:

The marks are 2m apart -

The pics show that it can only be said that the vehicle passed 4 lines- the distance before the first line and after the 4th cannot be measured because we don’t know the angle of the camera, or the ground clearance of the vehicle (I mean how high the body-bumper is) which masks the lines. For example if the vehicle was directly over the 4th line, from the angle of the camera it would appear somewhat past the line.

So taking that we agree the vehicle can only be said to pass 4 lines, but the first one is the start of the distance measurement, so when I pass the second line I have traveled 2m and by the third I have travelled 4m and by the 4th 6m = 28mph, so my case is this, the gasto is wrong and can only be definitively corroborated to 28mph, which was what my speedo said when I saw the flashes.

Yes there is an appreciable distance before the first line, and a bit less after the 4th (probably adding up to 2m, making 35-6mph), but who can tell me what those distances are - will the PC who certified the Gatso pics be able to tell me on the stand? Will he be able to explain how high the Gatso is and what implications it has on the pics?

Thanks

Sy

Gan
Pity

Looking at the shadow of the back of your car I'd say that it almost the same distance past the line in both pictures.

The four "gaps" that you've covered would give you 36 mph. Don't think it's possible to argue it down to 3.5 "gaps" which would give you the 10% difference needed to throw out the evidence.
SleeperSy
QUOTE (Gan @ Sun, 24 Jan 2010 - 12:37) *
Pity

Looking at the shadow of the back of your car I'd say that it almost the same distance past the line in both pictures.

The four "gaps" that you've covered would give you 36 mph. Don't think it's possible to argue it down to 3.5 "gaps" which would give you the 10% difference needed to throw out the evidence.


Thanks for your reply.

But I did not cover 4 gaps, I covered 3 gaps, marked by 4 lines, one at each end of those 3 gaps. I agree the 4th gap could be made up the distance to the first and distance past the last white line in question, but I belive you cannot mesaure theses without additional data, and a good knowledge of trigonometry especally with a car with high ground clearance. Flimsy I know , I just want a thin thin case so that when I take it all the way I dont get fined too much when I lose as to show I had resonably grounds. I guess my only hope is they drop the case for some reason.

I may put a car on the last white line on a gatso site, make sure its exactly level with the line, take a low angle pic and see how it appears.
Mayhem007
The shadow is interesting, it appears to be formed by the tyres rather than the rear bumper. Given that the offence was July one could suppose tha the sun was directly above and slightly behind or perpendicular to the car.

My view on the photos are that you were definitely past the first marker and I believe your rear bumper was vertically in line, if not slightly before, the second marker, which is pretty damn close to being outside the 10% tolerance for a secondary check.

You may have some mileage in fighting the case. If you decide to plead not guilty then you will be entitled to request superior photos of the scene. They should have the technology to provide you with such evidence.

If not guilty is your intention, then you need to start work on your defence statement and disclosure of evidence request.

SleeperSy
Thanks for you reply - I do intend to plead not guilty - on the summons it states that if I require the providers of the evidence to attend court I need to do this wihin seven days of receiving the summons - how shall I word this, it says I must write to the procecuter - who is this ? Nikki Mason? shall I call to court the PC who confirmed the Gatso pics, or just argue against the pics and his statment at the hearing? Do I have to state at this stage why I want to call the witnesses?


Sy
Mayhem007
If you plead not guilty your court case will become a hearing, in which they will set a date for trial. The only way CPS can present evidence without a witness is by sending you a hearsay application, which you will then oppose, this then leaves them no alternative but to call witnesses.

You need to send a defence statement refuting the allegation that you were speeding. State in your defence statement that you reserve the right to amend or add to your statement as long as this does not contradict earlier statement).

When is the court date?

Gan
There's a large stone or scrap of litter in the bottom left hand corner of the picture.

Using it as the datum to match up and count the lines, I still reckon you've covered a distance equivalent to four gaps. In addition every fifth line is slightly longer than the others.
Rallyman72
QUOTE (Gan @ Sun, 24 Jan 2010 - 17:45) *
There's a large stone or scrap of litter in the bottom left hand corner of the picture.

Using it as the datum to match up and count the lines, I still reckon you've covered a distance equivalent to four gaps. In addition every fifth line is slightly longer than the others.

I'd agree - four gaps covered, at 2m gaps this is around 39mph. I still think you need to measure the gaps. If you look at the photo, the first photo shows the rear of the car roughly in line with the first short line after a long line. In the second photo the rear of the car has moved to the next long line. There are 5 gaps in this sequence between long lines so the car has moved by 4 gaps in my reckoning.
SleeperSy
QUOTE (Mayhem007 @ Sun, 24 Jan 2010 - 17:43) *
If you plead not guilty your court case will become a hearing, in which they will set a date for trial. The only way CPS can present evidence without a witness is by sending you a hearsay application, which you will then oppose, this then leaves them no alternative but to call witnesses.

You need to send a defence statement refuting the allegation that you were speeding. State in your defence statement that you reserve the right to amend or add to your statement as long as this does not contradict earlier statement).

When is the court date?


