Driving Ban And Crb Checks |
Helping the motorist get justice
Helping the motorist get justice
Driving Ban And Crb Checks |
 Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 13:59
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#1
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Member Group: Members Posts: 63 Joined: 3 Jan 2008 Member No.: 16,387  |
I have just finished serving a six month driving ban under the 'totting up' procedure, i am applying for jobs and as the jobs include driving they are asking me to agree to crb checks on my name, will my driving ban show up the crb check?
kindest regards phil |
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 13:59
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 15:34
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#2
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Member Group: Members Posts: 1,045 Joined: 11 Mar 2007 Member No.: 11,089 |
QUOTE (pipshady @ Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 14:59)  I have just finished serving a six month driving ban under the 'totting up' procedure, i am applying for jobs and as the jobs include driving they are asking me to agree to crb checks on my name, will my driving ban show up the crb check? kindest regards phil The forms you'll have to fill in should direct you, however I've always found it best (and have always been pointed in the direction of) not to hold anything back. On "similar" forms I've had to complete, it is mandatory to enter all convictions including speeding but not parking. CRB may not require this level of detail and a quick scout around the internet seems to show confusion about what to include and not include. However, the basic ground rule in all this is, if you hold something back and "they" find out, it's worse than you actually holding your hand up in the first place. HTH and good luck with the job hunting |
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 17:26
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#3
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Member Group: Members Posts: 63 Joined: 3 Jan 2008 Member No.: 16,387 |
i see what you are saying, but basically i m guessing it should nt show up if its not a criminal conviction, is a totting up ban a criminal conviction??
phil |
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 17:37
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#4
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 Member Group: Members Posts: 17,268 Joined: 2 Apr 2008 From: Not in the UK Member No.: 18,483 |
Not all criminal convictions are recorded on the Police National Computer - only offences deemed to be "recordable offences" are recorded. A recordable offence is any offence carrying a term of imprisonment (whether the defendant was actually imprisoned or not) and some specified offences.
Driving bans are recorded on the PNC as it has a link to the DVLA computer. Whether this expired information will be released for a CRB check is another matter. Are the jobs asking for a standard or enhanced check? --------------------  You are the result of billions of years of evolutionary success. Now act like it. |
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 17:59
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#5
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Member Group: Members Posts: 1,045 Joined: 11 Mar 2007 Member No.: 11,089 |
QUOTE (pipshady @ Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 18:26) i see what you are saying, but basically i m guessing it should nt show up if its not a criminal conviction, is a totting up ban a criminal conviction?? phil Tricky area and there have been threads on here about this before. AFAIK, if you pay an FPN you've accepted it and end of story and no record, but if you've got a totting up ban then I presume a court was involved at some point. The bit below is from the Home Office about Border Guards, but I would imagine that it's from the same hymn sheet everyone is huddled around. If you have been convicted of a criminal offence but the rehabilitation period has passed by the time you make your application you do not need to provide details of the conviction on your application form. If you were convicted of a further offence during the rehabilitation period of your original conviction, the rehabilitation period for your original conviction may be extended. If you have been convicted of a criminal offence and the spent period has not passed you must include details of the conviction on your application form. If the conviction is unspent at the time of your application, it is unlikely that your application will be successful. Sentence ................................ Rehabilitation period Driving disqualification .............Once disqualification has ended Sorry had to edit it. The table it was in didn't work too well in the text editor This post has been edited by nomadros: Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 18:04 |
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 19:25
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#6
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Member Group: Members Posts: 63 Joined: 3 Jan 2008 Member No.: 16,387 |
ok thanks for your help so far, i think the check is a level 1 check by, backgroundchecking.com, so i don t think its an 'enhanced' check, it seems quite intrusive! but the only 'legal' bit i can find on it is asking if i have any unspent criminal convictions, as i believe at the moment, the totting up ban does nt count as a criminal conviction, but i suppose the companies will look into these things as deep as they want to?
