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Meteor Parking 12 month permit valid for 11 months!, SOld 12 month permit, it ran out after 11 months, got ticket
mistrey
post Mon, 22 Aug 2011 - 18:11
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Hi,

I'm checking this out on behalf of my manager. She purchased, through work and from Meteor, a 12 month parking permit for a SouthEastern Railways carpark near our work. The ticket was applied for and late in August last year she received, by email a temporary permit from 1st-15th September which stated that permanent permit was in the post. On 8th Sept we received a letter which was dated 7th September and contatined the parking permit. My manager then put the permit in her car and we forgot about it until early august, when she asked her PA to check when the permit was due for renewal. The letter was checked and as it was dated 7th Sept we thought that we had until the end of august to change it as the PA remembered that we got sent a temporary permit whilst waiting for it.

On 18th August, she received a parking ticket stating that she didn't have a valid ticket. An inspection of the permit revealed that it ran out on 17th August!!! We paid for a full year!

I semt off the usual letter, pointing out their mistake (the appeal was to them and not magistrates court) and they have today replied that we should have checked that we had received a full years permit at the time that it was delivered, and basically there was no point whinging about it now! To quote the letter
QUOTE
"I do appreciate your comments however the expiry date is clearly stated on the permit itself and it is the customer’s responsibility to ensure the permit is renewed before the current one expires. I appreciate there was a delay with the permit being sent however the start date of the permit was 17th August 2010 and this was clearly printed on the permit. If you felt there was a delay at the time of purchase, you should have contacted us at the time rather than assuming the permit ran until a different date than stated on the permit. "


Unbelievable! She would obviously rather not pay £90 to these scumbags, however, I'm going to need to convince her of the options. Anyone got any ideas?

Thanks
Kate




--------------------
First they came for the crack users; but I said nothing. I was not a crack user. Then they came for the heroin users. But I said nothing - I was not a heroin user. Then they came for the cannabis growers. But I said nothing - I was not a cannabis grower. Then they came for the Antisocial Youth. But I said nothing - I was not young or antisocial. Then they came for me. And there was no-one to speak out for me. [after Pastor Niemoller]

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post Mon, 22 Aug 2011 - 18:11
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emanresu
post Mon, 22 Aug 2011 - 18:19
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On the basic facts they are correct. You paid for a permit and the date was on it. If your manager was short-changed she had plenty of time to take it up with them. However.....

You could put them to prove that the amount the want for the "ticket" is a fair representation of their loss and invite them to prove this at court. Most likely they will duck it and use "debt" collectors instead.

It could be slightly difficult when it comes to renewing it as any money sent could be offset to the "fine" first and a balance to be paid for a current permit. You'll just need to be very careful when you re-order the permit for 2011/2012. Ask for a pro-forma invoice with an identifiable invoice number on it.
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bama
post Mon, 22 Aug 2011 - 18:51
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did they mention railway byelaws on their 'ticket' or in their letter ?


--------------------
Which facts in any situation or problem are “essential” and what makes them “essential”? If the “essential” facts are said to depend on the principles involved, then the whole business, all too obviously, goes right around in a circle. In the light of one principle or set of principles, one bunch of facts will be the “essential” ones; in the light of another principle or set of principles, a different bunch of facts will be “essential.” In order to settle on the right facts you first have to pick your principles, although the whole point of finding the facts was to indicate which principles apply.

Note that I am not legally qualified and any and all statements made are "Reserved". Liability for application lies with the reader.
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mistrey
post Mon, 22 Aug 2011 - 20:42
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No mention of bylaws anywhere. It really gets my goat to just get her to pay it. They short changed us, if they were a reputable company they would admit their mistake and give up. Actually they are a parking company so clearly they are disreputate!!


