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Removal of vehicle for parking without permit
Mujahid
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 13:42
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Hi all, yesterday my car was removed from the road and put in a car pound by Newham Council for parking in a controlled parking zone without a permit. The restrictions on this road are Mon-Sun 8am-6.30pm. The PCN was received at 9.15am and the car was removed at 9.46am 30 mins later.

As a result, I had to pay £265 to release the vehicle. They gave me an appeal form if I want to appeal within 28 days. Was it lawful for them to remove my car, given the fact that the car was not parked dangerously or obstructing, was insured and taxed?

Is there a case for me to take this further? I shall of course upload the PCN and other documents as soon as possible. They didn't give me any images and I'll have to check online if I could get any.
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post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 13:42
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PASTMYBEST
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 13:57
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post all the documents, lawful it might be, but that does not mean it is right. and it would not be the first time they have towed without need, and an adjudicator has found the should refund the fee.
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stamfordman
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 14:04
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This may well be Newham's lowest priority for towing and that they waited for just the guideline 30 mins shows that as usual they are trolling around for 'business'.

use a pic site such as Imgur and Flickr for pics.
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Mujahid
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 14:15
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There must've been over 200 cars yesterday at the car pound and if everyone is being charged the minimum of £265 to release their vehicles, that's over £53000 they would make. Ridiculous. The location where I was issued the PCN, the roads were empty so I cannot understand why they would tow it, especially on a Sunday as well, other than for business.
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John U.K.
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 14:54
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In time, if there are grounds, you will be making reps against
1) The PCN and
2) the subsequent removal

Meanwhile, please post up here both sides of the PCN and all sides of all docs received at the pound (often errors in the 'small print'), together with a GSV (Google Street View) link to the location
For posting photos/docs

Try this:

Do not attach docs/photos, but use this method:

Photo or scan. see http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=36858&st=0
for how to do it. I use Tinypic for stage 2 with no problems. Thera are other sites, such as Flickr (where the BBcodes are concealed behind the curly arrow (click on it) for sharing), which enable you to paste the BBCodes into your post here.
STAGE 1 takes care of resizing. If you use Tinypic for Stage 2, on the left each image in Tinypic is a list of links. Highlight and copy the entire link 'for forums' from the list for each image - beginning with IMG and ending /IMG (include all the square brackets [ ] ), and paste each link into your post. Each copied and pasted link will embed a thumbnail link in your post.

Using the attachment method is not advised as it means quickly running out of attachment space.

Redact/obscure name, address, PCN number and reg.mark.
LEAVE IN all dates/times; precise location, Contravention code and description.
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stamfordman
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 14:59
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may as well put this up now - Newham's removal policy. you'll either be priority 3 or 4.

Priority One:
i) Parked in contravention in a position/location which is prohibited and is causing danger, & serious health and safety implications for other road users or pedestrians.
ii) Illegally parked in a formal disabled bay (30 minutes waiting time or 15 minutes if persistent evader *)

Priority Two:
i) Persistent evader (parked in prohibited place)
ii) Parked in an operational Bus Lane or at a Bus Stop
iii) Vehicle with foreign registration plate (parked in prohibited place)
iv) Parked obstructing a dropped footway (on a resident’s request)
v) Parked on a footway (parked in a prohibited place)
vi) Parked on school Keep Clear Markings*
vii) Parked in a Doctors Bay

Priority Three:
i) Parked committing a serious parking contravention (please refer to Appendix B above)

Priority Four:
i) All other contraventions
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peterguk
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 15:00
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QUOTE (Mujahid @ Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 15:15) *
I cannot understand why they would tow it, especially on a Sunday as well, other than for business.


Quite often, simply because they can. Which is why you don't take risks when parking in London.


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Mujahid
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 19:40
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These are all the documents that were given to me









There was no P&D serial number and expiry date & time on the PCN

This post has been edited by Mujahid: Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 19:43
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stamfordman
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 19:56
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Here:

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5027206,0.0...3312!8i6656

code 16 is a higher level penalty and so in the priority 3 removal category but it's hard to believe there was any urgency in this street.
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Mujahid
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 20:04
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I don't see why it was a higher priority. The street was empty, it wasn't blocking any entrances, it was parked within the bay. Also, they didn't give me any documents about the removal itself, what time they removed it etc. It was only at the car pound where the CEO was writing on a separate piece of paper for their records that the removal time was 09:46.
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stamfordman
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 20:10
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London PCNs are issued in two penalty bands - high and low. High is deemed 'serious' and includes being in a permit bay without a permit (rather than an expired permit).

But even so this only priority 3 out of 4 so it's going to be well worth appealing that it was not warranted.
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hcandersen
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 20:53
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OP, before we get too immersed in what the authority might have done wrong, how many cars might have been in the pound - without any knowledge as to why they were there and, if removed by an authority, which one - can we go back to square 1 pl.

Did you park in a parking place reserved for permit holders but without displaying a permit? Y/N?

If yes, then you are on the backfoot and have surrendered the moral high ground.

We start with the contravention, not the removal.

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Mujahid
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 21:16
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Yes, no permit was displayed in a residents parking bay. I could take £65 on the chin, but I have a gripe about them towing it and charging me another £200.
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peterguk
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 21:19
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QUOTE (Mujahid @ Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 22:16) *
Yes, no permit was displayed in a residents parking bay.


Were you in possession of a permit and did not display it, or had no permit to park in that bay whatosever?

This post has been edited by peterguk: Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 21:22


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Mujahid
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 21:50
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QUOTE (peterguk @ Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 22:19) *
QUOTE (Mujahid @ Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 22:16) *
Yes, no permit was displayed in a residents parking bay.


Were you in possession of a permit and did not display it, or had no permit to park in that bay whatosever?


Had no permit. Literally moved into the area last week.
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Mujahid
post Tue, 27 Mar 2018 - 19:14
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Is there any merit in appealing? Would I be able to at least get a refund for for the removal?
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stamfordman
post Tue, 27 Mar 2018 - 19:47
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You have nothing more to lose by appealing apart from your time. And ours.
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Mujahid
post Tue, 27 Mar 2018 - 20:02
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Ok so where do I start. I will contact Newham tomorrow to get any images.
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stamfordman
post Tue, 27 Mar 2018 - 22:00
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have you looked on line for pics.

Someone will help with the appeal on disproportionate need to tow.
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Mujahid
post Thu, 29 Mar 2018 - 13:57
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I can't get pics online so I've contacted Newham and they'll send me pics via post.

In the meantime, are there any flaws in the PCN itself?

This post has been edited by Mujahid: Thu, 29 Mar 2018 - 13:58
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