Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: [NIP Wizard] A5127 Lichfield between the A51 & A38 (795), Staffordshire
FightBack Forums > Queries > Speeding and other Criminal Offences
BenGee
NIP Details and Circumstances
What is the name of the Constabulary? - Staffordshire Police
Date of the offence: - September 2007
Date of the NIP: - 0 days after the offence
Date you received the NIP: - 3 days after the offence
Location of offence (exact location as it appears on the NIP: important): - A5127 Lichfield between the A51 & A38 (795), Staffordshire
Was the NIP addressed to you? - Yes
Was the NIP sent by first class post, second class or recorded delivery? - Not known
If your are not the Registered Keeper, what is your relationship to the vehicle? -
How many current points do you have? - 3
Provide a description of events (if you know what happened) telling us as much about the incident as possible - some things that may seem trivial to you may be important, so don't leave anything out. Please do not post personal details for obvious reasons - I had first driven up the road (from A38 end) towards Lichfield. Well before getting to the main centre I turned around in a side road and headed back the way I came. I was not in a rush and was doing 40mph in what I believed was a 40mph area.

Having rechecked the route, days later, I notice that there are not any of the expected 30mph (Yellow background) signs on either side of the road.
I did notice on the right hand side of the road only, two back-to-back signs (sign No.880) - which is "speed camera above with 30 sign" below. In the direction of my travel this was not on the left hand side.

Also, high trees make visibility of some lampposts difficult. I intend to take a video camera to verify again.

Should there be a sign on the left-hand side? if Sign No.880 ?
I feel a bit of entrapment and money-making by the police here -
[the charge is speed 41mph in 30mph]. I also queried going on their driver awareness course but they said I did not meet the criteria - but they would not reveal what exactly that criteria was.

[Ps: alleged offence was: exceeding 30mph - manned equipment - I believe LT2020]


NIP Wizard Responses
These were the responses used by the Wizard to arrive at its recommendation:
Have you received a NIP? - Yes
Are you the Registered Keeper of the vehicle concerned (is your name and address on the V5/V5C)? - Yes
Did the first NIP arrive within 14 days? - Yes
Although you are the Registered Keeper, were you also the keeper of the vehicle concerned (the person normally responsible for it) at the time of the alleged offence? - Yes
Were you driving? - Yes
Which country did the alleged offence take place in? - England

NIP Wizard Recommendation
Based on these responses the Wizard suggested that this course of action should be considered:
  • The law requires you to provide the information requested in the Section 172 notice within the 28 day period, naming yourself as the driver. If you are considering obtaining formal legal advice, do so before returning the notice.

    You should note that there is nothing to be gained by responding any earlier than you have to at any stage of the process. You are likely to receive a Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty (COFP) and further reminder(s). If you want to continue the fight, you should ignore all correspondence from the police until you receive a summons. You need to understand from the outset that while you will receive much help and support from members on the forums, you will need to put time and effort into fighting your case and ultimately be prepared to stand up in court to defend yourself.

Generated by the PePiPoo NIP Wizard v3.3.0: Tue, 02 Oct 2007 14:21:27 +0100
andy_foster
In a 30 mph restricted road (with streetlights), standard speed limit repeater signs are not allowed. There should be 2 larger 'terminal' signs at the start of the limit (i.e. when entering the 30 mph limit from another limit), but if there is no change of speed limit on that road, there will be no signs.

The 'diagram 880' sign is only permitted within 1 km of a speed camera site, and only one in each direction. There is no requirement to use these signs.
BenGee
Thanks for the info.
So it seems that Sign No.880 does not legally have to be there! and neither two 30mph signs.
Which it is just down to the distance between "visible" lamp-posts.

But I will try to get serial No. of LT2020 device and maybe see if I can check when it was last calibrated.

By the way, does anyone know (or have seen a document) which determines the criteria for being able to attend a Driver awareness course instead. If it is only available (perhaps) to people that go 1 or 2mph over the limit and not to those that do more - seems to completely defeat the whole purpose of running a course!

Thanks for info anyway.
nemo
QUOTE (BenGee @ Tue, 2 Oct 2007 - 17:54) *
By the way, does anyone know (or have seen a document) which determines the criteria for being able to attend a Driver awareness course instead. If it is only available (perhaps) to people that go 1 or 2mph over the limit and not to those that do more - seems to completely defeat the whole purpose of running a course!

An invitation to attend a speed awareness course is entirely at the discretion of the constabulary concerned and will require certain criteria to be met..

Unsure whether its relevant to the constabulary in your case, but ACPO guidance (for the introduction of a national speed diversionary scheme) is that SACs should not be offered to offenders who were travelling at a speed greater than 10% plus 6mph above the posted limit.
BenGee
So at 41mph - I am 2mph over the guidance.
that's bad luck,
But thanks for info.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2019 Invision Power Services, Inc.