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Stansted Airport Mid stay
kerl
post Mon, 27 Nov 2017 - 14:46
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Hi,

I got charged £23 for supposedly using the mid stay Stansted car park for 2 hours and 11 minutes - that is 11 minutes more than the 2 hours limits for £1.5. I have complained to the airport but they refuse to refund or otherwise help. Communication is not being helped by grammar mistakes making airport replies difficult to comprehend. What should be my next steps now? Complains say I should talk with Civil Aviation Authority but looking around Manchester Airport Group which runs the car park is member of the International Parking Community. If anyone can offer some advice please do so.

Here is the full, long, boring story with the precise dates obfuscated - I have already send that to the complains. They supplied me few more replies after that which has provided me with additional ammunition - that is they send me a picture of the full terms and conditions sign. They appear to be the same as the ones in the website, in a big non lit sign, with tiny black letters against a dark blue background, on the bus only lane, dealing mostly with pre-booked parking. I have uploaded the pictures they provided me with at https://drive.google.com/open?id=1gWNjequpt...Vm41WuBnig9b5Y3 . Web term and conditions at http://www.stanstedairport.com/terms-and-c...and-conditions/ - I have yet to compare them side by side.


On XX I dropped off two elderly relatives that do not speak English to the Stansted airport using the mid stay car park facility. The airport staff provided us with the gate number upon baggage drop off and the train stop they should take to get there . With this information and the airport map I was able to guide them over the phone once they were past security. I then returned to mid stay car park and left paying £1.5
On XX+7 I dropped my elderly and non English speakers wife's parents, with my pregnant wife escorting me. Again I used the mid stay car park. However on this occasion at baggage drop off the airport staff refused to provide us with the gate number without any explanation - even after explaining them that the passengers do not speak English. We asked again at the security reception but again we were not provided with the gate without any explanation. Asking again another member of the airport staff that was helping with the queues at Ryanair baggage desks he cited security reasons for being unable to provide us this information. At this stage I was completely taken by surprise with the behaviour of the airport staff especially given a completely different experience less than a week ago. Eventually once the passengers went past security we had to guide them over the phone regarding what to watch in the monitors and how to ask for help by the staff until some fellow passengers kindly provided them with help.
Having now spend a significant amount of time and being aware that the 2 hours period for £1.5 was coming to a close myself and my pregnant wife headed back to the car park. My wife though had to use the bathroom while we were waiting for the bus, and with the bathrooms very busy we had to take the next bus.
After getting back to our car and paying at the gate I was met with the £23 charge. It did not feel right but with a 2 hours journey ahead and a pregnant passenger who had already spend 2 hours in the first part of the journey and 2 hours at the airport we went ahead with our journey.
The next day checking the receipt from the car park, I saw I was charged £23 for a supposed overstay of 11 minutes. Supposedly I parked from 13:54 until 16:04. Checking my dash camera footage which has GPS synced clock I noticed that I entered the car park at 13:58. 11 minutes of supposed overstay resulting to a £23 especially given the circumstances was outrageous therefore I used the online form to complain to the airport.
Starting from XX+11 the airport replied and after some back and forth I was told that the actual reason they could not provide us with the gate number was that it was not confirmed at the time. Had we been made aware of that fact at the time we were at the airport we would have acted accordingly and not spend additional time needlessly.
On XX+21 reply the airport declined my request for refund claiming the charge of £23 is correct due to 10 minutes of overstay. However in the reply on the XX+30 the grace period is mentioned as 15 minutes and that should be enough to get to the barrier due to the distance between the free set down zone from the barrier. This is not true as I have visited the mid stay car park on several occasions and the free set down zone moves around thus entry/exit driving time varies considerably especially if there is bus/car traffic and congestion due to inconsiderate parking on the road instead of the parking bays as I have encountered from time to time. More confusingly, the same reply indicates the grace period does not apply when paying at the barrier. This defies the whole purpose of claiming having a grace period.
Asking further clarifications I received a reply on XX+33 which states: 'If we placed a grace period for those who pay at the barrier, unfortunately you would be over the price band and will be charge the daily rate'. As the second part of this reply is unclear what it actually means I have asked and I wait for clarification.
I have asked repeatedly to be provided with the terms and conditions for parking at mid stay car park. I have been pointed to either to the website or at the signs at the barriers. The website covers none of the matters discussed. The signs point to a phone number at the customers service building. I have called the phone number 01279 680128 and the staff confirmed they do not hold an updated copy of the terms and conditions to provide the customers with. Note the sign at the barrier is not lit therefore to actually read the small letter information during the night on my latest vist I had to exit my vehicle and get really close with a camera.