The court summons is for the 9th Feb, I only received it on the 20th January. In section 3 of the summons, it states if I want to plead not guilty I must complete the form and send to the court, and also if I want procecution winesses to attend, I must write to the procecuter within 7 days of receiving the summons - should I do this?



Thanks again

Sy
Mayhem007
At this stage you don't have to send the prosecutor anything. Just return the form to the justices' clerk. Your not obliged to inform the CPS of your intentions.
SleeperSy
Thanks Mayhem,

I doubt Ill win this one, but I dont like being an easy target.

Years ago I paid a fixed penalty in lose 1p pieces by post - it cost me £18 to post!!!!!- when they got it they got one of their baristers to send me a letter stating it was not legal tender in that form and to pick the box up. I went to their office and insisted they counted it in front of me as I could not be sure they had not taken some out, to which they refused, so I left it there. I then researched the law and found out you can pay any amount in £1s, so I sent them sixty of them. I left the 1 p's to fester there. Not worried abount the monie, just like to make people work for it. Im not such an easy target.

SleeperSy
QUOTE (Mayhem007 @ Sun, 24 Jan 2010 - 18:50) *
At this stage you don't have to send the prosecutor anything. Just return the form to the justices' clerk. Your not obliged to inform the CPS of your intentions.



HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ok, I pleaded not guilty - now have a revised hearing date. How do I inform the CPS that I want to cross examine their wintnesses, and ask questions about the photos, and the camera system???

The Rookie
What witnes do you want to X-examine? The gatos either shows you speeding or not, there is no witness to the offence.

You need to submit a compliant defence statement explaining why you believe you were not speeding, it is then upto them to porve the case beyond reasonable doubt.

Simon
SleeperSy
Rookie

I was sent two witness statements.

1. A statement from a police administrator stating that they recieved my nip reply stating I was driving.

2. A statement from a desk PC stating that the pitures prove I was speeding in his opinion.


Therefore I want to get witness 2 on the stand and ask lots of questions.


As stated above by Mayhem, can they use the statements without the witnesses present if I object?

Sy
The Rookie
Indeed, so you say you believe you weren't speeding, its up to the prosecution to prove you were, the photo's are the evidence, you don't dispute your NIP return (?) so no point calling the admin guy, and if they want to prove it against your contesting it they will choose to bring the witness or not, you would be in a better position if they did not.

Simon
SleeperSy
QUOTE (Mayhem007 @ Sun, 24 Jan 2010 - 17:43) *
If you plead not guilty your court case will become a hearing, in which they will set a date for trial. The only way CPS can present evidence without a witness is by sending you a hearsay application, which you will then oppose, this then leaves them no alternative but to call witnesses.

You need to send a defence statement refuting the allegation that you were speeding. State in your defence statement that you reserve the right to amend or add to your statement as long as this does not contradict earlier statement).

When is the court date?



I havent recived a hearsay aplication as mentioned above - is this normal?

Many Thanks,

Sy
SleeperSy
Sleepersy 1 Scammers 0


I won the case, or its was dismissed yippe!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.


I attended the hearing last week. I had written to the scammers after they sent a copy of the statements/evidence they were going to present , and simply stated, "I do not accept your hearsay evidence, please ensure all witness of any evidence you intend to rely on attend the hearing, so I can cross examine them"


I got to the court at 2pm, at 3ish, the clerk of the court asked me and the CPS to enter the court before the magistrates to discuss what the issues are going to be.

The CPS, got the file out and started to state what I was accused of. I interupted him at a pause, and said, "with all due respect, I do not acceppt your hearsay evidence, and I infomed the Metropolitan Police by letter of this. Here is the letter, and the recorded delivery receipt."

The CPS looked at the letter and receipt, and to my suprise, the clerk of the court, nodded at me aprovingly, and smiled. The CPS guy said "no evidence", and the Clerk of the Court dismissed the case.

I then asked "What about my costs"

The Clerk of the Court replied "Your Costs will be paid from the Public Purse - you are free to go"


So thank you thank you thank you to all of those who give their free time to the website and to the good of justice. What ever I get in costs will be donated to this site in addition to my other contributions.


One more question [untill they try and scam me again]

Do I have to claim costs, or do I get sent an arbutary amount.


Thanking you all


Kind Regards


Sleepersy
nemo
QUOTE (SleeperSy @ Wed, 14 Apr 2010 - 20:07) *
I won the case..

Very well done.. thumbsup.gif

QUOTE (SleeperSy @ Wed, 14 Apr 2010 - 20:07) *
Do I have to claim costs, or do I get sent an arbutary amount.

You will need to submit a claim.

Photocopying, printing, mileage, parking and [possibly] a small amount of subsistence (depending on how long you were at court) should be straightforward to reclaim.

Claiming for lost earnings or an hourly rate as a litigant in person is unlikely to be successful.
bama
Well done !
you need to get the claim in within 14 days of the decision IIRC.

SleeperSy
Thanks Bama,

Do you know where/who do i claim from?.


Regards


Sleepersy
nemo
QUOTE (SleeperSy @ Wed, 14 Apr 2010 - 20:45) *
Do you know where/who do i claim from?.

