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OMG
NIP Details and Circumstances
What is the name of the Constabulary? - Kent Police
Date of the offence: - January 2007
Date of the NIP: - 21 days after the offence
Date you received the NIP: - 45 days after the offence
Location of offence (exact location as it appears on the NIP: important): - M2 near Vicarage Lane, Overbridge, Ospringe
Was the NIP addressed to you? - Yes
Was the NIP sent by first class post, second class or recorded delivery? - First
If your are not the Registered Keeper, what is your relationship to the vehicle? - Vehicle technically does not exist. I drove a curtsy car - a Nissan Note LV55TVU but the NIP referred to a Nissan Almera Tino SE
How many current points do you have? - 0
Provide a description of events (if you know what happened) telling us as much about the incident as possible - some things that may seem trivial to you may be important, so don't leave anything out. Please do not post personal details for obvious reasons - I was driving a Nissan Note, a curtsy car from my garage and was passing by some road works on the M2. The temporary road limits seem to just start almost immediately after the warnings. I know that one day, I found myself having to break suddenly because I found that the notice of reduced road speed seem to be placed almost before the area they applied to resulting in very short braking distances. Also, the road works seem to have been scattered all over the A2/M2 and I was always aware that I was not sure when I was in or out of one of the reduced speed road signs.
I am driving that way tomorrow to try and take photographs except I am not sure where road called M2 near Vicarage Lane is seeing as there is no post code.


NIP Wizard Responses
These were the responses used by the Wizard to arrive at its recommendation:
Have you received a NIP? - Yes
Are you the Registered Keeper of the vehicle concerned (is your name and address on the V5/V5C)? - No
Although you are not the Registered Keeper, were you the keeper of the vehicle concerned (the person normally responsible for it) at the time of the alleged offence? - Yes
Is the NIP addressed to you personally? - Yes
Were you driving? - Unsure
Do you know who was driving? - Unsure who was driving

NIP Wizard Recommendation
Based on these responses the Wizard suggested that this course of action should be considered:

Generated by the PePiPoo NIP Wizard v1.1.0: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 01:12:56 +0000

I intend to send in the NIP wiith a pace witness statement and hopefully they will send the photographs in so I can identify where this incident took place. I also intend to clarify that I have an Almera Tino SE+ that was off the road at the time this incident was supposed to have happened and I was driving a Nissan Tino. These two cars are similar but very different.
What do other members think? unsure.gif
The Rookie
Check this page http://www.rac.co.uk/web/vehiclechecks/dvl...52C502E82C7A283 to see what car tallies with the reg number on the DVLA database, I would also write immediatley asking for photo's 'to help confirm the ID of the driver' which will tell you if either the reg number or car type have been entered wrongly....once you have that info repost and we can give best advice. You have 28 days to respond, use it wisely.

Simon
Rallyman72
It's an Almera:

Vehicle details
Manufacturer NISSAN
Model ALMERA SE
Body type 5 DOOR HATCHBACK
Colour GREY
Fuel type PETROL
Date manufactured 30 September 2005
Number of previous owners 1
OMG
Rallyman72, I drove this car for 2 months. I have an invoice from the garage charging me £ 250 for a dint on their car. I think that the garage may have either wrongly described the car or deliberately switched registration numbers as it suits them i.e. sell the original Almera SE , replace it with Note and just switch number plates. I intend to write back initially saying that I cannot remember driving this car and asking for a photograph. I've sent off the letters using pace and asking for a photograpgh to clear the confusion.
andypandy
No dont use pace yet, write initially asking for photos to help identify the driver. Dont ask for anything else at this moment
OMG
OMG. Thanks. Ive edited my letter and simply sent in a letter asking for photograpghs to clear my confusion. Thanks Andypandy.
V70
There does seem to be some confusion,............in your own mind in your OP one minute you are driving along, the next minute you are unsure who was driving?

