Hello All!,
I need help with my fathers PCN.
On the 28th of August at 10.59, in ALBERT ROAD, ILFORD. SINGLE YELLOW LINE he had received a PCN stating:
"... Civil Enforcement Officer ... observed the vehicle identified from 10.56 to 10.59 and had begun to prepare a PCN for service by fixing it to the vehicle or by giving it to the person appearing to them to be in charge of the vehicle, but the vehicle concerned was driven away from the place in which it was stationary before the Civil Enforcement Officer had finished preparing the PCN or was in any other way prevented from serving it as stated above."
My father was dropping off his disabled friend to his house, while his car was stationary and the engine was still on and while he was still inside the vehicle on a SINGLE YELLOW LINE ROAD.
His friend took a few minutes to get off his car as he has a disability with his leg. When the Enforcement Officer came he did not see my father in the car and started to prepare the PCN as he was getting ready to move away.
My father saw the Enforcement Officer and told him, while still inside the car, that he was leaving and he did not exit his car, for the whole 3 minutes he was dropping off his friend. The Enforcement Officer did not want to listen to any reason and my father left.
We then received the PCN by post.
Now I would like to challenge the PCN as I find it to be unjust and unfair, can anyone find any grounds to object the PCN or any law that could help as this is the first time I challenge a PCN.
Thank you very much
We all love or loved our fathers, but the fact is that you were not there and therefore are acting upon your father's own account.
Drivers' accounts can often be a tad at variance with the whole truth and omit details.
It does not matter as regards the contravention or type of PCN whether the passenger was disabled. Apart from anything, it isn't a precise definition. The contravention is neither proved nor disproved because your father drove away in what appears to be a forlorn attempt to avoid service, although an adjudicator might draw inferences. And SYL or DYL makes no difference either.
So can we please get away from starting with an account which reads as a defence and just deal with the facts.
He stopped on a SYL to drop off his passenger. Perfectly OK. We're all entitled to do this.
Passenger took as long as necessary to get out of the car. Perfectly fine.
CEO was or was not in attendance while this occurred? The key question. If in attendance, then they saw the passenger, but if not in attendance and did not see the passenger then your account MUST focus on why your father was still parked as their legal duty is to leave once the passenger has disembarked. In this respect, an adjudicator would accept waiting until the passenger in this case reached their front door/was out of sight because this had NO effect on the length of time parked because your father was equally entitled to leave his car and escort/assist them to their house. Therefore the critical path is how long the passenger took to reach their home.
But your account rather misses these aspects.
Can you rewrite and address the key legal issues.
Drivers' accounts can often be a tad at variance with the whole truth and omit details.
It does not matter as regards the contravention or type of PCN whether the passenger was disabled. Apart from anything, it isn't a precise definition. The contravention is neither proved nor disproved because your father drove away in what appears to be a forlorn attempt to avoid service, although an adjudicator might draw inferences. And SYL or DYL makes no difference either.
So can we please get away from starting with an account which reads as a defence and just deal with the facts.
He stopped on a SYL to drop off his passenger. Perfectly OK. We're all entitled to do this.
Passenger took as long as necessary to get out of the car. Perfectly fine.
CEO was or was not in attendance while this occurred? The key question. If in attendance, then they saw the passenger, but if not in attendance and did not see the passenger then your account MUST focus on why your father was still parked as their legal duty is to leave once the passenger has disembarked. In this respect, an adjudicator would accept waiting until the passenger in this case reached their front door/was out of sight because this had NO effect on the length of time parked because your father was equally entitled to leave his car and escort/assist them to their house. Therefore the critical path is how long the passenger took to reach their home.
But your account rather misses these aspects.
Can you rewrite and address the key legal issues.
Please post up the PCN with personal details obscured/redacted - leave location and everything else visible - and a Google Street View link to the exact location.
Dad hasn't done himself any favours by (a) driving off and (b) not leaving the car to help his friend.
In the first instance, write to the Council (informal challenge) telling them that a disabled person was getting out of the car - there is an exemption for boarding/alighting - and see what they come back with. If/when they reject, they will almost certainly re-offer the discounted penalty.
Dad hasn't done himself any favours by (a) driving off and (b) not leaving the car to help his friend.
In the first instance, write to the Council (informal challenge) telling them that a disabled person was getting out of the car - there is an exemption for boarding/alighting - and see what they come back with. If/when they reject, they will almost certainly re-offer the discounted penalty.
QUOTE (hcandersen @ Fri, 6 Sep 2019 - 11:12) 
We all love or loved our fathers, but the fact is that you were not there and therefore are acting upon your father's own account.
Drivers' accounts can often be a tad at variance with the whole truth and omit details.
It does not matter as regards the contravention or type of PCN whether the passenger was disabled. Apart from anything, it isn't a precise definition. The contravention is neither proved nor disproved because your father drove away in what appears to be a forlorn attempt to avoid service, although an adjudicator might draw inferences. And SYL or DYL makes no difference either.
So can we please get away from starting with an account which reads as a defence and just deal with the facts.
He stopped on a SYL to drop off his passenger. Perfectly OK. We're all entitled to do this.
Passenger took as long as necessary to get out of the car. Perfectly fine.
CEO was or was not in attendance while this occurred? The key question. If in attendance, then they saw the passenger, but if not in attendance and did not see the passenger then your account MUST focus on why your father was still parked as their legal duty is to leave once the passenger has disembarked. In this respect, an adjudicator would accept waiting until the passenger in this case reached their front door/was out of sight because this had NO effect on the length of time parked because your father was equally entitled to leave his car and escort/assist them to their house. Therefore the critical path is how long the passenger took to reach their home.
But your account rather misses these aspects.
Can you rewrite and address the key legal issues.
Drivers' accounts can often be a tad at variance with the whole truth and omit details.
It does not matter as regards the contravention or type of PCN whether the passenger was disabled. Apart from anything, it isn't a precise definition. The contravention is neither proved nor disproved because your father drove away in what appears to be a forlorn attempt to avoid service, although an adjudicator might draw inferences. And SYL or DYL makes no difference either.
So can we please get away from starting with an account which reads as a defence and just deal with the facts.
He stopped on a SYL to drop off his passenger. Perfectly OK. We're all entitled to do this.
Passenger took as long as necessary to get out of the car. Perfectly fine.
CEO was or was not in attendance while this occurred? The key question. If in attendance, then they saw the passenger, but if not in attendance and did not see the passenger then your account MUST focus on why your father was still parked as their legal duty is to leave once the passenger has disembarked. In this respect, an adjudicator would accept waiting until the passenger in this case reached their front door/was out of sight because this had NO effect on the length of time parked because your father was equally entitled to leave his car and escort/assist them to their house. Therefore the critical path is how long the passenger took to reach their home.
But your account rather misses these aspects.
Can you rewrite and address the key legal issues.
+1 the looking beyond your narrative to what it is likely happened then the stop was for a statutory exemption. Also post the PCN in full other than redacted personal detail it sounds wrong
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