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Maybe......, What are the rules on tickets while in the car?
Dr-Cmos
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 16:05
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I was driving home from work today when my mobile rang. Didn't have blue tooth headset with me, but was right next to a car park, so pulled in to a space and answered it. I was on the phone for 8 minutes before leaving, but after 4 minutes a car park attendant spotted me. He came right up to the car, looked at me and checked the windscreen for a non-existent ticket. He then walked off.

As I pulled out of the space 4 minutes later I checked my mirror and he was looking at my car and writing something down. He ran after me, to keep my car in view, and continued to write. I’m 100% convinced he was writing down my registration etc.

Can anyone tell me the rules on being stopped in a space with the engine running for a few minutes? Am I liable for a parking ticket? Does he have to give me the ticket there and then if I am? Do you think he'll print the ticket, throw it away and claim he did issue it and I ignored it?

Any help / advice would be appreciated.
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post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 16:05
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DW190
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 16:09
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QUOTE (Dr-Cmos @ Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 17:05) *
I was driving home from work today when my mobile rang. Didn't have blue tooth headset with me, but was right next to a car park, so pulled in to a space and answered it. I was on the phone for 8 minutes before leaving, but after 4 minutes a car park attendant spotted me. He came right up to the car, looked at me and checked the windscreen for a non-existent ticket. He then walked off.

As I pulled out of the space 4 minutes later I checked my mirror and he was looking at my car and writing something down. He ran after me, to keep my car in view, and continued to write. I’m 100% convinced he was writing down my registration etc.

Can anyone tell me the rules on being stopped in a space with the engine running for a few minutes? Am I liable for a parking ticket? Does he have to give me the ticket there and then if I am? Do you think he'll print the ticket, throw it away and claim he did issue it and I ignored it?

Any help / advice would be appreciated.


Was the car park private or a council operated one?


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Dr-Cmos
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 16:11
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A council car park in Hampshire.
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DW190
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 16:15
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QUOTE (Dr-Cmos @ Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 17:11) *
A council car park in Hampshire.


If its a council run car park and the council run Decriminalised Parking Enforcement both on and off Road they have to place a PCN on the car or hand it to the driver.


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Dr-Cmos
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 16:19
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Great news, thank you. Is there a document that states this, so I can quote it if / when something comes of this?
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Teufel
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 16:20
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PATAS lamina v TfL

also applies to 1984 regs (an ECN) and pilce FPNs
i believe - they all need to be served to vehicle or driver
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Dr-Cmos
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 16:23
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Many thanks to all for your help.
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DW190
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 18:26
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Posted at 1705

QUOTE (Dr-Cmos @ Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 17:05) *
I was driving home from work today when my mobile rang. Didn't have blue tooth headset with me, but was right next to a car park, so pulled in to a space and answered it. I was on the phone for 8 minutes before leaving, but after 4 minutes a car park attendant spotted me. He came right up to the car, looked at me and checked the windscreen for a non-existent ticket. He then walked off.

As I pulled out of the space 4 minutes later I checked my mirror and he was looking at my car and writing something down. He ran after me, to keep my car in view, and continued to write. I’m 100% convinced he was writing down my registration etc.

Can anyone tell me the rules on being stopped in a space with the engine running for a few minutes? Am I liable for a parking ticket? Does he have to give me the ticket there and then if I am? Do you think he'll print the ticket, throw it away and claim he did issue it and I ignored it?

Any help / advice would be appreciated.





QUOTE (Dr-Cmos @ Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 17:23) *
Many thanks to all for your help.


Posted at 1723

Now try getting service like that from Solicitor at £185.00 per hour.


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peterb
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 19:29
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QUOTE (Dr-Cmos @ Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 17:05) *
As I pulled out of the space 4 minutes later I checked my mirror and he was looking at my car and writing something down. He ran after me, to keep my car in view, and continued to write. I’m 100% convinced he was writing down my registration etc.

He must place ticket on car or give to you.
If you drive away before this is done, ticket is not valid.

Have you been issued a parking ticket ??
No point worrying about tickets/problems that probably will not materialise.

Following should clarify:

1) A PCN issued by a council parking attendant is not legally valid until it is either fixed to your vehicle or handed to you.
2) letter from Westminster Parking Services clarifying the position.

peterb
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Nimbus
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 19:55
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A helpful letter from Westminster parking services here

A PCN must be served by fixing it to the vehicle or handing it to the driver (or person in charge of the vehicle) at the time and location of the observed contravention(s.66 RTA 1991). Except as noted below, a PCN cannot be served by post, even if the driver drives the vehicle away while the PCN is being produced. The exceptions to this are either if the attendant is prevented from serving the PCN in the normal way by violence or threats of violence (s.5 London Local Authorities Act 2000) or if the enforcement is taking place following observation by CCTV (see below). In cases where a PA is prevented from serving a PCN on street so it has to be served by post following violence or threats of violence, the attendant should make full notes of the incident and the nature if the intimidation in the pocket book.

If this TA has taken the trouble to chase your car then in all likelihood he’s going to issue you with a phantom ticket. The first you shall know of it is when the NtO drops through your letter box. By then you shall have lost your right to pay at the reduced charge and it will be up to you to prove that the ticket wasn’t issued in compliance with the 1991 RTA.
.
If the TA does his job properly then he’ll have made a note of your tax disc details. They should do this after writing out the ticket; in practise they seem to do this first. Did he get a good look at you tax disc? If he hasn’t got yout disc details then it helps with your prospective Challenge. Did you have passengers? More witnesses the merrier.

Good luck
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Dr-Cmos
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 21:14
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Brilliant info. Yes I had a passenger and no, I don't think he saw my tax disk, he was behind. This sounds pretty good to me. I guess if I do get anything I should have a pretty good case to get it dismissed...

<Edit for spelling>

This post has been edited by Dr-Cmos: Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 21:17
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rambo
post Wed, 20 Sep 2006 - 23:34
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DO NOT send a copy of your tax disc to the council or to the adjudicator. The council use those details to amend the parking attendents note book, be warned.


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Teufel
post Thu, 21 Sep 2006 - 09:07
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send one with a slightly wrong number then at the very last minute
write to correct it - or go for oral hearing
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DW190
post Thu, 21 Sep 2006 - 14:55
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QUOTE (rambo @ Thu, 21 Sep 2006 - 00:34) *
DO NOT send a copy of your tax disc to the council or to the adjudicator. The council use those details to amend the parking attendents note book, be warned.
If you have an old expired disc at the back of the valid one send that.

It would be interesting to see the notebook referring to a disc that was covered and unreadable but easily mistakenly removed to send to them.


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