--------------------
First they came for the crack users; but I said nothing. I was not a crack user. Then they came for the heroin users. But I said nothing - I was not a heroin user. Then they came for the cannabis growers. But I said nothing - I was not a cannabis grower. Then they came for the Antisocial Youth. But I said nothing - I was not young or antisocial. Then they came for me. And there was no-one to speak out for me. [after Pastor Niemoller]

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southpaw82
post Mon, 22 Aug 2011 - 20:43
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QUOTE (mistrey @ Mon, 22 Aug 2011 - 21:42) *
It really gets my goat to just get her to pay it.


Why would she pay it?


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Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
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mistrey
post Mon, 22 Aug 2011 - 21:00
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Mainly because she would worry about being taken to court (she is in a very senior position). It just seems like a great [Mod edit] they have going here: Sell something for 12 months, make it valid for a few weeks less, you then get payment for 2 weeks for free and then can also gain £90 from a parking ticket!


--------------------
First they came for the crack users; but I said nothing. I was not a crack user. Then they came for the heroin users. But I said nothing - I was not a heroin user. Then they came for the cannabis growers. But I said nothing - I was not a cannabis grower. Then they came for the Antisocial Youth. But I said nothing - I was not young or antisocial. Then they came for me. And there was no-one to speak out for me. [after Pastor Niemoller]

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SchoolRunMum
post Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 00:25
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QUOTE (mistrey @ Mon, 22 Aug 2011 - 22:00) *
Mainly because she would worry about being taken to court (she is in a very senior position). It just seems like a great XXEDITXX they have going here: Sell something for 12 months, make it valid for a few weeks less, you then get payment for 2 weeks for free and then can also gain £90 from a parking ticket!






But come on, get real - Meteor don't take people to Court. This isn't a real fine so why on earth are you both seemingly in such a tizz about it and even contemplating paying?!

I repeat southpaw82's question - why would she pay it?

When you registered here on pepipoo, you surely read the sticky threads first at the top here on this forum? Or maybe not as you have used the S-word which I have had to edit out of the above quote! If you somehow missed the sticky threads (the most important thing to look at on first joining a forum!) then you want to read 'Dealing with tickets from private parking companies' and 'PPC letters' (and so does your Manager!):

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showforum=60

You MUST tell her that the bogus PCN is just rubbish which you just have to ignore, like you would a phishing email. The fake 'ticket' is about as enforceable as a Burger King flyer being put on your windscreen and then Burger King insisting that meant you had to buy one of their dodgy meals every day for a month!

Read the info, watch the Watchdog clip and tell your Manager to read & watch it too. She must simply file all the letters in a drawer marked 'IGNORE' unless it's a company car in which case she must tell the Fleet Manager to file the letters in a drawer marked 'IGNORE' (or in the bin is fine as well). Only the driver can possibly be alleged to be 'liable' for this 'ticket' which is a fake, unenforceable PCN anyway (see the Watchdog clip) so this is NOTHING for anyone to lose any sleep over.

Tell her - do not reply to them, do not 'appeal' (that would be like replying to a phishing emailer, HAHA!!) and most importantly DO NOT PAY.

[Mod edit]

This post has been edited by Fredd: Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 09:04
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Alexis
post Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 09:49
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What's the big deal? She doesn't legally owe the money and Meteor have never ever taken anyone to court, where they'd have virtually no chance of winning.

Just expect 3 or 4 debt collection letters, which can be ignored. Then that will be the end of it.

What does being in a 'senior position' have to do with anything? Even if she was taken to court and lost and didn't pay within 28 days (why on earth?), having a CCJ doesn't affect your job.

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mistrey
post Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 17:15
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The permit is paidfor by our employers. If they decide to persue the people who they invoiced for the ticket, something they have suggested by telephone, then, this wouild caujse a problem. You and I know that they can't legally do this, but we also know that if you pay for 12months and get only 11, something which they have admitted, then it is, that word which for some reason is banned on here...[Mod edit]


--------------------
First they came for the crack users; but I said nothing. I was not a crack user. Then they came for the heroin users. But I said nothing - I was not a heroin user. Then they came for the cannabis growers. But I said nothing - I was not a cannabis grower. Then they came for the Antisocial Youth. But I said nothing - I was not young or antisocial. Then they came for me. And there was no-one to speak out for me. [after Pastor Niemoller]

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mistrey
post Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 17:30
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QUOTE
Or maybe not as you have used the S-word which I have had to edit out of the above quote!


