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Pcn issued in Richmond very little evidence (1 photo), Parked with one or more wheels on or over a footpath.
jimbojones123
post Tue, 13 Mar 2018 - 20:27
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Hi there I received a pcn last week after arriving in a job in Richmond and had ran in and was filling out a visitors scratch card and when returning to the vehicle caught a parking enforcement officer in the final moments of issuing a ticket, he was in a rush as the evidence shows as he only got one photo of the pcn attached to my windscreen I tried to explain i was receiving a visitors permit, but he was hastily on his way! Please have a look at the evidence and see what you can advise me as to knocking up an appeal!
Thanks guys


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post Tue, 13 Mar 2018 - 20:27
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stamfordman
post Tue, 13 Mar 2018 - 20:35
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Sadly you're been done for parking on the pavement. You had to park in a bay and go get the permit.

Did you definitely have wheels on the pavement?

Loading is an exemption but not in this case...

However, I see pavement parking is allowed in those street so maybe there's a traffic order that may come to the rescue and it's the wrong contravention:

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4607398,-0....3312!8i6656



This post has been edited by stamfordman: Tue, 13 Mar 2018 - 20:43
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jimbojones123
post Tue, 13 Mar 2018 - 21:22
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Yes that's the road it's a nightmare, so narrow and not many spaces yes I had 2 wheels on the pavement, I was right behind the bmw pictured on your street view, and would loading tools into the job not be a valid excuse? Surely that is a valid reason
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stamfordman
post Tue, 13 Mar 2018 - 21:25
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Unloading would have been but it seems you told the CEO you were getting a permit. They may well have this in their notes. However, you could say you were both getting a permit but were intending to unload first - where you by the door? I take it you were going to move the van to a bay.

This post has been edited by stamfordman: Tue, 13 Mar 2018 - 21:26
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jimbojones123
post Tue, 13 Mar 2018 - 21:38
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The ceo didn't speak to Me, he just walked away. As I said I was carrying a tool bag and materials, I was working in the second house on the, I put tools down in hallway when I noticed the ceo he was so quick and cat like possibly hiding as they do In Richmond! And yes I did move it to a residents bay after I filled out the voucher, I still have a copy of the scratch card.
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cp8759
post Tue, 13 Mar 2018 - 21:55
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I've made an FOI request for the council resolution, if it lifted the restriction from the whole street then it's an easy win.

If not, as stamfordman says, you need to argue that the loading exemption applies. However the exemption is more restrictive than the "normal" unloading exemption, the legislation provides that the footway parking restriction does not apply if the vehicle is parked

for the purpose of loading or unloading goods, and—
(i)the loading or unloading of the vehicle could not have been satisfactorily performed if it had not been so parked; and
(ii)the vehicle was not left unattended at any time while it was so parked.


I'm not sure you can show the vehicle was not left unattended.


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jimbojones123
post Wed, 21 Mar 2018 - 18:31
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Need to knock up an appeal tonight, any advice that should help my case quotes etc, I'm going to say I was loading the vehicle and had no other choice then to park on kerb slightly.
Thanks
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cp8759
post Wed, 21 Mar 2018 - 18:41
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QUOTE (jimbojones123 @ Wed, 21 Mar 2018 - 18:31) *
Need to knock up an appeal tonight, any advice that should help my case quotes etc, I'm going to say I was loading the vehicle and had no other choice then to park on kerb slightly.
Thanks

Normally if they reject (which I'm sure they will) they will re-offer the 14 day discount, I will have had the resolution from the council sent back to me before then.


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jimbojones123
post Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 18:55
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Bump!
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PASTMYBEST
post Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 19:10
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QUOTE (jimbojones123 @ Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 18:55) *
Bump!


You have missed the 14 day so hang fire a couple of days for advice


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jimbojones123
post Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 19:15
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No when checking the appeal online the deadline is tomorrow the 24th I'm just writing an appeal will post asap
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jimbojones123
post Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 19:42
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How's this fair?

