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Tfl ticket for parking under a flyover
PCN fines
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 15:29
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Hi there,

Hope someone can advise.
I got a ticket from tfl for parking under a flyover I did not see any signage of road marking and the ticket was fixed on my windscreen on 27/1/20 and On the same day I wrote a letter making the representation and sent it on by recorded delivery on 30/1/20 but I did not get a reply, I did check the Royal Mail website and it showed it was delivered and signed for on 31/1/20

On the 16/3/20 I got a notice to owner saying I have to pay £130 or make representation in 28 days.

Any idea what I can do as they did not reply to my first representation.

Thanks
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post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 15:29
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PASTMYBEST
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 15:33
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Post all documents redact only personal detail go online and get the photos, post these and also post a GSV

The law is strange in that they are not obligated to respond to informal reps but they must consider them. failure to respond therefore is often taken as a failure to consider

Make sure you have evidence of the delivery of the letter ( take a screenshot)

This post has been edited by PASTMYBEST: Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 15:34


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Incandescent
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 16:55
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If you look at the original PCN, somewhere on it it will tell you that representations will be considered but that if an NtO is issued anyway, you must follow the instructions on the NtO. So not getting a response to your reps before an NtO is issued has been thought of. However, if there is no such clause on the PCN, then it is void, because this info is mandatory.

So now you have to submit what are now "formal representations" in response to the Notice to Owner. I'd also mention that no response was received to your informal reps. They really have a moral obligation to re-offer the discount if they haven't responded to your informal reps.

Post up the PCN and tell us more about what happened. A GSV link would be useful as well.

This post has been edited by Incandescent: Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 17:00
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PCN fines
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 17:36
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Ok
I’ll post the PCN what is GSV link
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stamfordman
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 17:44
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GSV = google street view = the location

Put pics on https://imgbb.com or such like as space on forum is limited.
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PCN fines
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 17:59
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https://ibb.co/hgz0QhL
https://ibb.co/3Ngv4M8
https://ibb.co/YkRn8S9
https://ibb.co/6XYdMyB

Hi please see attached
I have a screenshot of the delivery confirmation
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PASTMYBEST
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 18:06
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and the council photos your challenge and the rejection also post your evidence, lets not have 20 posts asking for info and getting dribs and drabs


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stamfordman
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 18:12
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Is this under the Bow flyover? I helped someone win a case here recently but they did have exceptional circumstances.
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PCN fines
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 19:10
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https://www.instantstreetview.com/@51.52936...8h,-15.48p,1.5z

Location link
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PASTMYBEST
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 19:28
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I'll leave this for Stamfordman for now he is correct about helping another OP recently and is more likely able to link to it


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stamfordman
post Tue, 31 Mar 2020 - 20:22
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There is a dropped kerb giving access to this area for maintenance vechicles. The contravention is pavement parking.

What were you doing there? The other case in the link below has compelling mitigating circumstances.

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showto...132397&st=0



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cp8759
post Wed, 1 Apr 2020 - 15:29
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There's a will / may flaw on the PCN but in the first instance, please explain the circumstances so we can see if we can challenge the contravention.


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I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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PCN fines
post Wed, 1 Apr 2020 - 16:01
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I was quickly popped in to the mosque for prayer as I would miss it before I start my next Job.
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PCN fines
post Wed, 1 Apr 2020 - 18:19
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I also see on the PCN it says if I make informal representation within the discount period the PCN will be held at a discounted rate. So does that mean the NTO offer the discount.
Coz it say £130.
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stamfordman
post Wed, 1 Apr 2020 - 18:32
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They will reoffer the discount when you make formal reps when you say you challenged but got no reply.

I must say I think you'll struggle to win this - it's clearly an off carriageway area and it's also rather dangerous to drive out from. See what others think.

What did you say in your letter?
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cp8759
post Wed, 1 Apr 2020 - 21:48
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The will / may flaw on the PCN is all I've got.


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I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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PCN fines
post Sat, 4 Apr 2020 - 22:14
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On that will/may flaw is it something that will win at a tribunal coz someone said they went to a tribunal with it and it was dismissed.
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DancingDad
post Sat, 4 Apr 2020 - 22:22
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Will/may should win but it often comes down to the decision of the adjudicator, some see it as a major flaw and some as simple semantic error.

However, even though you don't seem to have much of a leg to stand on, TFL do say that they will hold a PCN while considering and re-offer the discount.
You have proof your challenge was received within the discount period.
There is therefore an argument that the penalty now demanded exceeds the amount specified in the circumstances.

This will fail if the PCN history shows that they did respond, it is not unknown for letters to go missing.
I believe you can access PCN history on the TFL website... what does it say?
If it shows nothing re an informal challenge or reply, I would say you have a winner.
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PCN fines
post Sun, 5 Apr 2020 - 14:21
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I checked on tfl website please see attached.
https://ibb.co/SRkm434
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cp8759
post Sun, 5 Apr 2020 - 20:17
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I think that's more than enough to warrant a penalty exceeds argument, we can draft a representation for you but not if you take all the documents down.


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I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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