Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: civil claims and costs
FightBack Forums > Queries > Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decriminalised Notices
Teufel
if i make a claim for restitution i can claim the directly associated costs
and for interest

what about the cost of the court process or representation ?

what if i lose - can costs be awarded against me ?
could they be '000s if they instruct a barrister ?

anyone have a clear grasp of the law or experience ?

(sorry but i am an academic lawyer not a practioner)
Tony-Medusa
QUOTE
if i make a claim for restitution i can claim the directly associated costs
and for interest
It appears so YES

QUOTE
what about the cost of the court process or representation ?

You can get going for as little as £30, simple look at the reaction as you go, and make an application notice (£80 ish) to vary the amount later on.

QUOTE
what if i lose - can costs be awarded against me ?
could they be '000s if they instruct a barrister ?
Yes, but unlikely in my experience a private claim is regarded sympathetically, in ten cases I have NOT ONE had costs awarded against me at all.

QUOTE
anyone have a clear grasp of the law or experience ?


Can't speak for myself. Lawyers will want to be paid to open their mouths

QUOTE
(sorry but i am an academic lawyer not a practioner)


You're more than good enough for me......... I am not either BUT
with ten clear wins, and having defeated barristers, and the CPS, and had the judges re-considering, in very focussed areas it makes up for all their knowledge in areas that aren't relevant for one case in particular, it's all asymmetry of information, once you see they have a knowledge advantage, then revise and research, and correct the asymmetry, then its an even playing field, except you have passion they have only a fee, and fees distort truth.

I have doubts that a lawer will answer, (unless pro bono) as I said they will want payment, AND it's not good for business??????

I would like to see something more from Tabitha, perhaps the court order? But even so, I had overlooked the 6 yr statute of limitations, its a new openeing of the mind.......
Tony-Medusa
I wanted to add.......
By the way, the difference between an academic lawyer and practitioner is the practitioner has practised. That's all! He also had to practice for the first time.

Some who have practiced for years are just as bad as Hilary in BBC Chambers.

Wayne Pendle has practiced, and his Sam Stockman V Havering makes him a practitioner. You only need to practice once, even in a small way, and your a member of the club of practitioners.
DW190
QUOTE
You only need to practice once, even in a small way, and your a member of the club of practitioners.


So when I fought my own case in the High Court of the District Registry against a rather large National Organisation who engaged a Top Barrister. BTW, I won. does that mean I can now adopt the title Practitioner of Law.
Wayne Pendle
QUOTE (DW190 @ Fri, 24 Nov 2006 - 19:46) *
QUOTE
You only need to practice once, even in a small way, and your a member of the club of practitioners.


So when I fought my own case in the High Court of the District Registry against a rather large National Organisation who engaged a Top Barrister. BTW, I won. does that mean I can now adopt the title Practitioner of Law.



I would hope not smile.gif , I really wouldn't want such a title or association, i'm an amateur and proud of it, but then so are SOME Council lawyers by all accounts. I do however like to believe that truth can still prevail in this Country; a principle that has been tested somewhat in the past, although I sense recently, that certain fractions are beginning to distance themselves away from the Councils etc. I have been quite impressed with TEC of late, the attitude of some of the staff there has been quite promising.

Teufel, I hope I speak for us all in stating that you have provided invaluable help and with your knowledge of case history which I have found particularly useful. Whilst not all of us agree all of the time, we all have our negative and plus points, each and every success is a credit to all contributers of this site and the campaigns etc.
twigsby
"what if i lose - can costs be awarded against me ?
could they be '000s if they instruct a barrister ?"

They can and they could, but only in limited circumstances and even then only in the Court's discretion.

Given the likely value of your restitution claim (< £5k) it will almost certainly be allocated to the Small Claims Track (see Civil Procedure Rules "CPR" Part 27 for more details). After allocation you are not likley to have very much awarded against you in costs (witness loss of earnings up to £50 each, witness expenses - most large bodies do not even attempt to claim these - and court fees. If one is permitted, any expert witness costs might also be claimed but limited to £200) unless you have behaved unreasonably (merely losing is not likely to be seen as being "unreasonable") - see CPR 27.

In the Small Claims Track (unlike the other tracks) the principle that the loser pays does not apply and the loser can even (rarely) seek costs from the winner if the winner has behaved unreasonably.