Dear Sir/Madam, I received a PCN, code 622, for parking with one or more wheels on or over a footway or any part of the road other than a carriageway whilst attending a gas emergency in Richmond, as I arrived and began to unload my van of tools and equipment the homeowner said they would get me a visitors scratchcard and keep an "eye on the van" during the process of filling out said scratchcard and me unloading a CEO issued me a pcn, I tried to explain the circumstances but it was too late, therefore I ask that you cancel the pcn on this occasion on de minimis.

Regards Mr ...........
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stamfordman
post Sat, 24 Mar 2018 - 11:26
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I've done a redraft. Do you have a worksheet/evidence of the job - if detailed as an emergency that would help.

Dear Sir/Madam,

I received a PCN no xxxxxxx, code 622, for parking with one or more wheels on or over a footway or any part of the road other than a carriageway. I was attending a gas emergency at no xx, xxxxxroad/street. I arrived outside the premises in this narrow street and started to unload my van of tools and equipment and I understand that unloading my work tools is an exemption to the code 622 contravention. Mindful of the need to repark once the tools were inside, the homeowner said they would get me a visitor parking voucher. I was completing the voucher and was about to relocate the vehicle when the CEO issued the PCN.

I would kindly ask you to cancel the PCN on the basis of the unloading exemption and on the basis that i took no longer than necessary to do this before moving the vehicle to a parking place away from the premises where I was attending the emergency.

Regards Mr ...........

This post has been edited by stamfordman: Sat, 24 Mar 2018 - 11:28
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PASTMYBEST
post Sat, 24 Mar 2018 - 11:42
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QUOTE (jimbojones123 @ Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 19:15) *
No when checking the appeal online the deadline is tomorrow the 24th I'm just writing an appeal will post asap


14 days from the 8th is the 21st, so if the website says otherwise get a screenshot


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hcandersen
post Sat, 24 Mar 2018 - 11:54
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? 'Appeal online'
Do you mean that the discount and discount related challenges may be made until 24th? Nothing wrong there, the authority may extend the period but what they may not do is to reduce it or state other than 14 days on the PCN.

And as the vehicle concerned is a liveried van we must therefore check who is the registered keeper, so OP, is this you? If not, what is the background e.g. are you employed and drive a supplied company vehicle? If so, and on the not unreasonable presumption that a challenge would be refused, we need to take a view as to what the registered keeper would do if they received a NTO because if you are not the registered keeper and are driving an employer's vehicle then as far as parking procedures are involved your direct involvement stops if the authority reject a challenge.
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cp8759
post Thu, 12 Apr 2018 - 12:11
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So I've had a very interesting reply from the council:

Re: Request for information under the Environmental Information Regulations
2004
Your request for information which was received on 13 March 2018 has been
considered. Please find our response below.
Your requests:
I would like to request a copy of the resolution passed under section 15(4) of the Greater London Council (General Powers) Act 1974, which was passed to lift the footway parking restriction from Beatrice Road, Richmond, TW10 6DT
Our response:
Your request has been refused as we consider it manifestly unreasonable to provide the information required.
Please refer to the legal Appendix 1 below for our detailed legal reasoning and your right of appeal.

Appendix 1

Detailed legal reasoning for refusal
In accordance with recent Information Commissioners Office decisions, we are treating this as an environmental information request under the Environmental Information Regulations 2004 (EIRs) and this letter acts as a Public Interest Refusal Notice.
We believe the information requested is covered by the exception R.12 (4) (b) manifestly unreasonable.
The ICO confirm in their guidance on this exception that it can be used when:
• the request is vexatious;
• or the cost of compliance with the request would be too great.
We believe that your request engages the second limb of this exception. In this context the exception is broadly equivalent to the Section 12 exemption of the FOIA.
However, the exception of regulation 12 (4) (b) has a wider scope; when considering whether a request is manifestly unreasonable there is no appropriate costs limit and public authorities can also take into account whether the request would divert resources.
The information requested at dates back to the 1980s. To comply with this request Would prove a considerable task as this information is likely to have been archived and possibly on the premises of a third party for the management of council archive material.
We have therefore gone on to consider the public interest test.
Public Interest in favour of disclosure
Regulation 12 (2) states there is a presumption in favour of disclosure with all environmental information. As well as the general principles of transparency and accountability we appreciate that providing this information would give the public a better understanding of the decision to impose parking restrictions.
Public interest in favour of maintaining the exemption
We are mindful that there is an increased pressure on Council resources at a time when we are trying to make significant efficiencies, with reduced government funding. Although this may have not been your intention, to comply with the request would distract staff from their core functions and further add to the pressure on these services. Therefore, we consider it disproportionate to comply with your request.
In accordance with the Environmental Information Regulations 2004 this letter acts as a Refusal Notice.


