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FightBack Forums > Queries > Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decriminalised Notices
Narrativium
Hey guys I'm hoping you can help me, I've been fine for parking in a taxi rank however I feel that it is unfair due to the situation.

I parked in the taxi rank to fetch a friend from up pub only metres away, I was only gone for at most 15 minutes , but when I came back I had a ticket.

The taxi rank I parked in has an almost always been completely empty especially on a Monday evening, do I have any footing for an appeal?
stamfordman
15 mins is way too long to be picking someone up for the boarding exemption and in any case it looks like a no stopping not no waiting restriction:

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.7501007,-1....3312!8i6656

why do you think it's unfair?

Mad Mick V
Not marked as a taxi rank. Has DYLs and therefore is footway parking. I would say the Council might have difficulty enforcing this one.

Different set up in July 2014:-

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.7500002,-1....3312!8i6656

Mick
cp8759
Upload the back of the PCN, councils often make mistakes in the mandatory small print on the back.
stamfordman
I didn't see this is on the pavement - as MMV notes it looks like they have paved over an area and simply kept the taxi rank in place without it being an actual taxi rank any more.
PASTMYBEST
QUOTE (Mad Mick V @ Tue, 11 Dec 2018 - 09:21) *
Not marked as a taxi rank. Has DYLs and therefore is footway parking. I would say the Council might have difficulty enforcing this one.

Different set up in July 2014:-

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.7500002,-1....3312!8i6656

Mick


+1
Narrativium
QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Tue, 11 Dec 2018 - 11:13) *
QUOTE (Mad Mick V @ Tue, 11 Dec 2018 - 09:21) *
Not marked as a taxi rank. Has DYLs and therefore is footway parking. I would say the Council might have difficulty enforcing this one.

Different set up in July 2014:-

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.7500002,-1....3312!8i6656

Mick


+1


what does this mean for me?
Narrativium
here is a photo of the sign
cp8759
Upload the back of the PCN to imgur.com and post a link.
Narrativium
back of PCN


Their reply:
Dear Sir

Thank you for your recent correspondence regarding Penalty Charge Notice OX34903270.

Please find below photographs taken at the time the Penalty Charge Notice was issued.






The lay-by in which you were parked is a shared use bay which is restricted as follows:

8pm – 6am No stopping except taxis
6am – 8pm Loading only. Maximum stay 30 minutes. No return within 1 hour.

As your vehicle is not a taxi and was parked during the period when stopping is prohibited the Penalty Charge Notice was correctly issued.


1. this is a public footway with a bay painted onto it.
I can confirm that this is a lay-by and not part of the footway.

2. it has DYLs and therefore is footway parking
There is a solid yellow line which clearly indicates a No Stopping restriction. This can be clearly seen in the photographs above.

3. which means the taxi rank signage is contradictory and the fine not enforceable
I can confirm that the signs and lines conform to the current legislation Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2016 and the Notice is enforceable.

Having taken into consideration the circumstances as outlined in your correspondence, I believe that there are insufficient grounds for cancelling your ticket. The restriction is clearly indicated to drivers with road markings and a sign. It is the driver's responsibility to find suitable parking and to ensure that the vehicle is parked legally at all times.

You must now decide whether to pay the penalty charge or to make representation to Oxfordshire County Council.

1. To Pay
In order to take advantage of the discount of 50% available for early payment of the Penalty Charge Notice you should make payment of £35.00 before 03/01/19. Failure to pay within the discount period will result in the Penalty Charge Notice being enforced at its full value of £70.00.

2. To Make Representation
If you are not satisfied with our decision, your next course of action is to make a representation to Oxfordshire County Council. Representation may only be made once you have received a Notice to Owner.
The Notice to Owner will be sent to the registered keeper of the vehicle if the PCN remains unpaid. At this stage the Penalty Charge Notice will stand at £70.00. Full details of how to make a representation will be given on the 'Notice to Owner'.

If the Council rejects the representation they will issue a Notice of Rejection and advise you how to appeal to the independent Adjudicator at the Traffic Penalty Tribunal. There is no right to appeal to the Adjudicator where this procedure has not been followed and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal cannot register an appeal until it has.

Please note if payment is received before the Notice to Owner is sent you will not be able to make a representation. A representation against a Penalty Charge Notice that has been paid in full is not provided for within the Traffic Management Act 2004.

Yours sincerely



Mrs A Salisbury
Notice Processing Manager
PASTMYBEST
post the letter not a transcript
cp8759
You need to show us the council's letter and the council photos of the car.
Narrativium
here are the photos, they emailed me the above, no letter
Mad Mick V
That broad yellow line is the killer IMO.

They now have lines and signs for the taxi rank so unless others can come up with sustainable grounds I would settle at the discount.

Mick
Mr Meldrew
Consider this:

Dear Oxfordshire County Council

Penalty charge: OX34903270

Concerning your letter of rejection, it is not true to say that the signs and lines conform to the current legislation, specifically The Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2016.

Respectfully, I suggest you assimilate the relevant information at paragraph 25 in Schedule 4 to the Instrument you rely upon, and then refer to item 2 of the Part 3 sign table below, as you were required to do. You will see that symbols and legends used in combination with a yellow panel need not be illuminated, but that this does not apply to the yellow panel at issue because it contains the “No stopping” symbol and the legend “No stopping except taxis”.

Plainly, as prescribed by law you needed to illuminate the yellow panel, but you did not (consequently the part-time restriction was not readable from a moving vehicle late at night), and you cannot therefore enforce the restriction.

You must now cancel the penalty charge.

Happy Christmas

__________________________________________________

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/4/made

hcandersen
IMO, although it reads very well and is technically correct as regards illumination, it would fail at adjudication.

The OP's posts show they knew they were in a 'taxi rank' and I don't think an adj would allow an appeal on the basis of illumination or that in some way the authority's response was so inaccurate as to suggest that proper consideration had not been given, after all the OP did not even raise this in their challenge.

cp8759
I'm inclined to agree with hcandersen, I suspect a technical appeal would be unsuccessful and the tribunal would rule the signage to be substantially compliant. No stopping signs need to be illuminated because you need to be able to see them without stopping, i.e. there is no allowance to stop and look around for the signs. If you'd stopped temporarily before driving off, you'd have a solid case following the decision in Mr Simon Wright v NEPP & Essex County Council (case reference ID00131-1812). But given that you were, by your own admission, parked for 15 minutes, I don't see that working here.
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