PCN (nw) taking me to court!, PCN filed a claim for parking at Blackburn college |
PCN (nw) taking me to court!, PCN filed a claim for parking at Blackburn college |
Tue, 3 Jan 2017 - 22:37
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#1
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Member Group: Members Posts: 18 Joined: 3 Jan 2017 Member No.: 89,410 |
I have had a court summons from Pcn (nw) for parking on permit holders only car park. Ticket was at 16.06 parking is free from 16.30. I was not the driver but I am the registered keeper. My defence is that there was no contract with myself and the fees are not representative of Pcn loss for my car being there. I read a freedom of information request that states PCN take 100% of all tickets so the charge is not there to reimburse the land owner and is punitive to make money for PCN business.
Any help greatly revieved. I have revieved a bundle from csb solicitors on behalf of PCN so I am currently getting my response together. I'm a newbie to here so thanks in advance. |
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Tue, 3 Jan 2017 - 22:37
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Tue, 3 Jan 2017 - 23:14
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#2
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Member Group: Members Posts: 41,510 Joined: 25 Aug 2011 From: Planet Earth Member No.: 49,223 |
'Loss' is largely irrelevant since ParkingEye v Beavis.
However, if the keeper was not driving then there might be a good angle. There might not be a contract with yourself but if they have complied with the Protection of Freedoms Act then you could be liable for the driver's unpaid parking charge. (I.e. The contract the driver allegedly formed) -------------------- RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it. |
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Tue, 3 Jan 2017 - 23:41
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#3
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Member Group: Members Posts: 13,735 Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Member No.: 14,720 |
I have had a court summons from Pcn (nw) And what else have you received since the date the car was parked? -------------------- |
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Tue, 3 Jan 2017 - 23:51
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#4
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,337 Joined: 4 Jan 2007 Member No.: 9,897 |
was this on a working mens club? , simular case on MSE if its the same I will serch for the case
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 00:08
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#5
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Member Group: Members Posts: 18 Joined: 3 Jan 2017 Member No.: 89,410 |
I received a notification of registered keeper. I must admit I thought it was a scam so ignored it. I have not had any correspondence with them until now which has been via the court.
It was on the college car park by the new leisure centre. |
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 00:09
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#6
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Member Group: Members Posts: 13,735 Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Member No.: 14,720 |
I received a notification of registered keeper. I must admit I thought it was a scam so ignored it. I have not had any correspondence with them until now which has been via the court. So a NTK and default summons. No Letter Before Action? -------------------- |
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 07:29
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#7
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Member Group: Members Posts: 11,094 Joined: 24 Aug 2007 From: Home alone Member No.: 13,324 |
If you have a "bundle" then your case must be in two weeks time. If so have you sent your "bundle"?
If you are in court in two weeks then drop me a PM. This post has been edited by emanresu: Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 07:30 |
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 08:02
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#8
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Member Group: Members Posts: 18 Joined: 3 Jan 2017 Member No.: 89,410 |
I am due in court on the 14th Feb. I am just putting together my evidence. The bundle came just before Christmas. There was no letter just an instruction to identify the driver or pay the charge which had increased from the original amount.
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 08:12
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#9
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Member Group: Members Posts: 56,200 Joined: 9 Sep 2003 From: Warwickshire Member No.: 317 |
So you've already entered your defence, I do hope you did a lot of homework otherwise the defence is probably doomed.
-------------------- There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!
S172's Rookies 1-0 Kent Council PCN's Rookies 1-0 Warwick Rookies 1-0 Birmingham PPC PCN's Rookies 10-0 PPC's |
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 08:48
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#10
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Member Group: Members Posts: 18 Joined: 3 Jan 2017 Member No.: 89,410 |
It is most likely doomed then!!! My defence is there was no contract as I was not the driver, the signage is misleading and the charges are not a reflection of loss to the landowner!!
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 08:53
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
Post up a copys of what you sent, removing identifying details. At least you mentioned the signage. Might be able to recover something from that. Is it possible to provide photos of the signs?
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 08:56
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#12
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Member Group: Members Posts: 41,510 Joined: 25 Aug 2011 From: Planet Earth Member No.: 49,223 |
It is most likely doomed then!!! My defence is there was no contract as I was not the driver, the signage is misleading and the charges are not a reflection of loss to the landowner!! The driver may have formed a contract. (The loss argument is mostly covered as I said earlier) But if the keeper was not driving and they haven't established keeper liability (See here) then this will be your strongest point. -------------------- RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it. |
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 10:47
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#13
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Member Group: Members Posts: 56,200 Joined: 9 Sep 2003 From: Warwickshire Member No.: 317 |
Not being the driver is good, as long as they have failed to meet the requirements of PoFA, have you checked?
-------------------- There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!
S172's Rookies 1-0 Kent Council PCN's Rookies 1-0 Warwick Rookies 1-0 Birmingham PPC PCN's Rookies 10-0 PPC's |
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 20:11
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#14
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Member Group: Members Posts: 18 Joined: 3 Jan 2017 Member No.: 89,410 |
How would I find out if they have met the requirements of PoFa?
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 20:17
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#15
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Member Group: Members Posts: 41,510 Joined: 25 Aug 2011 From: Planet Earth Member No.: 49,223 |
How would I find out if they have met the requirements of PoFa? Did you not click the link in my post #12? -------------------- RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it. |
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 20:18
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#16
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Member Group: Members Posts: 56,200 Joined: 9 Sep 2003 From: Warwickshire Member No.: 317 |
By comparing the notice to keeper with the requirements, either in the statute or using the checklist on the parkingcowboys website.
-------------------- There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!
S172's Rookies 1-0 Kent Council PCN's Rookies 1-0 Warwick Rookies 1-0 Birmingham PPC PCN's Rookies 10-0 PPC's |
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Wed, 4 Jan 2017 - 22:26
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#17
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
Here's POFA Paragraph 8 if a windscreen ticket otherwise 9
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Thu, 5 Jan 2017 - 13:52
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#18
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Member Group: Members Posts: 18 Joined: 3 Jan 2017 Member No.: 89,410 |
I tried to photograph the documents but they are to large to post on here. I will have a go at scanning them tomorrow.
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Thu, 5 Jan 2017 - 15:24
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#19
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Member Group: Members Posts: 18 Joined: 3 Jan 2017 Member No.: 89,410 |
The letter they have sent a copy of (I have no recollection of receiving this and it was not signed for) is basically an invoice for £118. The original fine was 100 reduced to 60 if paid within 14 days. No discount is offered to me the keeper. The next letter is from a debt collection agency saying the cost is now £160. To be honest if I had seen a letter for £60 paid in 14 days I would have paid it!
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Thu, 5 Jan 2017 - 15:40
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#20
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Member Group: Members Posts: 13,735 Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Member No.: 14,720 |
Not sure if it's fatal, but IIRC, there is a pre-LA protocol inc. LBA, ADR etc?
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