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Private Car Park Planning Permission
PCNDodger
post Thu, 22 Mar 2018 - 13:21
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Hi Folks,

Not an active PCN thankfully so I appreciate this might not be at the top of your reply list. However, I thought I'd tap into the fountain of knowledge that exists on this site out of interest and see what you all think
of this;

Many moons ago now, long before I discovered this extremely helpful site, I did receive a PCN from an operator in a private car park. I won't name them but if I said they were a prolific user or ANPR cameras it may
narrow it down somewhat. Anyway, no window 'ticket', just the NtK through the post which I had no intention of paying, (I won't go into the specifics but I believed it to be unjustified). I appealed to the operator and
obviously received a rejection with a POPLA code. I then appealed to POPLA which fortunately was successful.

Now, while researching my POPLA appeal I decided to try and contact the landowner to see if they would have the PCN cancelled for me. I should state here that the car park in question doesn't serve a retail park or
anything, it is a speck of land between two roads that you can fit about 20 cars on. While Googling 'who owns this particular car park' I stumbled across the planning permission submission for the land to be used as
such. The local authority had granted the planning permission but with several conditions. Two of which were along the lines of;

1- The land should be resurfaced and parking bays marked out as per the submitted planning drawing within (I think it was) 3 months. However, even to this day I don't believe this has been done. It is an unmade
surface with no markings at all.
2 - Because the local authority did not want the car park to be used as a commuter car park, it was not allowed to open between 06:30 and 09:30 on weekdays. However, the signs on site clearly stated open 24 hours
and clearly offered tariffs between these times.

Because I won at POPLA I didn't get to raise these points, but was wondering if anyone here thought they would be good points to raise, assuming I'd lost at POPLA and if it went to court. Or even at the initial and/or
POPLA appeals had I known about it then?

Additionally, I'm aware planning permission is required for the installation of signs and ANPR cameras (this appeared to be in order in this instance) but if it wasn't, I assume that might also be worth raising, especially
if you were 'caught' by ANPR.

I'd be interested to hear everyone's thoughts on this as I haven't seen a thread which comments on planning permission.

PCND.
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post Thu, 22 Mar 2018 - 13:21
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Redivi
post Thu, 22 Mar 2018 - 14:17
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Not Aire Street Leeds by any chance ?
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The Rookie
post Thu, 22 Mar 2018 - 15:38
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All points are good to raise, if only to show the general 'don't give two hoots for the law' mindset of the PPC's. Not least that they are contracting to provide parking at a specifically prohibited time.


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PCNDodger
post Thu, 22 Mar 2018 - 16:23
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Whoops, seems I put this in the wrong forum.... Please forgive my newbie ignorance!

Redivi - It's not, but I do visit friends in Leeds and think I know the one you mean, near the train station? (I get the train there so no need to park). Is that one in a similar position with planning conditions? The one
I'm on about was actually away from home some time ago. I can't recall what it was called and to be honest I think it might even have been redeveloped now. I think there were 5 or 6 planning conditions it was
ignoring so maybe it got shut down. I never did find out who owned it as the personal details were redacted from the planning docs and I didn't find it anywhere else.
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bama
post Thu, 22 Mar 2018 - 17:25
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and check that (the more expensive) Business Rates are being paid for the car park.


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Which facts in any situation or problem are “essential” and what makes them “essential”? If the “essential” facts are said to depend on the principles involved, then the whole business, all too obviously, goes right around in a circle. In the light of one principle or set of principles, one bunch of facts will be the “essential” ones; in the light of another principle or set of principles, a different bunch of facts will be “essential.” In order to settle on the right facts you first have to pick your principles, although the whole point of finding the facts was to indicate which principles apply.

Note that I am not legally qualified and any and all statements made are "Reserved". Liability for application lies with the reader.
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Richy320
post Sat, 24 Mar 2018 - 19:49
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It’s the responsibility of the council to enforce any conditions on their granted planning permissions, it makes no difference to the parking issue at hand.

How long ago was the permission granted?


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whitewing
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 07:41
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QUOTE (Richy320 @ Sat, 24 Mar 2018 - 19:49) *
It’s the responsibility of the council to enforce any conditions on their granted planning permissions,

But as a concerned citizen you could help them by letting them know about the non-compliance...
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The Rookie
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 09:25
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QUOTE (whitewing @ Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 08:41) *
QUOTE (Richy320 @ Sat, 24 Mar 2018 - 19:49) *
It’s the responsibility of the council to enforce any conditions on their granted planning permissions,

But as a concerned citizen you could help them by letting them know about the non-compliance...

And badgering your local councillor!


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
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Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
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bill w
post Mon, 26 Mar 2018 - 09:50
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On similar, but slightly different lines, here's one from the Grimsby local paper about a pub carpark, where the planning permission for the pub stated that the car park had to be available for the villagers in perpetuity.

"Laceby Parish Council have also voiced their objection to the introduction of the parking charges, saying that when original planning permission was granted in 1980 to knock together the The Nags Head and the Waterloo, a condition was put in place stating that the car park would be open to the community of Laceby "in perpetuity"

Looks like the Landlord has engaged Parking Eye, whose cameras clock everyone going in to the pub car park, even when passing through it to the supposedly public one behind the black gates.

GSV showing the original blue "P" sign HERE

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