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Two Bus Lane PCN 1 minute apart
whythough
post Thu, 16 Jan 2020 - 03:26
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Hi all biggrin.gif

So brief summary I've received two PCNs from Hull CC for driving in a bus lane. The time stamps are 1 minute apart
(Link to google drive for maps,letters,images: https://drive.google.com/open?id=18-nTc3dXa...aQqjMNpFnH7VPM3 )

1st PCN: received 7th Jan 2020 for driving in a bus lane on 26th Dec 2019 at 18:14
2nd PCN: received 16th Jan 2020 for driving in a bus lane on 26th Dec 2019 at 18:13

The location on the PCNs are different but if you look at the map, the road is just quite a long stretch. Also with just 1 minute apart and what is essentially the same road, I really would like to try to appeal to combine them into one PCN - a continuous contravention perhaps? Or do you think with the stoplights etc, it's hard to make this argument?

PS. I've tried to download the videos but nothing is working. Will try again tomorrow.

Thanks for any advice you can get!
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post Thu, 16 Jan 2020 - 03:26
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Mad Mick V
post Thu, 16 Jan 2020 - 07:56
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OP----Two PCNs for the same bus lane within a short period of time should be classed as a continuous contravention ergo the total penalty charge amount is disproportionate. The second PCN should therefore be cancelled.

Mick
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whythough
post Thu, 16 Jan 2020 - 09:17
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Thanks Mick. Is there anything I can quote to support my appeal? And should I appeal both to make the connection between them?

Also, managed to get a free screen recorder so I've added the videos on google drive - let me know if you are able to view it.

This might seem stupid but I genuinely do not remember driving on the bus lane for the alleged contravention at 18:13. I know they have still pictures but I cannot even make out my registration number in the video evidence. Is there any way to challenge this or confirm that is was indeed my car or am I being stupid? huh.gif

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cp8759
post Sat, 18 Jan 2020 - 16:43
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Mohammad Shah Alam v London Borough of Newham (2180143104, 30 June 2018)
...
As far as I have been able to find (and without the assistance of the Respondent), I am not aware of any direct authority of
the High Court as to this issue. My initial concern about duplicity was, on reflection, more about the punishment for the
same contravention of law more than once. In truth, the concern was better described as ne bis in idem. Thus, whilst
disappointed that I am unable to find further representations from the London Borough of Newham, I have not penalised
them in this respect.

Essentially, two different camera operators have caught the Appellant drive through the pedestrian zone when he ought
not. That entry into the pedestrian zone is, in my view, the contravention.

In my judgment, the imposition of four additional penalties was excessive and unlawful. The most simple example from
which I can draw is a bus lane. If a person chooses to drive in a bus lane when prohibited, the entry into the bus lane is the
prohibited act, one cannot impose PCNs simply because different operators caught the driver in different locations along
the bus lane.

If I return to the core principle of ne bis in idem, the imposition of multiple civil penalties is not, in my judgment, acceptable.

It follows that I will allow the appeal in respect of PN16858015, PN16858026, PN16858037, PN16858048.

The appeal in respect of the initial contravention PN16857985 is refused.


Full decision here: http://bit.ly/2ZeRfVN

I'm tempted to say you should pay the first PCN and challenge the second one, unless you think the signage is defective or there's some arguable ground against the first one. Don't send a representation without posting it on here for review first.


--------------------
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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whythough
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 00:42
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Hi everyone,

Sorry I haven't replied here in a while. Thank you for all the advice! My appeal was successful and I only had to pay for one of them smile.gif

However...I have received another Bus lane PCN and I need some advice again on how to appeal this (new post!)

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