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[NIP Wizard] NIP Received Junction 28-27 M62.
Braddersowl
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 12:19
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NIP Details and Circumstances
What is the name of the Constabulary? -
Date of the offence: - November 2019
Date of the NIP: - 33 days after the offence
Date you received the NIP: - 34 days after the offence
Location of offence (exact location as it appears on the NIP: important): - M62 between Junctions 28 & 27 Westbound
Was the NIP addressed to you? - Yes
Was the NIP sent by first class post, second class or recorded delivery? - First
If your are not the Registered Keeper, what is your relationship to the vehicle? - Usual driver - it's a leased company car
How many current points do you have? - 0
Provide a description of events (if you know what happened) telling us as much about the incident as possible - some things that may seem trivial to you may be important, so don't leave anything out. Please do not post personal details for obvious reasons - Returning from Hull to Bradford, went through smart motorway are from j29 to j26. Recorded speed on the NIP is 60mph and it states the speed limit at the time was 50 mph. I do recall seeing a camera flash but wasn't sure at the time whether it was my car that had been caught.

NIP Wizard Responses
These were the responses used by the Wizard to arrive at its recommendation:
Have you received a NIP? - Yes
Are you the Registered Keeper of the vehicle concerned (is your name and address on the V5/V5C)? - No
Is the NIP addressed to you personally? - Yes
Although you are not the Registered Keeper, were you the keeper of the vehicle concerned (the person normally responsible for it) at the time of the alleged offence? - Yes
Were you driving? - Yes
Which country did the alleged offence take place in? - England

NIP Wizard Recommendation
Based on these responses the Wizard suggested that this course of action should be considered:
  • The law requires you to provide the information requested in the Section 172 notice within the 28 day period, naming yourself as the driver. If you are considering obtaining formal legal advice, do so before returning the notice.

    You should note that there is nothing to be gained by responding any earlier than you have to at any stage of the process. You are likely to receive a Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty (COFP) and further reminder(s). If you want to continue the fight, you should ignore all correspondence from the police until you receive a summons. You need to understand from the outset that while you will receive much help and support from members on the forums, you will need to put time and effort into fighting your case and ultimately be prepared to stand up in court to defend yourself.

Generated by the PePiPoo NIP Wizard v3.3.2: Mon, 09 Dec 2019 12:15:16 +0000

I received an email from my company with a copy of the NIP they had received and returned. It was dated 19/11/19 (18 days after the alleged offence) and had been sent with my company's name on it, the the car lease company - which makes me think it was the first communication from the WY Police. If so, I assume this would make it out of time?
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post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 12:19
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Jlc
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 13:40
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QUOTE (Braddersowl @ Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 12:19) *
I received an email from my company with a copy of the NIP they had received and returned. It was dated 19/11/19 (18 days after the alleged offence) and had been sent with my company's name on it, the the car lease company - which makes me think it was the first communication from the WY Police. If so, I assume this would make it out of time?

Almost certainly went to the lease company first. The 14 days only applies to the first one - unless your company can show you the v5 with their details on then it's not out of time.

Regardless, the driver identity request is still valid and must be responded to.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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Braddersowl
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 15:04
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Sorry, I probably wasn't clear enough. What I'm saying is that the NIP appears to have been sent to the lease company outside of 14 days, but with my company's name on it. I'm going to ask my company for a contact at the lease co to confirm.

It doesn't make sense otherwise, why would WYP send a NIP in 14 days, get my company's full details then send it back to the lease company? - they'd simply send the follow up to the company address.

I will respond to the driver request, will just wait until nearer the 28 day limit before doing it.

This post has been edited by Braddersowl: Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 15:06
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NewJudge
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 15:26
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You need to find out who holds the V5C for the vehicle and ask them when they received their NIP.
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Slapdash
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 16:45
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QUOTE (Braddersowl @ Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 15:04) *
Sorry, I probably wasn't clear enough. What I'm saying is that the NIP appears to have been sent to the lease company outside of 14 days, but with my company's name on it. I'm going to ask my company for a contact at the lease co to confirm.

It doesn't make sense otherwise, why would WYP send a NIP in 14 days, get my company's full details then send it back to the lease company? - they'd simply send the follow up to the company address.

I will respond to the driver request, will just wait until nearer the 28 day limit before doing it.


It rather depends on how your company operates its leased vehicles. It is perfectly possible that the lease co would name the company as keeper. The company then name you.

Equally if the lease co have been made aware (and they may well not be) that you are the normal keeper they may have nominated you.

It seems also uncertain that the lease co have simply named the company. It is not unknown for V5c to be in the company name at the lessors address.

In any event since the NIP is not in your name you have nothing to respond to - unless you are responding on behalf of the company.

This post has been edited by Slapdash: Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 16:47
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Braddersowl
post Mon, 16 Dec 2019 - 16:57
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The lease company are saying the letter dated 19 Nov was the first communication and they have date stamped it as received 20 November.

Just to reiterate (from an earlier reply) - I was the driver and have now received a NIP iin my name asking me to name myself.
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NewJudge
post Mon, 16 Dec 2019 - 17:20
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Before you consider any defence due to a suspected late NIP you must be sure that whoever holds the V5C received their NIP outside 14 days. You should also make sure their details on the V5C are correct in every respect (so as not to provide any reason for the police to need extra time tracing them) and check the "docref" date on the V5C (at the bottom of page 2 I think). This is the date the DVLA records were updated and should be compared to the offence date. You may care to enquire with the issuing authority why the first NIP was late.

This post has been edited by NewJudge: Mon, 16 Dec 2019 - 17:21
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Braddersowl
post Mon, 16 Dec 2019 - 17:44
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QUOTE (NewJudge @ Mon, 16 Dec 2019 - 17:20) *
Before you consider any defence due to a suspected late NIP you must be sure that whoever holds the V5C received their NIP outside 14 days. You should also make sure their details on the V5C are correct in every respect (so as not to provide any reason for the police to need extra time tracing them) and check the "docref" date on the V5C (at the bottom of page 2 I think). This is the date the DVLA records were updated and should be compared to the offence date. You may care to enquire with the issuing authority why the first NIP was late.


Good point and I wish I'd waited another hour before posting...it turns out that the lease company are not the V5C holders, so I think its extremely likely that that company received the NIP within 14 days, given the date of offence 01 Nov and date of NIP to company leasing is 19 Nov, I can't see WYP only sending out the 1st notice on 16 Nov, and getting it back, processed and another NIP out by 19 Nov.

So, wait a few more days then return the form naming myself and hope for a speed awareness course - seems the only option.
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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 17 Dec 2019 - 09:47
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Why would you wait a few more days?
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