After having mixed results fighting lasers its time to take a look at the parking gits.....

Last August 2007 I was in Westminster and had to do a u turn in a fairly tight road on my bike... whilst waiting for a car to pass it seems according to the Westminster website that I got snapped........

Now having looked at these recently I am on my bike, the engine is running, I am about a foot from the yellows, there are two pictures available at only a second apart.
No PCN was stuck to the bike at the time for obvious reasons and I responded to a communication from them along the lines of are you serious please provide proof.
From that point on I heard nothing at all
Until in October 2008 I get a charming letter from some mob called Philips saying blah blah give us money.
So I call them and say surely there is some mistake not only do I not you 185 quid this did not happen they say tough titty take it up with Westminster
So having been stitched up by writing to Westminster before I put it all in writing on their online form explaining the whole thing
Phillips then pop a note through the door saying we came round for a friendly chat and by the way that 185 is now £434
So I call Phillips again and they say take it up with Westminster
A response from Westminster comes back saying too much time has passed not interested
So I go back to the online form and say look not sure if you missed the key points but 1 I wrote to you a year + ago and you did nothing, 2 The contravention never happened because x y and z and by the way the pictures I have seen online are 1 second apart, 3 I explain that what is happening is akin to me writing to them saying hi - you owe me £100, them saying no I don't and me saying too bad son and passing it on to debt collection.
I then call Phillips and say look here's the latest and I'm waiting to hear from Westminster, they thanks .....
And then today another note through the door saying hi you £434 is now £668


So my questions are-
1 How are Phillips calculating these numbers
2 How do I get Westminster to see sense and recognise their over enthusiastic ticketers actions
3 How do I get Philips to stop ratcheting up their charges because it seems that every time I call them to update them it just looks like they remember to ignore what I've told them and escalate some more.

I'm getting pretty nervous about this and any thoughts, suggestions or advice that anyone wants to share would be great

Presumably Philips is a firm of bailiffs?

It would seem somehow you've been issued a PCN and either not received or ignored it. Do you have any paperwork you can scan here? If you haven't received anything, I suggest you contact the Northampton County Court theiving centre that deals with PCNs and tell them what has happened. You can get the case droppped, I forget the legal term for it, but it will cost you about £85 now I think.

Write to Westminster, by recorded delivery, asking them for all the paperwork, then maybe we can help you some more.

I agree, they are all over-zealous when it comes to issuing tickets to anything that stops. There's a similar thread running about a biker who stopped to make safety adjustments to his clothing and got a ticket!

Or is this another case of Westminster using a debt collector but not applying for an Order for Recovery (thus denying the respondent a chance to get it cancelled)?

I didn't get a ticket at the time as I was still for only seconds as I made to do the u-turn. It was all well over a year ago and I'm guessing that my letter in October to Westminster must have been in response to something they sent me. However they didn't respond to it and as it was so patently obvious that they were taking the piss I left it at that, the next thing in October this year I get a letter from Phillips who say they are bailiffs saying its £185 and so on as each time I call them to explain it seems only to encourage them to up the charge - now to £670.

I have since written twice to Westminster using their online form as above and I am still awaiting a reply to to it.

I don't know if they are actually acting though as ballifs or collections as nothing in the 3 Phillips letters indicates though on reading their letter they don't make this clear though the language is all very threatening. And this despite keeping them informed every step of the way from their first communication.

No surprises here then!!!!

Can't see them mentioning a warrant anywhere? Did I miss it?

If acting as DCA then all the charges are bollox aren't they?

BTW mate - when contacting Westminster it is highly likely you have been talking to Phillips anyway! LOL - long story.

Contact Sheila at 'bailiffadviceonline' cos she knows absolutely everything about this westminster scam.

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isn't Westminster (maybe others..) avoiding filing at TEC to reduce their costs.
Am sur ether are threads/posts about this on here.

As such the bailiff fee's have to be bollocks don't they.
Sheilla will know about this.
I would also ring the TEC to see if they have anything on file for this case. Tell them about the Bailiff's letters and charges, ask them for a written response (e-mail and or postal).

Yep to all five points made by bama.

Thing that strikes me is the comment from OP about whether they are bailiff or DCA and the fact that not surprisingly as i suspected their letterheads are clearly misleading if acting as DCA.

they are actually operating a full service for Westminster - issuing Charge Certs etc. and on one number at least - i believe - answer the phone as Westminster Council. ! It's outrageous.

get hold of sheila mate - she really does know everything.

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MMMMM I see.....

May I could just send Westminster and Philips this clip - http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TM6s9WQP84w from Johnny Dangerously

So if I am reading you all right -

I should
1 Call the TEC and ask them for any and all documents relating to this
2 Call Philips and say have you a warrant, if not then give them notice that their reps are not welcome on my property?
3 Bit green here - whats the standing on the fees being bollox?

Thanks all

Yes to number one for now and then check your inbox - you have PM

Hi Neil

Done Number 1 and followed the instructions in the inbox - many thanks for that.

Will PM you the outcomes now.

Thanks again

So did TEC say there is a warrant or not?

Sorry for not coming back sooner but it all got a little frantic....

it seemed that a warrant was issued - gulp
worse lots of lovely text messages coming saying that any moment now we will assign this to a bailiff
so PE2 and PE3 duly completed witnessed and e-mailed off to the TEC yesterday
who today confirmed that all is in order and have e-mailed Westminster asking them to suspend the action

So, so far so good (I think) though Philips claim not to have received word from Westminster. So thats a job for the morning.

Though am tempted to put them on notice that should their representatives turn up at my property that I would consider it trespass.

On the downside did receive a note from them for a PCN in September for 120 which had slipped my mind

What do you mean by a note?

Along the lines of psuedo legalise pay up or suffer at our hands type of thing. Though interesting enough it offered 7 days to pay from date of letter which despite being sent 1st class took 6 days to arrive.

Have you still got it?

Yes - why do you ask?

Well, you are saying that you haven't recieved certain documents. Then you say that you recieved a document that you forgot to mention. It would help people here if they know exactly what that document was.

Sounds like a separate PCN - if so start a separate thread. Note sounds like another Phillips one acting as DCA.

Would need to see it.

Got you yes. Sorry.

This is actually two different PCNs.
One which is the main bulk of the thread which describes my tangles with a company called Philips who work on behalf of Westminster, the other refers to another PCN also in Westminster which I have been written to by the same company and which I may have to pay.

It sounds like as it is still at £120 that Phillips are trying to collect on a charge cert without a warrant.

Yes that's correct.
Presumably that is correct?
And that the stickiness comes when they try to apply charges for trying to collect the maximum PCN amount along with their own charges without a warrant?

Westminister (maybe others) are cutting the TEC out to try and save money (no TEC fees, about 400k a yeat for Westminister) so Phillips taking the financial risk by going the DCA route. am sure there are threads about this. AIUI if the Philips/DCA route doesn't pan out then they can still then issue paper through the TEC - provided it hasn't been too long since the event I suppose.