Given all these events it is therefore established at least that
the airport staff on XX+7 failed to provide us with information that would have saved us time
the time measuring device used by the car park is not accurate
the terms and conditions for mid stay parking, in particular regarding grace period and how it varies if paid at barriers, are not available to the car park users
the responses from the airport customer support services are unclear and difficult to understand

Therefore due to airport negligence, hidden terms and conditions, inaccurate time measuring equipment, and substandard level of service, please take appropriate to refund the £23 for the use of the mid stay car park on X7.




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post Mon, 27 Nov 2017 - 14:46
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PASTMYBEST
post Sun, 3 Dec 2017 - 22:20
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Can't speak for Stanstead, but at Manchester if you put you ticket into the machine it charges for the time there i:e the time you collect on entry to the time you pay to exit.
You would still have been charged £23 just allowed time to walk to your car and drive to the barrier

Your only argument might be the time you spend looking for a parking space,
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DancingDad
post Sun, 3 Dec 2017 - 23:04
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QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Sun, 3 Dec 2017 - 22:20) *
Can't speak for Stanstead, but at Manchester if you put you ticket into the machine it charges for the time there i:e the time you collect on entry to the time you pay to exit.
You would still have been charged £23 just allowed time to walk to your car and drive to the barrier

Your only argument might be the time you spend looking for a parking space,


The difference being that if had paid at a machine before finding car and driving to barrier, he may paid a minute or so early and still been within grace time when passing the barrier.
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kerl
post Tue, 6 Feb 2018 - 11:40
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After a lot of back and forth from CAA->trading standards->citizens advice bureau->bank my credit card provider yielded after 3 rejections and decided to foot the bill - claiming they could not chargeback the merchant cause pin & chip was used.

THEIAS claim they do not know this parking operator and refer to BPA - when pointed to the IPC website where it is listed they went silent.

Next steps are to complain to IPC and if they also go silent to DVLA. Since these guys are not willing to stick to their own code of practice they should not be allowed to operate. It is outrageous CAA fined them millions about a year ago for their business practices only to cancel the fine based on their word.
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The Rookie
post Tue, 6 Feb 2018 - 12:16
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I still think you don't understand the meaning of grace periods and are completely wasting your time. as for the IPC, complete waste of time and the DVLA will almost certainly agree with what I've said.



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kerl
post Tue, 6 Feb 2018 - 13:43
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Perhaps I do not understand the meaning of grace period but this multimillion pound company so far failed to prove me wrong. It certainly helps that they fail to mention the grace period anywhere in their own terms and conditions. Or do not reveal who is actually the parking association they are member of when asked so repeatedly.
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The Rookie
post Tue, 6 Feb 2018 - 14:00
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Why would they have to mention grace periods in their T&C's, if it were it would no longer be grace but contractual! Besides as you don't appear to have read the T&C when you parked anyway that would be irrelevant. IN my opinion you were charged the correct amount for the time parked, an amount clearly displayed on the T&C's.

How have they so far failed to prove you wrong, they don't have to, you have to prove them wrong, something you haven't yet done in my opinion.

As for which parking association, they don't have to, plus there is no need for them to be in one for the operation you describe.


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
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Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 8-0 PPC's
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kerl
post Tue, 6 Feb 2018 - 14:17
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A grace period is mentioned in the code practice of the parking association they are member of. The same code of practice says they should reveal this information to whoever asks for it. They have to be member of a parking association and follow the code of practice in order to be able to access DVLA database for ANPR as they do.

The terms and conditions state airport responsibility as a valid reason for a successfull appeal for a charge and I have demostrated that.

Assuming the grace period is for the time needed to drive from/to entrance/exit to/from the car parking bay + payment, by not applying grace period for barrier payment and having only at barrier payment machines they got themselves rid of the grace priod requirement.

I have alrady proven via GPS records their clocks are wrong.

I believe I understand what you are saying. However I disagree there was an overstay, and even if there was the airport has a share and the whole level of service offered is substandard. If they do not care about code of practices customer complains and the rest they may as well make it clear so everyone knows what they are dealing with. There are other car park operators that clarify in their terms and coditions the grace period and barrier payment without any problems. Surely MAG can do the same for their car parks.



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The Rookie
post Tue, 6 Feb 2018 - 16:03
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As they weren't accessing the DVLA database, they didn't need to be members

The Grace period is for the issuing of extra charges, in your case you were charged the amount of the period of stay, you seem to be suggesting that every pay on exit car park should allow 10 minutes on every up-charge point for grace, good luck with that, not going to happen.

Why assume the grace period is for that? The Grace period is copied from that applied in council car parks for the issuing of PCN's, what you had could not in any way be compared to a council PCN or a normal private @parking Charge Notice'.

I haven't said there was an overstay, I'm saying you were charged the advertised amount for the duration of your stay, a grace period doesn't apply to that at all in my opinion it relates to issuing penalties as in council PCN or a Private penalty as supported in Beavis by the Supreme court.


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 8-0 PPC's
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