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PCN Double Yellow
iain123
post Wed, 2 Mar 2011 - 00:16
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Hi Forum

Parked on double yellow for a matter of a few minutes (probably just the 3 minutes clocked by parking attendant) to return books that were over due to public library on Saturday afternoon.
When I was returning to car no more 20 yards from library saw a man photographing my car who looked like parking attendant, because of his behaviour. What appeared to be his car was parked in front of mine.
He said i was parked on a double yellow i got in to my car and drove off.
Received this PCN in the post this morning.

The yellow lines are clearly visible (albeit they are on small size 50mm) and have T bar at both ends.

There are no notices saying no loading/unloading?
My first name has been incorrectly spelt on the PCN?


Thanks for advice

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post Wed, 2 Mar 2011 - 00:16
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Scaramouche
post Wed, 2 Mar 2011 - 00:23
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Idiots. The phrase "men amongst boys and boys amongst men" comes to mind. And arrogant: the eight permitted grounds? Edited - mea culpa. The corker is: tick one box. Absolute crap and fettering. WTF are they on? Have they read the regulations? You are allowed to tick as many as you wish or as are appropriate.

There is more! Threats re increase and Charge Certificate and within period. As I am in Calais tomorrow: C'est fcking incroyable !

Box G is interesting: tick this if contravention not covered by a traffic order! OK, so park in a bus stop and tick this box to get off!

And read this for comparison's sake: http://www.chelmsford.gov.uk/index.cfm?articleid=6287

Question: how many grounds on PCN? How many on website? How are they described on each?

This post has been edited by Scaramouche: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 - 01:02


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The Patas Monkey has a remarkably high reproductive rate, perhaps as an evolutionary response to the high adult mortality rates associated with this strongly terrestrial lifestyle.
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ford poplar
post Wed, 2 Mar 2011 - 02:31
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The CEO spent valuable time taking pics of contravention yet the postal PCN10/NTO does not provide any for the enlightment of the owner who may not have been the driver.
I know the OP was the app driver and is the RK/owner and concedes the DYLs were clearly visiblr
OP has also blanked the location of alleged contravention. Can he provide a G street map link? (poss vague locus challenge).
Scary has highlighted several deviations from permissable phrasing on the PCN docs for poss challenge, do we know what % of such challenges are upheld at TPT/PATASn and how many Authorities subsequently changed their wording after an adverse Adjucation?
The Chelmsford penalty challenge website implies all PCN recipients (affixed or postal) have only one chance to make 'informal' reps and does not highlight differnece between affixed PCN9 and postal PCN10/NTO.

I would advise any returning driver not to drive off before PCN served; this loophple was closed with the intro of postal PCNs which removes the informal reps layer.

As ever, it is up to OP to decide Deal or No Deal.
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iain123
post Wed, 2 Mar 2011 - 18:07
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Hi Ford and Scaramouche

So you are only allowed one informal representation for a postal PCN?, unlike a PCN handed to the driver or stuck on the windscreen?

I have copied a map image and coordinates for the short road were i parked "Pump Hill". And marked my approximate position with the colour RED. The name of the road "Pump Hill" is not marked on map.
The whole road has the same post code hope this map allows you to check what is necessary.

OS X (Eastings) 572867
OS Y (Northings) 204949
Nearest Post Code CM2 7JT
Lat (WGS84) N51:42:60 (51.716629)
Long (WGS84) E0:30:04 (0.501011)
LR TL728049
mX 55772
mY 6715487

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iain123
post Sat, 7 May 2011 - 16:25
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Hi Group

Thanks for your help I appealed on about 5 grounds including the ones above and the local council has decided to drop my case and not take it any futher at the first stage.

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ford poplar
post Sun, 8 May 2011 - 00:34
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Result! Did the Council concede any of your grounds or just rely on 'their discretion'?

For the edification of others AIUI a postal PCN is effectively a Notice to Owner, thus skipping the informal reps phase of the normal PCN. DYL's are No Parking at any Time unless a Loading/unloading, alighting/boarding or other exemption can be applied, so no observation time is required. IMO
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Neil B
post Sun, 8 May 2011 - 12:32
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For future reference - read H in the first list of grounds.

It clearly instructs you to tick box H as a matter of course rather than if you are appealing on that point.


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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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iain123
post Sun, 8 May 2011 - 23:11
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Hi Ford Popular

The council relied on their discretion and did not concede on any grounds. They also said if i do it again I will be fined and enclosed a photo of my car on the double yellow.
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bama
post Mon, 9 May 2011 - 10:16
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On their discretion ? ?

they retreated big time as it was one monumental feck up that they dare not let get near adjudication.

thats not discretion really.
meanwhile they will go on issuing crap paperwork and raking in the cash from those that just pay up.
They have a word for that in Sicily don't they.....

send back (to the Parking manager) a pic of their crap paperwork and say if they issue this again it will be useless smile.gif smile.gif


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Which facts in any situation or problem are “essential” and what makes them “essential”? If the “essential” facts are said to depend on the principles involved, then the whole business, all too obviously, goes right around in a circle. In the light of one principle or set of principles, one bunch of facts will be the “essential” ones; in the light of another principle or set of principles, a different bunch of facts will be “essential.” In order to settle on the right facts you first have to pick your principles, although the whole point of finding the facts was to indicate which principles apply.

Note that I am not legally qualified and any and all statements made are "Reserved". Liability for application lies with the reader.
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