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Contravention 51J
Kizr420
post Sun, 6 Jun 2021 - 19:34
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Hi

Ticket As Attached

This is a lease car

The contravention was for going through a no entry as the road turning right was blocked due to HS2 works going on & road was closed

I have asked the council for Transfer of liability paperwork and am awaiting a reply.

Any more information needed let me know.

Attached File  CCF_000107.pdf ( 1.6MB ) Number of downloads: 89


This post has been edited by Kizr420: Sun, 6 Jun 2021 - 19:47
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post Sun, 6 Jun 2021 - 19:34
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Kizr420
post Fri, 13 Aug 2021 - 12:35
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Fri, 13 Aug 2021 - 10:10) *
QUOTE (Kizr420 @ Thu, 12 Aug 2021 - 20:08) *
Would this apply by any chance?

Schedule 2 to The Road Traffic (Owner Liability) Regulations 1975 (SI 1975/324) is headed:

No, that legislation was abolished years ago, there is a new one called The Road Traffic (Owner Liability) Regulations 2000 but all of that is only relevant to hire agreements that last less than six months. For a long-term lease you cannot transfer liability, but the leasing company can make representations on the ground that it is not the owner for the purposes of the 2003 Act. However to succeed in such a claim, Audi would have to send a copy of the lease agreement to the council and we know that most companies do not send a copy of the lease agreement because they wrongly think this would be a breach of GDPR (it isn't, as this would be a disclosure specifically authorised by law, but their understanding of GDPR is crap).

We know Ealing has started sending Notices of Acceptance to lease and hire companies, so the key issue now is whether Audi sent the lease agreement to the council. So, have you asked Audi what they sent to the council, and have you received a reply?

Also be careful how you word any communications with Audi, if they haven't sent a copy of the agreement to the council, we don't want some helpful sod to send it to them now!


This is what I asked Audi

1. Dates when the PCN were received. The fine arrived into our offices on the 31st March 2021.
2. Dates when they were replied too. We sent our transfer of liability letter to the issuing authority on the 4th April 2021.
3. Were the information below provided to the councils. See below

a statement signed by or on behalf of the vehicle-hire firm to the effect that at the material time the vehicle was hired to a named person under a hire agreement; A transfer of liability letter was sent to the authority on the 4th April 2021 – this letter contains our customers full name, address and contract start/end dates.
a copy of the hire agreement; Unfortunately we cannot send a copy of a customers hire agreement as it contains senstive details that do not apply to the issuing authority – as part of our GDPR procedures these are not sent.
a copy of a statement of liability signed by the hirer under that hire agreement. We only send a transfer of liability letter to the authority – this is not something we currently do by sending them a liability acceptance letter from our customer.

4. Did Audi receive a transfer of liability from the council for the initial PCN’s received. I have attached a copy of the original letter that we received from the authority, on the second page is the representation section which as far as we are aware is not completed.

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cp8759
post Fri, 13 Aug 2021 - 12:38
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OK so at this point it's a no-brainer to carry on as the council is bound to lose.

All you need to do is log an appeal on the tribunal site with "I rely on my formal representations", in 40% of cases they don't contest but if they do, I have a ready-made appeal for this scenario that I can easily adapt to your case.


--------------------
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law. Section 6 of the Interpretation Act 1978 applies to everything I post as it would apply to an Act of Parliament. I am a Conservative party member, this means some people think I am "scum". No, I am not a lawyer. I do not charge any fees, please stop asking me what my fees are.
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Kizr420
post Fri, 13 Aug 2021 - 12:58
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Thanks. Will do that

Knowing on previous occasions Ealing are most likely to contest biggrin.gif
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Kizr420
post Sat, 18 Sep 2021 - 17:12
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Apologies been busy

Seems they are contesting

https://imgur.com/Jrvd90W
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Kizr420
post Sun, 19 Sep 2021 - 17:33
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@cp8759

Apologies
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cp8759
post Sun, 19 Sep 2021 - 18:31
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I will represent you at the tribunal if you wish, to take me up on that send me a PM and also ask the tribunal for an oral hearing.


--------------------
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law. Section 6 of the Interpretation Act 1978 applies to everything I post as it would apply to an Act of Parliament. I am a Conservative party member, this means some people think I am "scum". No, I am not a lawyer. I do not charge any fees, please stop asking me what my fees are.
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cp8759
post Mon, 29 Nov 2021 - 18:45
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Posts: 28,971
Joined: 3 Dec 2010
Member No.: 42,618



Epilogue: https://bit.ly/314hEwl


--------------------
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law. Section 6 of the Interpretation Act 1978 applies to everything I post as it would apply to an Act of Parliament. I am a Conservative party member, this means some people think I am "scum". No, I am not a lawyer. I do not charge any fees, please stop asking me what my fees are.
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