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Insurance commuting cover - should I be happy with this?
TonyS
post Tue, 16 Jul 2019 - 10:31
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Hi,

I've come across an odd one with our car insurance. It will just be covered for the two of us to drive, myself as policy holder and the missus as named driver. We need to have commuting cover for both of us, and business for myself. In the proposal under the named driver details it just has the one relevant question "Will this driver use the car for social, domestic, pleasure and commuting purposes only?", to which I answered Yes. To me that says that commuting should be covered.

However the certificate does not state this, it just says "Use for Social Domestic and Pleasure purposes and use by the Policyholder in person FOR his/her business OR employment, excluding COMMERCIAL travelling."

Worried about this I phoned the insurer (broker really) who assured me that she is in fact covered for commuting, and that any police checks would confirm this. They are supposed to be sending a letter to this effect, but cannot alter the certificate wording.

Should I be concerned?

Thanks, Tony S
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post Tue, 16 Jul 2019 - 10:31
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typefish
post Tue, 16 Jul 2019 - 10:38
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I suppose the first question you'd need to ask is what does the policy booklet say?

There are some insurance companies out there that do not explicitly state that commuting is on the certificate, as it comes under their interpretation of SDP. Which is super confusing, as most insurance companies now state this (as they make money from providing as an extra, commuting coverage!)

This post has been edited by typefish: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 - 10:39
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andy_foster
post Tue, 16 Jul 2019 - 10:46
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IMHO "SD&P" and "SD&P including commuting" both include commuting. "SD&P excluding commuting" does not.


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TonyS
post Tue, 16 Jul 2019 - 11:46
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I just had a quick check and this particular insurer doesn't actually offer anything excluding commuting, the options seem to be (abbreviating) "SDP inc commuting", "SDP and Business" and "Commercial Travelling". My concern arose because our other car with the same insurer specifically says "travel to single place of work" on the certificate, as does my motorcycle policy - but this one doesn't.

However - checking a bit further it actually doesn't change the price to add Business travel for her as well, so that's what I've done.
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Redivi
post Mon, 22 Jul 2019 - 12:00
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QUOTE (andy_foster @ Tue, 16 Jul 2019 - 11:46) *
IMHO "SD&P" and "SD&P including commuting" both include commuting. "SD&P excluding commuting" does not.

We've seen a lot of threads where the OP was mistaken in his belief that SDP included commuting

As the description also includes driving to a railway station to catch a train to work, in my view, there should be an "Are You Sure" warning when a driver that declares an occupation attempts to buy a policy that doesn't cover commuting
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stamfordman
post Mon, 22 Jul 2019 - 16:04
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Commercial travelling is old school speak for travelling salesman(person). So don't worry.
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speedfighter23
post Sun, 4 Aug 2019 - 21:52
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Check out Aviva insurance, they give commuting and driving for business (as in Class A if i remember driving to different places of work or events etc) automatically, I've left Admiral for them.

This post has been edited by speedfighter23: Sun, 4 Aug 2019 - 21:53


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Police Speeding Fines - Police 1 - speedfighter23 0
TFL traffic contraventions 0 - speedfighter23 2
Kensington and Chelsea 0 parking contraventions - speedfighter23 1
Brighton and Hove parking 0 - speedfighter23 1
Private PCN - Private Parking Solutions Limited 0 - speedfighter23 1

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Result Pending:

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Redivi
post Mon, 5 Aug 2019 - 08:18
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Direct Line also includes business travel automatically

Good move to leave Admiral
It treats Speed awareness Courts as if they're Fixed Penalties
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TonyS
post Mon, 5 Aug 2019 - 14:56
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QUOTE (Redivi @ Mon, 5 Aug 2019 - 09:18) *
Direct Line also includes business travel automatically

We were with Direct Line a couple of years ago and they were very good with things like that. Also didn't care which of us was owner/registered keeper etc as lots of things were "policyholder or their spouse". However in common with other insurers they put their prices up for renewals compared to new business. For that reason we moved to Aviva last year. Now it's AA which came out almost 30% less than the Aviva renewal.

Incidentally regarding renewal pricing vs new business, Aviva absolutely denied this. Even though it could be shown perfectly well because changing one digit in our registration gives the exact same make model and age of vehicle - do a new quote with that VRM and the price was something like £150, change it to our actual VRM and it jumped up to £245.
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typefish
post Mon, 5 Aug 2019 - 15:35
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One thing I used to do with Admiral was the different name trick

Having the same VRM, same address, same accident history, same features, same driver profile but different name would result in something stupid such as a £300 cheaper premium

When phoning up to "confirm the renewal" I mentioned this, explained how I found it rather odd that if I cancelled my policy with Admiral, and took out a brand new one with say, Admiral or Elephant, I'd get that price - and got them to crossmatch it and they always honoured it

This post has been edited by typefish: Mon, 5 Aug 2019 - 15:37
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speedfighter23
post Mon, 5 Aug 2019 - 21:08
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Yes I saw the same problem and tried the same trick. Insurance went 300 GBP higher if I was renewing vs. changing my name and starting a new quote, the discount must be for new customers. I called Admiral and challenged them about it, they denied profusely and said no it's because 'we ran a credit check on the other name and this changed the price', absolutely crazy, what sharks I can't believe it's legal to do it. They lowered it to 200 GB difference, but I was really angry by then so I just switched to Aviva, I am much happier than them they ask so many less questions, I don't even have to put my profession to change the price they just ask if i am not a certain listed profession which I said no and all was good! I also did not have to ask for commuting and business use, it was given automatically.

