PCN - Lost the Letter! Options

[steveyell]

Hi,

We have received a PCN from HX Car Park Management LTD. I read on another forum they are an off shoot of ANPR LTD, and may be litigious.

Unfortunately we have lost the notice, it refers to parking around 21st July. The detail is that my OH bought a ticket, and thought it was 2 hrs, but was only 1hr, and stayed approx 1 1/2 hrs.

The Car park signage is attached - there were 2 signs of note.

Given we have lost the notice (yeah, really helpful!), is there any risk in writing to say this is the case, that we want to appeal, and can you send us another copy of the notice? What would you recommend? Once again, thanks for you help folks.

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[ostell]

Here's some info about them. Looks like they keep away from court but that could change.

The advice on the BMPA website (link above) is to ignore and wait for further correspondence. File the paperwork away.

[SchoolRunMum]

Under these circumstances I would just ignore them and their demands and debt letters, unless in the end they try court (as per the BMPA advice).

[steveyell]

Under these circumstances I would just ignore them and their demands and debt letters, unless in the end they try court (as per the BMPA advice).

OK - So I did ignore all demands and letters as per advice above, and we have just received a claim form from the Northampton County Court Business Centre claiming damages for Gladstones Solicitors on behalf of HX Car Park Management Limited for a total of £237.67 in relation to parking charges.

Obviously feeling slightly out of our depth here, any help from those on here would be gratefully received - clearly we need to mount a defence against this. The deadline for responding to court if I have understood correctly is 6th December, and the letter suggests we can respond to the claim online.

What next folks?

Thanks,

Steve.

[ostell]

Did you get a letter before claim from their solicitors or the company themselves?

This post has been edited by ostell: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 - 20:56

[southpaw82]

It would be extremely useful to see their particulars of claim, which will normally be on the claim form itself, sometimes in a separate document.

[SchoolRunMum]

My advice was - and the BMPA advise the same - ignore the PPC's 'demands and debt letters' unless they try court.

Not to ignore the pre-court Letter before Claim from solicitors, Gladstones.

Did you get that and ignore that too? Or didn't they send one?

Show us that letter too and any attachments that might have been with the LBC, as well as the Particulars of Claim as stated on the Claim (left hand side).

[nosferatu1001]

Issue date of the form please

Then go online and acknowledge the claim. Nothing more. Do not contest jurisdiction. No, it won’t be held in Northampton

Please answer all questions above and confirm you’ve acknowledged.

[steveyell]

OK - first point - SchoolRunMum - thanks for your advice in August - totally agree with what you are saying - we just didn't recognise the pre-court letter from Gladstones was a different scenario to the other letters.

Some further answers as follows:

Issue Date: 17 Nov 2017.

Claimant: HX Car Park Management Limited

Particulars of Claim (on the claim form - not checked for pre-court letter yet): Have removed our reg and date

The driver of the vehicle registration (Our Reg) (the "vehicle") incurred the parking charge(s) on (Date)
for breaching the terms of parking on the land at Westgate Car Park Horton Street Halifax
The Defendant was driving the Vehicle and/or is the Keeper of the vehicle.
AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS
£160 for Parking Charges/Damages and indemnity costs if applicable, together with interest of £2.67 pursuant
to s69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at 8% pa, continuing to Judgement at £0.04 per day.

I'm going to have to dig out the other letters (pre-court letter etc) and will try to post up. Do you want to see the actual claim form? Should I still anonymize in terms of name address and reg number?

Thanks once again,

Steve.

Oh - another question for nosferatu1001:

Can you go online and just acknowledge the claim? On the form it is set out as if you need to say you are defending/contesting jurisdiction? Just don't want to get this bit wrong.

[steveyell]

Ok - have just gone ahead and done the acknowledgement of service. I've said we are defending all of the claim.

Thanks.

[SchoolRunMum]

We don't want to see the claim form, but the LBC would be useful, to see if it was in any way compliant with the new pre-action protocol.

You will also need to show us your draft defence based on the zillions of other Gladstones defences you can find on any similar thread recently.

[nosferatu1001]

Issue date of 17/11 means you have 33 days for the court to receive your printed, signed, scanned to pdf and EMAILED defence. You will NOT submit via paper or through the mcol site.

Plenty of time for you to read up on the defences. Loads around here, and on MSE forum newbies thread post 2

[steveyell]

Issue date of 17/11 means you have 33 days for the court to receive your printed, signed, scanned to pdf and EMAILED defence. You will NOT submit via paper or through the mcol site.

Plenty of time for you to read up on the defences. Loads around here, and on MSE forum newbies thread post 2

Ok thanks for the help so far folks - I'll hit the books, so to speak, and will come back with a draft defence for comments.

What do we think is the success rate these days - do we have any sense of that - are defences generally succeeding, or partly succeeding?

I recognise that cases may be vastly different - just wondered even so if someone is keeping a tally on wins and losses.

[Umkomaas]

Are you going to show us this - as requested by SchoolRunMum?

We don't want to see the claim form, but the LBC would be useful, to see if it was in any way compliant with the new pre-action protocol.

The LBC has taken on a greater significance since 1/10/17.

[nosferatu1001]

Pretty good against gladstones. But it needs work, all the way through the process.

[southpaw82]

Ok thanks for the help so far folks - I'll hit the books, so to speak, and will come back with a draft defence for comments.

For Gods sake don’t make it one of the epic tones so beloved of some on here. Wholly inappropriate for small claims.

[SchoolRunMum]

What do we think is the success rate these days - do we have any sense of that - are defences generally succeeding, or partly succeeding?

In the high nineties success rate here (I know for a fact it's 99% win rate on MSE in 2017, because I've kept records of any losses there). Especially high expectations v BW Legal or Gladstones, so take heart.

[emanresu]

In the high nineties success rate here (I know for a fact it's 99% win rate on MSE in 2017, because I've kept records of any losses there). Especially high expectations v BW Legal or Gladstones, so take heart.

There appear to be two types of appeals. The succinct that deals with the facts and drills down to the main issues and guts the opposition with a stiletto knife like argument. And then there is the cut and thrust of the MSE blunderbus that anticipates, comments upon and describes every eventuality. The "onion" principle.

The latter appears successful as it bores the other side to death.

Horses for courses.

This post has been edited by emanresu: Sun, 26 Nov 2017 - 17:10

[southpaw82]

And then there is the cut and thrust of the MSE blunderbus that anticipates, comments upon and describes every eventuality. The "onion" principle.

The latter appears successful as it bores the other side to death.

In terms of defences rather than appeals that approach runs the risk of an adverse costs order. The defence should be concise not a rambling exposition of every matter that might possibly be relevant, rather than what is actually pleaded by the claimant.

[SchoolRunMum]

POPLA appeals are like that - and scattergun ones work like a dream - but I agree with you about defences.