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 19:43
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#7
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,268 Joined: 2 Apr 2008 From: Not in the UK Member No.: 18,483 |
A totting ban is not a criminal conviction, it is a disposal - ie a punishment passed in sentence. However, you will necessarily have been convicted of a criminal offence in order to be sentenced. So, whatever offence you were convicted of that attracted the points that pushed you over the limit will be your criminal conviction. Presuming you were fined as well then that can affect the rehabilitation period.
You need to read the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974. -------------------- You are the result of billions of years of evolutionary success. Now act like it. |
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 20:04
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#8
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Member Group: Members Posts: 63 Joined: 3 Jan 2008 Member No.: 16,387 |
i see, so as it was a speeding offence that took me to twelve points it is that that is my criminal conviction, so when a prospective employer looks at my crb check they will see i have a criminal conviction for speeding! this is nt looking good! looks like i ll be paying the price for speeding for some time to come! as a gas engineer my job entails alot of driving, and an employer seeing i have a criminal record for speeding will not go down very well! thanks for the reply southpaw, i ll start reading the rehabilitation of criminals act!
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 20:06
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#9
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,268 Joined: 2 Apr 2008 From: Not in the UK Member No.: 18,483 |
I very much doubt that a CRB check will show a speeding conviction, as such offences are not recorded on the PNC as it is not a recordable offence. However, if you're asked to disclose all convictions then you must disclose it yourself.
-------------------- You are the result of billions of years of evolutionary success. Now act like it. |
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 20:17
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#10
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Member Group: Members Posts: 63 Joined: 3 Jan 2008 Member No.: 16,387 |
ok i understand now, so even though a totting ban is nt a criminal conviction in itself the speeding that triggered the ban is, therefor when asked if i have any criminal convictions i should say yes, for speeding, i know its not going to be worth me keeping my mouth shut on this one as knowing my luck that people at backgroundchecking.com will find the conviction as it was only given to me near enough exactly six months ago!
one other thing i have noticed is that this particular background check checks with the dvla, so i suppose that dvla have the potential to disclose that i was banned? |
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Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 21:00
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 8,639 Joined: 5 Jul 2003 Member No.: 134 |
According to lawontheweb, as far as The Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974 is concerned, the ban is 'spent' at the end of the ban, and endorsements don't count at all. The fine, however, lasts for five years.
As far as the CRB check is concerned, the point is academic, because your employer (if you got the job) would need to inspect your licence anyway, before letting you drive a company provided vehicle, so they'd find out anyway. This post has been edited by jeffreyarcher: Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 21:03 |
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Sat, 19 Jul 2008 - 00:58
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#12
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,123 Joined: 19 Dec 2006 From: Near Calais Member No.: 9,683 |
JA is correct about the employer asking to see your licence. Some employers cannot employ you if you've had a ban because their insurers will not cover you.
As an employer, if I found any employee hadn't revealed convicitons, it is a dismissable offence, "failing to disclose". I suggest you be totally honest with your prospective employer. |
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Sat, 19 Jul 2008 - 22:04
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#13
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Member Group: Members Posts: 1,342 Joined: 9 Sep 2004 From: Newbury Member No.: 1,625 |
QUOTE (jeffreyarcher @ Fri, 18 Jul 2008 - 22:00) According to lawontheweb, as far as The Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974 is concerned, the ban is 'spent' at the end of the ban, and endorsements don't count at all. The fine, however, lasts for five years. As far as the CRB check is concerned, the point is academic, because your employer (if you got the job) would need to inspect your licence anyway, before letting you drive a company provided vehicle, so they'd find out anyway. As far as the CRB is concerned, the ROA is irrelevant. Convictions do not drop off the CRB when spent - otherwise, what would be the point of a CRB check in the first place? Driving offences (ie non-recordable offences) do not appear on the CRB disclosure - well mine don't anyway on the two enhanced CRBs that I have had. Also bear in mind that the CRB applicant (IOW, the OP) gets a copy of the disclosure sent to them by the CRB. |
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Sun, 20 Jul 2008 - 23:21
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#14
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Member Group: Members Posts: 8,639 Joined: 5 Jul 2003 Member No.: 134 |
QUOTE (patdavies @ Sat, 19 Jul 2008 - 23:04) As far as the CRB is concerned, the ROA is irrelevant. Convictions do not drop off the CRB when spent - otherwise, I didn't say that they did; read what I said again. 