You want to make your mind up which defence route you are chosing, with out lying.
The Rookie
Reading the original post I disagree, he saya he remembers one day, not necesarily THE day, and as we don't even know if its the right car, if its not the car he was driving, then he is UNSURE of the driver.

Simon
OMG
I am confident of the following facts. The car I drove was a Nissan Note. It was brand new and definitely not manufactured in 2005. I may have driven on that road because I go to Canterbury regularly using the A2/M2 road and there are roadworks there.
The problem here is that I am being accused of driving a Nissan Almera on a day I know that the car being driven was a Nissan Note.
That is the issue. That is why I was confused about the approach to take. It could be that the garage switched plates without registering the new car. It could be a mistake from the garage when they filled in the NIP to confirm that they were the registered keepers but that I was the one the car was allocated to. I don't know but I know that I was NOT driving a 2005 Nissan Almera on that particular day.
The Rookie
In that case, instead of asking for photo's write back and tell them that to the best of your knowledge you have never driven the car in question and that they should make sure that the source of the information is correct.

Simon
driverx
with regards to Inaccurate NIPs and The "Slip Rule" if they sent an nip with a totally incorrect first name (but correct last) would it invalidate the NIP?
andypandy
QUOTE (driverx @ Wed, 28 Feb 2007 - 13:40) *
with regards to Inaccurate NIPs and The "Slip Rule" if they sent an nip with a totally incorrect first name (but correct last) would it invalidate the NIP?
unlikley, the slip rule would correct this.
Lynnzer
First things first OMG.
You have been sent a NIP after you have been identified as the potential driver by the garage who owns the vehicle.
There are two ways of identifying a car to my satisfaction. The first is by reference to the Reg no. and the second by its make and model description.
I use a courtesy car myself on a regular basis whenever I take my own motor in for service etc.
I would be hard pressed to recall the actual model of car I was using since I've had several different models from a Citroen C1 to a Berlingo.
This would be difficult for me to remember with any confidence.
Now, if I was asked the registrqation number of any of them I'd be screwed. I find it difficult remembering my own phone number as I don't often have to call it myself.
If I then had to give a reply as to whether I was using a particular model with a specified reg no I'd be completely goosed. I wouldn't be able to tell you the colour of any replacement vehicle I used let alone anything more mundane as a reg no.

As you've been named by the RK, then it's a matter of you having to confirm their own records that you were supplied with the said vehicle.
If the reg no is for a different model then I think you oughta get hotfoot to said garage and have confirmation from them that the car you were using at the time was in fact a Nissan Note.
Since this then becomes a very relevant piece of information just in case the matter proceeds to court I'd make sure that it was signed by someone who is duly authorised to do so. Don't give them any idea of why. If they have switched number plates then they might not play ball.
It might be that the repair invoice has this information it anyway so that might just do the trick for you.
Since the car is clearly not the one you hired, then you have a defence of not being able to supply such information as they require.
Write to the scammers, attach the letter to the NIP, and tell them that there appears to be some sort of mistake as you're certain you weren't driving an Almera on the day in question.
This is honest and truthful.
There will probably be a bit of a chaes from then on in as to the circumstances but I guess they'll get lost as the reply isn't in the form they require. ie it requires someone of intelligence to address the situation so methinks this could easily time out.
If it doesn't then given the facts, the actual model of car is more than a mere typo that can be corrected along the way, as in all honesty you can say on oath that you wern't driving an Almera so it wasn't able to make comment about the identification of someone who was.
There's no reason for you to keep records of any courtesy vehicle so couldn't verify anything from the stated reg no either.
You don't want to ask for identification photo's at this stage. It might just jog your memory to the effect that, OH yeah, that looks like the car I was driving.
So sing the NIP bvut leave it uncompleted and attach the letter explaining your reason for not being able to complete it. It's an offence to make untruthful replies on the NIP so if the car is listed as an Almera then you'd be committing an offence for confirming that you were if indeed you weren't.
That's the logic of it my eyes at least.
OMG
I have sent off a letter saying I am confused and can I have a photograph please.
I am waiting to hear from them. I am hoping the photo will identify the Nissan Note.
I am also asking the garage to put the make of the car on the invoice they've sent me.
Thanks for that tip.
Cheers