At this point I would appeal on the basis that the footway parking restriction has been lifted from the entire road, and put burden on the council to show otherwise. Given how old the resolution is, the likelihood is that it lifts the restriction from the entire street (that seems to be the case with older resolutions), and if the council fail or refuse to produce it, you can invite the adjudicator to make an adverse inference against the council.


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hcandersen
post Thu, 12 Apr 2018 - 14:56
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OP, have you submitted your challenge ( pl don't call it an appeal, this is a defined term and we're not there yet)?

AND who is the registered keeper of the van?

@cp

They're in for a shock.

Dear Mr FOI,
Re*******

Thank you for your reply dated **** in which you have refused my request under the grounds of 12(4)(b), that is to say 'manifestly unreasonable' because this would inter alia 'distract staff from their core functions'.

The purpose of this letter is to give you a heads up that this 'distraction' is unavoidble because your colleagues in the parking enforcement authority will be needing this information in order to pursue a penalty charge notice issued on the basis that the resolution, assuming one even exists, applies only to the parking places marked on the footway in the road.

The existence and content of any resolution must have been examined by relevant council officers as recently as when the traffic order which designated the parking places in the road was being considered.



I'd send parking a copy.
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cp8759
post Thu, 12 Apr 2018 - 15:08
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Well the first thing they've got wrong is that it wasn't a request under the Environmental Information Regulations 2004, as a resolution under section 15(4) of the Greater London Council (General Powers) Act 1974 cannot reasonably fall within the definition of "environmental information" as defined here: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2004/33...gulation/2/made

Maybe the person who deals with FOI requests is more clued up than the person who deals with the FOIA, I've re-submitted under FOI so we'll see what comes back. Ultimately if they can't produce the resolution, they can't enforce the restrictions either.

This post has been edited by cp8759: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 - 15:09


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hcandersen
post Thu, 12 Apr 2018 - 16:24
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The issue is not that the absence of a resolution permits parking on the footway, it's the opposite.

The point here, as with all similar cases, is that there is no power under the RTRA to disapply s14. Therefore if the local authority have marked a parking place on the footway it is open to a motorist to believe that the footway parking prohibition has been disapplied.

But to what extent?

If only the extent of the parking places, then their limits must be marked with the necessary signs.

But there are no signs.

Therefore only 3 possibilities exist:
1. The local authority have wrongly placed parking places on the footway and wrongly permit motorists to park within these; or
2. The road markings are correct because a resolution has been passed for this area alone, but the local authority have failed to place the required traffic signs; or
3. The road markings are correct and signs are not needed because the limits of the permitted area extend beyond the limits of the parking places.

Both 1 and 2 are council errors, the first being ultra vires the second a failure to comply with LATOR.

Being the kind-hearted person that they are, the OP has dismissed the first two possibilities because they have (misplaced) faith in the infallibility of the council. They therefore rely on 3, and as no footway parking signs are in view IT FOLLOWS that they are within a larger area of permitted footway parking INCLUDING where they were parked.

IMO, unless the authority can produce the necessary resolution limiting footway parking to the extent of the parking places and produce lawful authority to dispense with the traffic signs which are otherwise required then they are b******d.
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stamfordman
post Thu, 12 Apr 2018 - 17:03
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This one has got HCA revved up. I think the loading exemption for an emergency could be sufficient but there is the footway stuff to hit them with too. I think we'll be advising an appeal to the NTO if necessary.
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