Information here.
SleeperSy
Thanks Nemo
SleeperSy
Update.

I took Nemos advice regading me claiming cost and read through the HMCS website. Before I could claim I needed a Cost Order from the Magistrates Court.

I requested it in April [Recorded delivery], it arrived today.

I can now put my claim in for cost to the National Taxing Team. l will do this on Monday, you have to claim cost withing 3 months, so Im still in time. [If I was out of time I would of blamed the magistrate court]

will follow the guidelines on the HMCS website re cost but I will push the boundaries in every respect. Aparently there is no formal appeal process if they dis allow some or all of my claimed costs, so we will see. I guess I could claim that having no appeals process re rejected claims affects my human rights.

What ever I get in cost, I will double and donate to this site.

Regards


SleeperSy
henrik777
QUOTE (SleeperSy @ Sat, 5 Jun 2010 - 17:27) *
Update.

I took Nemos advice regading me claiming cost and read through the HMCS website. Before I could claim I needed a Cost Order from the Magistrates Court.

I requested it in April [Recorded delivery], it arrived today.

I can now put my claim in for cost to the National Taxing Team. l will do this on Monday, you have to claim cost withing 3 months, so Im still in time. [If I was out of time I would of blamed the magistrate court]

will follow the guidelines on the HMCS website re cost but I will push the boundaries in every respect. Aparently there is no formal appeal process if they dis allow some or all of my claimed costs, so we will see. I guess I could claim that having no appeals process re rejected claims affects my human rights.

What ever I get in cost, I will double and donate to this site.

Regards


SleeperSy



Try and claim your donations since you wouldn't have paid if it wasn't for the case. wink.gif

Cheers
SleeperSy
On the 7th April I won my 36 in a 30 Gatso, on the basis that I turned the numbers game back on the scammers - by this I mean, I called their bluff and insisted that any evidence they wanted to rely on, they had to have the witnesses in court. Fortunately they did not show (as it’s not a viable scam for them), I was found not guilty and awarded cost from Central Funds. Im not suggesting that everyone takes this route - it was a risk I was prepared to take as I doubt I would of won if they had showed up and probably ended up worse off.

Here is the case:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showto...&pid=460761

I have started a new thread just to deal with my cost claim -hope this is okay with the Mods .

At the hearing I was told I could claim costs from Central Funds. I left the hearing with no paperwork as such, so after consulting Pepipoo I wrote the magistrates court requesting my "Costs Order". They did not reply until 4th June - nearly 2 months later - however I had 3 months to make a claim, so no major worries there.

Here is the letter I received from the Magistrates Court.



As you can see the magistrates court was fully aware that I am a litigant in person - have issued an order and advised me to claim from the National Taxing Office.


And here is the Defence Costs Order




You will see that the Costs Order states that my claim must go to the National Taxing Team.




I duly completed the correct form and claimed for my preparation time at £9.25 hr - travelling - and loss of earnings - I also claimed for a McKenzie friend which I took with me to the court.

The total claim was around £280 - Im not worried too much about my costs - just want to stop their scamming culture.

I recently got a reply from the National Taxing Team summarily dismissing my claim -
See This:



Also attached was a photocopy of a previous correspondence the National Taxing Office has had with a Costs Judge.






So the Magistrates Court told me to claim from the Taxing Office and the Taxing Office told me my claim is not valid save travelling expenses which I should claim from the Magistrates Court.

Are they affecting my Human Rights biggrin.gif ?


Any Ideas - comments?

Nemo -Helppppppppppppppppppppp!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Regards


Sy

[size="3"][/size]
The Rookie
You cannot claim preperation costs for your defendce (Case law is Edgar)

You should be able to claim travel costs, loss of earnings (if you were also a witness, but only if AIUI) upto £50, subsistance (if relevant) and other similar out of pocket costs.

Not sure about travel costs having to go through mags court or not.

Simon
nemo
QUOTE (SleeperSy @ Mon, 16 Aug 2010 - 13:38) *
So the Magistrates Court told me to claim from the Taxing Office and the Taxing Office told me my claim is not valid save travelling expenses which I should claim from the Magistrates Court.

Any Ideas - comments?

Nemo -Helppppppppppppppppppppp!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Their response is as suspected - see my post from your original thread:

QUOTE (nemo @ Wed, 14 Apr 2010 - 20:15) *
Photocopying, printing, mileage, parking and [possibly] a small amount of subsistence (depending on how long you were at court) should be straightforward to reclaim.

Claiming for lost earnings or an hourly rate as a litigant in person is unlikely to be successful.




QUOTE (SleeperSy @ Mon, 16 Aug 2010 - 13:38) *
I have started a new thread just to deal with my cost claim -hope this is okay with the Mods .

On the grounds that I had instant reason to reference that thread, old and new have now been merged.. wink.gif
SleeperSy
Thanks Nemo,

But the Order from the Court states you must claim from the taxing office -if you claim from the court it will be rejected- and the taxing office have told me to claim from the Court?


Sy
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