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Mon, 21 Jul 2008 - 03:00
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#15
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 Member  Group:  Life MemberPosts: 16,594 Joined: 9 Sep 2004 From: Reading Member No.: 1,624 |
A standard CRB check will not show any cautions or spent convictions.
An enhanced CRB check will. -------------------- Andy
You have a charming and alluring naiveté, but in the context of this quiz, you do make Dappy look like Stephen Fry - Phill Jupitus  |
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Mon, 21 Jul 2008 - 08:07
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#16
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Member Group: Members Posts: 1,342 Joined: 9 Sep 2004 From: Newbury Member No.: 1,625 |
QUOTE (andy_foster @ Mon, 21 Jul 2008 - 04:00) A standard CRB check will not show any cautions or spent convictions. An enhanced CRB check will. Sorry Andy - wrong. From the CRB website QUOTE Standard CRB check
Standard CRB checks are primarily for posts that involve working with children or vulnerable adults. Standard checks may also be issued for people entering certain professions, such as members of the legal and accountancy professions. Standard checks contain the following; * Convictions, Cautions, Reprimands and Warnings held in England and Wales on the Police National Computer, the most of the relevant convictions in Scotland and Northern Ireland may also be included; and if the position involves working with children or vulnerable adults, in the sectors or areas which are able to access them, and the relevant boxes have been marked on the application form, in Section Y (Y3 or Y4), to indicate this: * information from the Protection of Children Act List (PoCA); * Information from the Protection of Vulnerable Adults List (POVA); and * Information held by the DCSF under Section 142 of the Education Act 2002 of those considered unsuitable for, or banned from working with children. Enhanced CRB Check Enhanced checks are for posts involving a far greater degree of contact with children or vulnerable adults. In general, the type of work will involve regularly caring for, supervising, training or being in sole charge of such people. Examples include a Teacher, Scout or Guide leader. Enhanced checks are also issued for certain statutory purposes such as gaming and lottery licences. Enhanced checks contain the same information as Standard checks but with the addition of any locally held police force information considered relevant to the job role, by Chief Police Officer(s). |
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Mon, 21 Jul 2008 - 08:22
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#17
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,268 Joined: 2 Apr 2008 From: Not in the UK Member No.: 18,483 |
So a Standard CRB won't show convictions or cautions for non-recordable offences as these are not held on PNC.
An enhanced check might show these if they are held on local force databases and if the Chief Constable deems them relevant to the check. -------------------- You are the result of billions of years of evolutionary success. Now act like it. |
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Mon, 21 Jul 2008 - 15:44
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#18
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Member Group: Members Posts: 63 Joined: 3 Jan 2008 Member No.: 16,387 |
so is the totting up ban and the speeding that caused it non recordable? is being banned and fined a conviction
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Tue, 22 Jul 2008 - 07:21
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#19
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,268 Joined: 2 Apr 2008 From: Not in the UK Member No.: 18,483 |
QUOTE (pipshady @ Mon, 21 Jul 2008 - 16:44) so is the totting up ban and the speeding that caused it non recordable? Depends on what offence you were given points for. If it was speeding, no. QUOTE is being banned and fined a conviction A ban and a fine is a punishment. To be punished you must first have been convicted of a criminal offence. -------------------- You are the result of billions of years of evolutionary success. Now act like it. |
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Fri, 15 Aug 2008 - 10:33
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#20
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Member Group: Members Posts: 129 Joined: 15 Aug 2008 From: Suffolk Member No.: 21,855 |
Given the "discretion" clause in an e-crb check, it is perfectly permissable for arrest or interviews without charge to be disclosed, and even mere hearsay or suspicion.
Any bets that after Huntley that anything and everything will be recorded and disclosed in the interests of CYA. Edited to add..... Its not just the final speeding that took you over the limit that is an offence that may (or may not) be recorded, but each of the offences for which you gained points and possible fines. This post has been edited by Keeper: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 - 10:34 |
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