Allocation usually takes place after the defence has been filed and also after each party has filed a questionnaire. There is some risk that the other side will make an application to strike out your claim as an abuse of process or, effectively, unwinnable (CPR 3.4). If that application is dealt with BEFORE allocation takes place (and a costs award is made on the hearing of that application) then the Small Claims Track limitation on costs will not automatically apply or be backdated (CPR 44.9, 44.11) - but you can ask the District Judge to treat it as a small claim and disallow costs in his discretion.

The amount of costs in a Small Claim can indeed be £000s - but the District Judge will usually "summarily assess" the costs which means that he will critically look at the costs claimed and reduce them by to a level that he considers to be appropriate (an in this respect the question of proportionality will weigh heavily given the likely low value of the claim).

My comments above apply do not apply to appeals which can be more complicated (and changed recently I believe).

The CPR and useful authorities can be accessed at
http://www.hrothgar.co.uk/YAWS/index.htm

OF COURSE THIS IS A GENERAL EXPOSITION ONLY AND SHOULD NOT BE TAKEN AS SPECIFIC ADVICE IN YOUR PARTICULAR CIRCUMSTANCES.
Tony-Medusa
QUOTE
(DW190 @ Fri, 24 Nov 2006 - 19:46)

You only need to practice once, even in a small way, and your a member of the club of practitioners.


So when I fought my own case in the High Court of the District Registry against a rather large National Organisation who engaged a Top Barrister. BTW, I won. does that mean I can now adopt the title Practitioner of Law.


I would hope not , I really wouldn't want such a title or association, i'm an amateur and proud of it, but then so are SOME Council lawyers by all accounts. I do however like to believe that truth can still prevail in this Country; a principle that has been tested somewhat in the past, although I sense recently, that certain fractions are beginning to distance themselves away from the Councils etc. I have been quite impressed with TEC of late, the attitude of some of the staff there has been quite promising.


Do me a favour..........
Too modest by half.
Some, if not many solicitors are " nine year olds just out of university" -- remember "As good as it gets" Nicholson?

Here is a snippet from one of the largest boroughs in London, and my reply, the whole letter is the worst attempt at law ever..... surely.....

All to be published soon..



Part of preamble.......

The immediacy of insight to this course of conduct is visible with the apprehension on the first moment of reading simply ONE sentence denying the existence of any exchanges and the very existence of those exchanges within their instructing officer's and author's own possession and control below.
Please indulge the claimant for the time it takes to read carefully the ensuing few sentences a), b), c), d) ( 60 – 90 seconds ) and forego disbelief for that duration, taking on trust they are beyond a shadow of doubt.......... empirical and logical truths. Please note the tone of credent confident authority in a), A precise copy sentence from one of the defendant's letters dated 03/10/2006 Exhibit 1, from the Borough's Department of Law and Administration stating:

“We have reviewed the Council's records in light of your assertion and record that at no stage have we received any representations from you."

This averment, not only confutes the existence of the letter to which it replies, it confutes the existence of some 12 lengthy letters ( some 40 pages plus ) to the borough, the three Councillors, Mayor, MP, and sits alongside as pure contradictions of another 4 letters from the Council to the claimant, all impliedly replying to non existent representations.

It is a considerable achievement after a month of construction, with 4 pure contradictions in logic on their own letterheads, 3 internal contrarieties, and 12 empirical contradictions. It strikes at the roots of epistemology in the well known liar's paradox “The next sentence is true”, “The previous sentence is false”, showing the defendant's instructing mind as an equivocator that could swear in both the scales against either scale.
Without even reading the letters, please now just acknowledge Exhibit 2, the existence of merely one of five, this one penned from the same author to the claimant in contradiction, that are merely part of at least thirty written exchanges circulated to more than ten named parties, within the borough.

This gets VERY much more worse..... by way of another fatal contradiction, coupling threats without foundation in law. Cloaked unequivocal admissions masked in contextual refutations that have been excused under the rubric of “out of procedure”, flexibly trivialising their wilful negligence while enforcing inflexibly for trivia.
Please tell me this is something the claimant should not be taking seriously from the Law and Administration Department of a leading Borough
Wayne Pendle
Interesting stuff Tony, I'll have a look at the main site.
Tony-Medusa
Wayne, Ill send you a link of the letter in prep later today, It's longish and draft at present. The breaches in statute is about 4 or 10 pages long, the rest is draft of loads of ideas teaming in to box the thing up.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2019 Invision Power Services, Inc.