Aviva also lets you pay monthly by credit card interest free, while Admiral charges shark interest rates.

This post has been edited by speedfighter23: Mon, 5 Aug 2019 - 21:10


--------------------
Police Speeding Fines - Police 1 - speedfighter23 0
TFL traffic contraventions 0 - speedfighter23 2
Kensington and Chelsea 0 parking contraventions - speedfighter23 1
Brighton and Hove parking 0 - speedfighter23 1
Private PCN - Private Parking Solutions Limited 0 - speedfighter23 1

Tyre Puncture Pothole Claims:
0 Buckinghamshire Council - speedfighter23 1
0 TFL - speedfighter23 1

Result Pending:

1 Islington Council tyre puncture claim
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Formfeed
post Thu, 15 Aug 2019 - 13:48
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QUOTE (Redivi @ Mon, 22 Jul 2019 - 13:00) *
We've seen a lot of threads where the OP was mistaken in his belief that SDP included commuting


Sorry to bump an old reply but in what way is commuting in order to go to work not a domestic purpose?

I had a look at some threads and I can see some replies saying its not, but I'm curious as to the specific definitions and where they might be found.
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666
post Thu, 15 Aug 2019 - 14:47
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QUOTE (Formfeed @ Thu, 15 Aug 2019 - 14:48) *
QUOTE (Redivi @ Mon, 22 Jul 2019 - 13:00) *
We've seen a lot of threads where the OP was mistaken in his belief that SDP included commuting


Sorry to bump an old reply but in what way is commuting in order to go to work not a domestic purpose?

I had a look at some threads and I can see some replies saying its not, but I'm curious as to the specific definitions and where they might be found.

The definition of 'domestic' can be found in any dictionary. The Concise Oxford says:

"1. relating to a home or family affairs, 2. of or for use in the home ..."

Commuting is clearly not domestic, nor social, and unlikely to be a pleasure.
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post Thu, 15 Aug 2019 - 14:51
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I'm sure my home and family would notice if I stopped commuting.
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TonyS
post Thu, 15 Aug 2019 - 15:41
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Maybe someone whose policy excludes commuting could paste up the wording on their certificate. Our certificate for the car that does not have business cover reads "Use for Social Domestic and Pleasure purposes only including travel TO AND FROM a PERMANENT place of WORK". Interesting that they write "including" rather than "and".

So I don't know a certificate excluding commuting cover would put an explicit exclusion, or different wording or what.
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post Thu, 15 Aug 2019 - 15:48
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I'm struggling with how travelling to work is not part of running a house.
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nigelbb
post Thu, 15 Aug 2019 - 15:49
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When did insurance companies start introducing a "no commuting" clause? It must be a specific exclusion clause as for decades we all had policies that were for Social, Domestic & Pleasure & happily drove to & from work.


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British Parking Association Ltd Code of Practice(Appendix C contains Schedule 4 of POFA 2012 ) & can be found here http://www.britishparking.co.uk/Code-of-Pr...ance-monitoring
DfT Guidance on Section 56 and Schedule 4 of POFA 2012 https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/syste...ing-charges.pdf
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post Thu, 15 Aug 2019 - 15:49
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QUOTE (TonyS @ Thu, 15 Aug 2019 - 16:41) *
[i]Use for Social Domestic and Pleasure purposes only including travel TO AND FROM a PERMANENT place of WORK"


Which also would indicate that travelling to work is actually SDP being that you have SDP and are able to include, not add it.
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TonyS
post Fri, 16 Aug 2019 - 09:02
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QUOTE (nigelbb @ Thu, 15 Aug 2019 - 16:49) *
When did insurance companies start introducing a "no commuting" clause? It must be a specific exclusion clause as for decades we all had policies that were for Social, Domestic & Pleasure & happily drove to & from work.

I couldn't put a finger on the date but going way back I remember that quotations used to ask something like "will it be used for travel to/from work three or more days a week". Can't remember the wording but that "three or more days" applied on a motorcycle proposal. At that time it didn't make it onto the certificate, it was more an issue between you and the insurer similar to annual mileage or where the vehicle is kept overnight. And clearly on that wording an occasional commuting trip would be perfectly fine even if you'd answered "No".

On more recent quotes and proposals it's been a more clear cut, commuting or no commuting question. But since I've always selected "Yes" I don't know what the certificate would say if it's not chosen.
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TonyS
post Fri, 16 Aug 2019 - 09:36
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Another odd one I see raised. It is claimed that giving someone a lift to their work may not fall into the definition of commuting. In that case then what would be needed? It's surely beyond even an insurance company's logic to say that giving your wife a lift to work is "Business".
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