Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: NIP - driver doesn't live in this country, my car
FightBack Forums > Queries > Speeding and other Criminal Offences
cbcgt
Hi, someone who doesn't live in this country but who is registered as British and has a UK licences got a speeding ticket over Christmas while visiting and driving my car.

What should I put on the NIP? The address of his UK licence - he come back to that a few times a year, or his address abroad?

Thanks
7159keith
Personally I would put UK address as the driver overseas route may be seen as an attempt to avoid the issue.

It would also be a good idea to let your friend know of this as he is likely to be tried in his abscence for S172 (6 points and a fine) if he is not around to respond.
Pete D
How do you know it was your friend not you. Is your friend insured to drive the vehicle. I would supply the the UK address and a contact address ONLY if you are sure it was not you driving. Pete D

cbcgt
was defn not me as he had the car that day and I was working. Yes he is comprehensively insured to drive the vehicle in the UK. You say supply the UK address and contact address, should I give his name too? and should I give UK contact address or foreign contact address?
thanks
nemo
QUOTE (cbcgt @ Fri, 25 Jan 2008 - 13:41) *
You say supply the UK address and contact address, should I give his name too? and should I give UK contact address or foreign contact address?

You should provide his name, his permanent address (ie his address abroad) and any other information requested on the form which you are able to provide.

You should also expect a follow up from the police - chances are they will seek to prove that your nomination of an overseas driver was a truthful one..
Pete D
'Yes he is comprehensively insured to drive the vehicle in the UK'. Is that on your policy or does he have his own UK comp policy that allow him to drive other cars. Are yo absolutely sure it was him driving ??. If so then provide all his details. Pete D
cbcgt
Yes, 100% it was him driving it was in an area where his parents live and he was visiting them that day, unless someone stole the vehicle while he was visiting and then brought it back I suppose??
His is named on my policy as insured to drive comprehensively.
thanks
Mr Rusty
Usually, attempts to name drivers based abroad is seen immediately as an attempt at perverting the course of justice, and the first tactic the scamerati use is to try and show that the other driver was not insured and you would then be aiding the offence of driving whilst uninsured. In this case, you state that the driver is named on your insurance. I think this is the clincher, and proves that the other driver really does exist.

Personally I would do exactly as nemo describes and enter his name, permanent address (abroad if this is the case), and any other information. I think I would also attach a copy of your insurance certificate and a note to show that the driver was correctly insured.

Once you have done this you have fulfilled your obligations to provide information and should not have any further hassle. Make sure you keep copies of all correspondence just in case.

Pete D
OK, then you appear to be in the clear. Send the name address and contact details. A copy of the insurance cert is a good idea so it gives you less hassle. Pete D
cbcgt
Thanks. Will they send the NIP abroad to him? His english is not great so I am worried he will not respond or not know how to fill the form in, will they then give him points and a fine by default?

He also travels a lot so i think he is away on business at the moment and may not be back at his home address for a month or so. Will he have to ultimately sign the NIP?
bama
inform them politely of the languge they should use in their contact with him maybe ? you never know they may actually do it.
Barking Mad
QUOTE (cbcgt @ Sat, 26 Jan 2008 - 17:02) *
Thanks. Will they send the NIP abroad to him? His english is not great so I am worried he will not respond or not know how to fill the form in, will they then give him points and a fine by default?

He also travels a lot so i think he is away on business at the moment and may not be back at his home address for a month or so. Will he have to ultimately sign the NIP?


The British Authorities' powers exist up to the boundries of the 12 mile limit. Beyond the UK's territorial waters, our judiciary can't do anything to force anyone to do something they decide they won't.

The Rookie
Th relevance of that being when he returns......

Or are you just living up to your forum name as usual - still always good for a giggle!

Simon
nemo
QUOTE (cbcgt @ Sat, 26 Jan 2008 - 17:02) *
Will they send the NIP abroad to him?

Maybe, probably. Who knows ?

QUOTE (cbcgt @ Sat, 26 Jan 2008 - 17:02) *
will they then give him points and a fine by default?

If he receives a valid request to provide driver details and fails to do so then, as a UK citizen and licence holder, he could be tried, convicted and have 6 points applied in his absence.

He could also find himself being chased for non-payment of fines upon his return to the UK.

QUOTE (cbcgt @ Sat, 26 Jan 2008 - 17:02) *
Will he have to ultimately sign the NIP?

It is a lawful requirement for the s.172 response to be signed.
Barking Mad
If a person is located elsewhere in the world other than the United Kingdom, its dependencies and territorial waters, can someone tell me how JURESTICTION orks with regard to receiving a NIP.

Yes I am British and I have a UK licence - but if I were living in France and my mother's car (with me driving it) had been observed exceeding the speed limit, they'd nipped her her in Blighty, then she'd grassed me in France; can someone please explain how I would be capable of committing a criminal offence in the UK whilst not actually being in the country?!?!?!?!?!

The UK's laws stop 12 miles beyond our shores, or is someone going to tell me we're off on a jolly to deepest, darkest ____________ (you can fill in the blanks yourself) for TV licence evasion?

How can someone who is not in the UK be forced to comply with UK legislation whilst not here?
Barney1
I think he obviously commited the crime whilst he was here.

Barney
Barking Mad
I will further add to my comments above about being elsewhere in the world: Consider this, someone goes to Holland and smokes a joint, walks around the city all week carrying the stuff around with him. (Or in Geneva - where doing this isn't legal {so I understand})

What business is it of any prosecuting authority here?????

Surely anyone can only be subjected to (and therefore in a position to break) The UK Law while actually in the UK?!?!?!?!?

S172 says "name the driver". The S172 notice's requirements comes into effect only when it is issued. So if I break the speed limit while here on Jan 1st but leave by Jan 7th and after NIPpin the RK, they ISSUE an S172 on Feb 1st to me when I have been back in France (or anywhere else 3 weeks), How can I be subjected to the Law of this country when I am not actually here????????? How Can I be guilty of failing to name? It would be my contention that the authorities here would effectively be acting ultra vires. They can't DEMAND with the weight of the Law, they can only ask... And I would suggest the Diana inquest over what happened in Paris in August 1997 is an accurate example of what reaches the Law has. People have been INVITED to appear to give evidence by videolink but they can't be FORCED to. And those who have said "no" and not appeared have not committed a criminal offence even if they'd been subpoenaed to appear... Because our laws stop half way across the channel - All they can do is ask
The Rookie
The point is (if you read the post) that the driver in question frequantly returns to the UK and comes under our legal jurisdiction....also there is case law that establishes that the S172 applies in the area were it was issued (hence English drivers with Scottish NIP's can go unsigned, but Scottish drivers with English ones can't!).

So if he ignores the S172, is summonsed and fails to arrive, he could be arrested the next time he comes in the country, balanced against 3pts/£60, I think I know which way most people will go!

HOWEVER if the scammers believe he is a genuine foreign driver (through the full cooperation of the OP and driver) who was on a one off trip (lets not rock the boat) they will probably drop the whole thing, because as you say he would not be under our jurisdiction unless he returned.....

Simon
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2019 Invision Power Services, Inc.