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205GTI
NIP Details and Circumstances
What is the name of the Constabulary? -
Date of the offence: - October 2009
Date of the NIP: - 11 days after the offence
Date you received the NIP: - 16 days after the offence
Location of offence (exact location as it appears on the NIP: important): - CAR PARK OF OUTSIDE CAFE/SHOP, MAIN ROAD, HATHERSAGE
Was the NIP addressed to you? - Yes
Was the NIP sent by first class post, second class or recorded delivery? - First
If your are not the Registered Keeper, what is your relationship to the vehicle? -
How many current points do you have? - 0
Provide a description of events (if you know what happened) telling us as much about the incident as possible - some things that may seem trivial to you may be important, so don't leave anything out. Please do not post personal details for obvious reasons - I was driving out of a private car park when I caught the bumper of another vehicle with my car at a very low speed. I could not see any damage to the other vehicle so I drove off.

I have since received a NIP for Driving without due care and Failure to stop at, or report an accident.


NIP Wizard Responses
These were the responses used by the Wizard to arrive at its recommendation:
Have you received a NIP? - Yes
Are you the Registered Keeper of the vehicle concerned (is your name and address on the V5/V5C)? - Yes
Did the first NIP arrive within 14 days? - No
Was there a valid reason for the NIP's late arrival? - Yes
Although you are the Registered Keeper, were you also the keeper of the vehicle concerned (the person normally responsible for it) at the time of the alleged offence? - Yes
Were you driving? - Yes
Which country did the alleged offence take place in? - England

NIP Wizard Recommendation
Based on these responses the Wizard suggested that this course of action should be considered:
  • The law requires you to provide the information requested in the Section 172 notice within the 28 day period, naming yourself as the driver. If you are considering obtaining formal legal advice, do so before returning the notice.

    You should note that there is nothing to be gained by responding any earlier than you have to at any stage of the process. You are likely to receive a Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty (COFP) and further reminder(s). If you want to continue the fight, you should ignore all correspondence from the police until you receive a summons. You need to understand from the outset that while you will receive much help and support from members on the forums, you will need to put time and effort into fighting your case and ultimately be prepared to stand up in court to defend yourself.

Generated by the PePiPoo NIP Wizard v3.3.2: Mon, 02 Nov 2009 18:45:57 +0000
205GTI
Hi,

I'm after some advice on the above NIP. I was leaving a private car park when I caught another vehicle's bumper with my car. As I couldn't see any damage I drove off and later received a NIP.

Just wondering what the likely outcome is - points / fine?

Is there an easy way to resolve this as I don't really want to be called in for an interview if I can help it.

Any help would be much appreciated.
cshm37
QUOTE (205GTI @ Mon, 2 Nov 2009 - 19:01) *
Hi,

I'm after some advice on the above NIP. I was leaving a private car park when I caught another vehicle's bumper with my car. As I couldn't see any damage I drove off and later received a NIP.

Just wondering what the likely outcome is - points / fine?

Is there an easy way to resolve this as I don't really want to be called in for an interview if I can help it.

Any help would be much appreciated.


Well it is an offence under s 170(4) of the Road Traffic Act.

Up to 6 months imprisonment and/or fine. Discretionary Ban.

That is unlikely though.

The key point is whether damage was caused? If none, then can you prove it?

One of the others on here will no doubts come along and tell you the likely punishment.
davepoth
Interesting with the date there...are the days from the date of the offence correct?

As to the offence, you did have an accident caused by (unless the car you hit was blocking the exit) not paying full attention, and you didn't report the accident or give your details to the person you hit. IMO unless you can find a technical problem it might be a bit of a sticky wicket.
cabbyman
Others will give you more detail, but you could have an issue with the date you received the NIP.

Do you still have the envelope?
Do you have a witness to the date of receipt?

The NIP is generally required to be served within 14 days.
205GTI
I guess they will claim the delay was due to the postal strike (I assume they can use this as a valid reason for the delay)

If I admit to the accident and offer to pay for the repair of the other vehicle is this likely to help avoid points or a fine?

Or does that make my position worse?
2020Hindsight
It is virtually impossible to say - you don't want to admit the offence. Carefully couched terms might help. If you weren't aware of any damage then that is valid defence to charge, however saying that you'd be happy to pay for any non-apparent damage might sway a friendly officer.
All depends on whether they want to close the complaint quickly or get a file before court
cshm37
QUOTE (2020Hindsight @ Mon, 2 Nov 2009 - 20:02) *
It is virtually impossible to say - you don't want to admit the offence. Carefully couched terms might help. If you weren't aware of any damage then that is valid defence to charge, however saying that you'd be happy to pay for any non-apparent damage might sway a friendly officer.
All depends on whether they want to close the complaint quickly or get a file before court


I think this is one occasion that I wouldn't cough for anything! Try working on the 'no damage' angle first.

As far as I am aware though, even if the NIP was delayed by the postal strike, then it is tough; it is unenforceable at law.

That won't however protect you from liability to pay for any damage caused (if that's the case), but it would save you alot of hassle from criminal proceedings!

Anyone here know for certain if a delayed NIP is a duff?
2020Hindsight

It has been mentioned elsewhere that if the offence is an accident, rather than a speeding offence the 14 day rule on NIPs doesn't apply to this case
cshm37
QUOTE (2020Hindsight @ Mon, 2 Nov 2009 - 20:15) *
It has been mentioned elsewhere that if the offence is an accident, rather than a speeding offence the 14 day rule on NIPs doesn't apply to this case


oops yes! forgot that bit icon_redface.gif
Hotel Oscar 87
QUOTE (2020Hindsight @ Mon, 2 Nov 2009 - 20:15) *
It has been mentioned elsewhere that if the offence is an accident, rather than a speeding offence the 14 day rule on NIPs doesn't apply to this case

Almost. The requirement that NIP's be served (for relevant offences) does not apply where an accident occurs at the time or immediate after the alleged offence is committed - RTOA 1988 s. 2(1).
205GTI
QUOTE (Hotel Oscar 87 @ Mon, 2 Nov 2009 - 20:27) *
QUOTE (2020Hindsight @ Mon, 2 Nov 2009 - 20:15) *
It has been mentioned elsewhere that if the offence is an accident, rather than a speeding offence the 14 day rule on NIPs doesn't apply to this case

Almost. The requirement that NIP's be served (for relevant offences) does not apply where an accident occurs at the time or immediate after the alleged offence is committed - RTOA 1988 s. 2(1).



Does this mean that it still applies then?

What's the best course of action? Just return the NIP with driver details and take it from there?

Thanks for the replies so far.
andy_foster
It may well be that the owner of the other car is seeking to claim (either legitimately or fraudulently) for damage caused and therefore requires your details.

I'd suggest returning the s. 172 response form and seeing what happens.
Fleagle
You might like to add "It is alleged that" to your description of events (it reads like you are acknowledging it happened - not ideal). It's quite possible for the police to read this forum without a logon and then to work out who you are from your post wink.gif .

On the brighter side, a driver personally witnessed by myself damaging my car with theirs (including eye contact) then driving off (with me ranting at them as they did so) was not prosecuted as this "wouldn't be in the public interest" although I got their insurance details afterwards. This happened in the greater manchester police area, for information.

You may get a similar result, which is policy for incidents in private car parks for some forces.

Like Andy Foster says, return the S.172 and see what they conjure up next...
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