Sean
OMG
I have now had the photograph from the Police. The car is a Nissan Note with reg LV 55TVU but the NIP is for a Nissan Almeira.
The area is a construction area along the A2/M2 where they reduce the speed for some distance, then end the speed reduction and a little later, start a reduction and if you are not concentrating, it is easy to forget where you are. Where there is no speed reduction, the speed is 70 mph but later it is reduced to 50 mph and another area 60 mph and then another area 50 mph again.
Any advice?
Lynnzer
QUOTE (OMG @ Thu, 29 Mar 2007 - 12:47) *
I have now had the photograph from the Police. The car is a Nissan Note with reg LV 55TVU but the NIP is for a Nissan Almeira.
The area is a construction area along the A2/M2 where they reduce the speed for some distance, then end the speed reduction and a little later, start a reduction and if you are not concentrating, it is easy to forget where you are. Where there is no speed reduction, the speed is 70 mph but later it is reduced to 50 mph and another area 60 mph and then another area 50 mph again.
Any advice?

I told you didn't I?
Don't ask for photo's!!!!!!!!
Bet you wish you'd listened now.
Logic again......
There are still incorrect details on the NIP. It says a Nissan Almera instead of a Note so to complete the NIP will still place you in the position of making a false or deliberately incorrect declaration.
I don't think you have any requirement to correct the mistakes made by the police. They pay someone a lot of the taxpayers cash to properly complete the documentation to be sent out.
If this were my NIP I'd wait until day 26 and return it with a letter saying that as I wasn't driving a Nissan Almera at the time of the alleged offence I am unable to complete the information required.
As I already said, the registration number of a courtesy car isn't something anyone could reasonably be expected to remember.
You can interpret whatever you like into this logic. I can't condone anything illegal of course which is why I suggest the letter stating that you weren't the driver of an Almera at the time of the offence. This is honest and truthful.
Only don't make mention of the photographs, PLEASE.......
alphanov
QUOTE (OMG @ Wed, 28 Feb 2007 - 13:20) *
I am confident of the following facts. The car I drove was a Nissan Note. It was brand new and definitely not manufactured in 2005......


If the registration that you have left in the initial post is correct then the plate is registerd to, as has already been stated, a 2005 Nissan Almera.
OMG
I am sending the NIP back unsigned with the following statement. I am unable to submit the details requested as I am unable to verify with any accuracy the identity of the person driving the Nissan Almeira with the said registration number.
I needed the photograph to verify that the car was a Note not an Almeira.

I am not sure whether to extend the statement further by saying that I was driving a Nissan Note at the time. What do you advise? Many thanks
davepoth
I wouldn't tell them what car you were driving, it would be easy enough for them to issue a new NIP if you do that.
fedup2
deary me!!!
The Rookie
The Note is either on the wrong registartion number (is their an Almera out there on the same plate) or the car has been misregistered as a Almera when its a Note. Either way someone has made a right royal Horlix!

As to how you reply, thats very difficult, obviously commiting perjury is a bad idea, but now you have a photo of 'your' not you know that in reality you were almost certainly driving, as Lynnzer said, bieng ignorant of the fact it was a Note and not an Almera would have been better really.

While playing dumb may work, if it doesn't you destroy all credability should it ever get to court on an S172 summons.

You could write a nice letter pointing out the vehicle in the picture is not the car described on the NIP. but although its the garages fault, you as the driver may still get done for driving an unregistered car, unless they moved the reg number on a transfer and DVLA are still not aware (its still showing as an Almera today).

Perhaps you should contact the garage and ask why a Note is registerd as an Almera!

I'm now pretty flumoxed as to the best way forward!

Simon
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