Schoolrunmum, perhasps you should go and check all the other threads on here which mention the s word, as clicking onto 2 others in the past few days, you appear to have missed


--------------------
First they came for the crack users; but I said nothing. I was not a crack user. Then they came for the heroin users. But I said nothing - I was not a heroin user. Then they came for the cannabis growers. But I said nothing - I was not a cannabis grower. Then they came for the Antisocial Youth. But I said nothing - I was not young or antisocial. Then they came for me. And there was no-one to speak out for me. [after Pastor Niemoller]

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ManxRed
post Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 17:36
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Hi mistrey,

Maybe you should read this.

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=46974

If you have seen the s-word in other posts then they are either very old posts, or the Mods have missed them (they are only human).


--------------------
Sometimes I use big words I don't understand in an effort to make myself sound more photosynthesis.
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Fredd
post Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 17:39
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QUOTE (mistrey @ Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 18:30) *
Schoolrunmum, perhasps you should go and check all the other threads on here which mention the s word, as clicking onto 2 others in the past few days, you appear to have missed

@mistrey, you play by our rules or you go and play somewhere else - your choice.


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mistrey
post Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 18:35
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OMG you really removed my post because I pointed out indiscrepancies in your policing of the rules? How petty.

I thought that this site was about mutual help not having pops at people who are also only human and forgot a rule that they read 4 years ago.


--------------------
First they came for the crack users; but I said nothing. I was not a crack user. Then they came for the heroin users. But I said nothing - I was not a heroin user. Then they came for the cannabis growers. But I said nothing - I was not a cannabis grower. Then they came for the Antisocial Youth. But I said nothing - I was not young or antisocial. Then they came for me. And there was no-one to speak out for me. [after Pastor Niemoller]

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southpaw82
post Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 22:14
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QUOTE (mistrey @ Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 19:35) *
OMG you really removed my post because I pointed out indiscrepancies in your policing of the rules? How petty.

I thought that this site was about mutual help not having pops at people who are also only human and forgot a rule that they read 4 years ago.


Nevertheless, unless you pay for the site (you don't, by the way) you are required to obey the rules or leave. End of discussion, final word, period, no more chances. I hope that's clear enough.


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Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
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Alexis
post Wed, 24 Aug 2011 - 09:08
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QUOTE (mistrey @ Tue, 23 Aug 2011 - 18:15) *
The permit is paidfor by our employers. If they decide to persue the people who they invoiced for the ticket, something they have suggested by telephone, then, this wouild caujse a problem. You and I know that they can't legally do this, but we also know that if you pay for 12months and get only 11, something which they have admitted, then it is, that word which for some reason is banned on here...[Mod edit]


Only the driver can be party to the contract they allege was agreed to/breached at the station car park.

They would need to construct a new letter template if they wanted to pursue an unconnected party, which is not how these people operate.

Sounds like just a hollow threat on the telephone (which would breach OFT guidelines).

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emanresu
post Wed, 24 Aug 2011 - 13:16
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mistrey

While we all agree with your view of this type of operation - for legal reasons its best not to express those views in an open forum.

But if we get back to the issue in hand your boss will need to advise others of the nature of the ticket i.e. its unenforceable rubbish dressed up to look like a Council fine. There is a word for that kind of behaviour but it escapes me for a moment.

Who does she need to advise?

1. As I said before, watch that when the renewal is ordered that they don't keep the money for the "fine". Get the company to refer everything from Meteor back to her.

2. It sounds as if she has a company car. If that is the case, make sure the lease company does not pay it and add a handling charge.

3. If she wants to fight back, make sure everyone she knows is aware of the nature of the ticket and their business method.

If you click on #1 in my signature, I'm advising on a very similar issue with Euro Car Parks. wink.gif

I'd advise your boss to treat it in the same way
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