SPARKY26
Fri, 19 Oct 2018 - 16:37
Hi all I've had some really good advice from this forum. and i have another question
We were having this conversation in the pub last night.
What part of the vehicle has to cross the white line to be classed as jumping. I was under the understanding that any part of the vehicle can't cross the white line. Then someone added, What about if you have a trailer or if you have a delivery wagon with a long long trailer. The things you talk about when having a beer lol.
666
Fri, 19 Oct 2018 - 17:01
You're right, any part. AFAIK "vehicle" normally includes any load and/or trailer. No doubt someone can provide chapter and verse.
southpaw82
Fri, 19 Oct 2018 - 17:02
I don’t see why a trailer isn’t part of “the vehicle”. I think you’d be hard pushed to argue otherwise.
666
Fri, 19 Oct 2018 - 17:06
On second thought, the actual reg. says "that vehicular traffic shall not proceed beyond the stop line".
A trailer is in itself a vehicle. Whether its part of the towing vehicle is irrelevant.
SPARKY26
Fri, 19 Oct 2018 - 17:29
Thanks for your prompt reply's great thanks for confirming. They were just saying that if a articulated lorry, would not be able to stop if close to the traffic lights, when they changed to amber. By the time the back of the trailer passed the stop line the lights could be red.
oldstoat
Fri, 19 Oct 2018 - 17:37
Where I have issues, with red lights, as an HGV driver. The lights turn green and there may be only one car in front at the stop line, that car sets off but due to volumes of traffic, when turning right, into the yellow box they slow down. because of a zebra crossing or some other lights I have already started to proceed turning right, then I am past the point of being able to see any lights. if the light turn red after I am halfway past. technically I am crossing a red light. yet if I stop in the yellow box I will now block the entire junction how do you proceed
KH_
Fri, 19 Oct 2018 - 17:45
I had the exact situation in Scotland, don't recall the location, too many years ago.
Right turn, followed a vehicle into the junction on green, trailer wheels crossed the line on red when it was safe to turn.
Saw the flash but never got a NIP. Gotta assume someone with sense reviewed the 'offence'
Churchmouse
Sat, 20 Oct 2018 - 00:24
QUOTE (oldstoat @ Fri, 19 Oct 2018 - 18:37)
Where I have issues, with red lights, as an HGV driver. The lights turn green and there may be only one car in front at the stop line, that car sets off but due to volumes of traffic, when turning right, into the yellow box they slow down. because of a zebra crossing or some other lights I have already started to proceed turning right, then I am past the point of being able to see any lights. if the light turn red after I am halfway past. technically I am crossing a red light. yet if I stop in the yellow box I will now block the entire junction how do you proceed
FWIW, in the US the stoplight violation is determined when the front of the vehicle crosses the stop line. When I moved to the UK 20 years ago I had a hard time believing that the UK version of the offence would treat drivers of long vehicles so "unfairly". It still doesn't make sense to me...but I do now believe it.
--Churchmouse
DancingDad
Sat, 20 Oct 2018 - 08:12
Time was when these sort of offences were enforced by police using Mk1 eyeballs and common sense.
Now enforced by cameras with no common sense or discretion.
So the real answer would likely be whether or not there is a camera and if the trailer triggers it.
seank
Sat, 20 Oct 2018 - 10:27
What often surprises me is the other side of this.
You can be waiting in the centre of a box junction, to turn right.
When the lights change, you occasionally get someone whose light has gone green and then thinks they have an automatic right to plough through.
Green certainly doesn't just mean go. Remember your driving test and highway code, that it means go if the road is clear.
cp8759
Sat, 20 Oct 2018 - 11:49
QUOTE (seank @ Sat, 20 Oct 2018 - 11:27)
What often surprises me is the other side of this.
You can be waiting in the centre of a box junction, to turn right.
When the lights change, you occasionally get someone whose light has gone green and then thinks they have an automatic right to plough through.
Green certainly doesn't just mean go. Remember your driving test and highway code, that it means go if the road is clear.
As far as I'm aware a green light doesn't have any statutory meaning at all, it's the same as a non-functioning traffic light.
oldstoat
Sat, 20 Oct 2018 - 19:10
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Sat, 20 Oct 2018 - 09:12)
Time was when these sort of offences were enforced by police using Mk1 eyeballs and common sense.
Now enforced by cameras with no common sense or discretion.
So the real answer would likely be whether or not there is a camera and if the trailer triggers it.
fingers crossed I have not yet triggered a red light camera, in this situation. Yet this is more to the fact that the junctions around Manchester, luckily, do not yet have red light cameras. There are far to many dual lane slip roads, controlled by lights, at the top which, after going through the lights have lights after turning right. the phasing then leaves an HGV stranded due to traffic
666
Sun, 21 Oct 2018 - 06:11
QUOTE (cp8759 @ Sat, 20 Oct 2018 - 12:49)
QUOTE (seank @ Sat, 20 Oct 2018 - 11:27)
What often surprises me is the other side of this.
You can be waiting in the centre of a box junction, to turn right.
When the lights change, you occasionally get someone whose light has gone green and then thinks they have an automatic right to plough through.
Green certainly doesn't just mean go. Remember your driving test and highway code, that it means go if the road is clear.
As far as I'm aware a green light doesn't have any statutory meaning at all, it's the same as a non-functioning traffic light.
The Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2002, section 36(d): "...the green signal shall indicate that vehicular traffic may proceed beyond the stop line and proceed straight on or to the left or to the right;"
southpaw82
Sun, 21 Oct 2018 - 10:04
QUOTE (666 @ Sun, 21 Oct 2018 - 07:11)
The Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2002
Which have been repealed...
DancingDad
Sun, 21 Oct 2018 - 10:22
QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Sun, 21 Oct 2018 - 11:04)
QUOTE (666 @ Sun, 21 Oct 2018 - 07:11)
The Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2002
Which have been repealed...
Aye
But the same wording is in TSRGD 2016
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/14/made
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