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parking ticket when parked on my owned parking space
captainkirk
post Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 18:43
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I have received 3 parking tickets for parking in my own parking space at my apartment, the parking company say i should display a permit, they say i can opt out which i have done but still want me to pay for parking in my legally own spot? is this legal opr enforceable as i feel i should just say take me to court as surely they cannot win???
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post Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 18:43
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cabbyman
post Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 18:55
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It depends upon the wording in your lease. What does it say about 1) You parking and 2) the landlord's right to make 'regulations' for the effective management of the property?


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captainkirk
post Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 19:11
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I own the flat and the space, parking company werre policeing my spot without my permission (on behalf of the management company) i have live there for 8yr but only after copmplaining have they told me i could opt out entirely and they wont police my space which i have now done but they still insit i pay these tickets??

also i have informed them several time i do not have a permit, (not that i should need one to park in my own space) they say they sent me one? which i have never received ?? i should ask for proof of postage, but in any effent why should i as is my own space? any advise would help as fell that i should let them go to court if they so wish and to let the judge decide as i cannot believe i would lose??
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Jlc
post Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 19:13
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Winning at court is not guaranteed.

Which parking company?


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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captainkirk
post Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 19:14
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just to add my spartment is leasehold (999) yrs in case it makes a difference

Care parking
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cabbyman
post Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 19:19
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.

This post has been edited by cabbyman: Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 19:34


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cabbyman
post Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 19:35
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QUOTE (captainkirk @ Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 19:14) *
just to add my spartment is leasehold (999) yrs in case it makes a difference

Care parking


QUOTE (cabbyman @ Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 18:55) *
It depends upon the wording in your lease. What does it say about 1) You parking and 2) the landlord's right to make 'regulations' for the effective management of the property?


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captainkirk
post Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 19:45
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understood will check the leasehold but in any event shouldnt the freeholder have a duty to inform the owners that the parking policeing is not compulsary and that we can opt out?
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cabbyman
post Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 20:27
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It depends entirely upon what your lease says. That's why I have now mentioned it three times.


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Churchmouse
post Wed, 21 Nov 2018 - 14:16
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QUOTE (captainkirk @ Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 19:11) *
I own the flat and the space, parking company werre policeing my spot without my permission (on behalf of the management company) i have live there for 8yr but only after copmplaining have they told me i could opt out entirely and they wont police my space which i have now done but they still insit i pay these tickets??

It's not even difficult to lose in court, if you're not up to the challenge or don't comply with directions and deadlines. On top of that, judges do make mistakes. So consider your next move carefully--and the best way to do that is to completely understand the strength of your defence. Have you reviewed the requested paragraphs of your lease document?

--Churchmouse
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captainkirk
post Tue, 11 Dec 2018 - 17:55
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ok i now have the lease, its say several things some that support my parking and some contradictory

1st good one it states i have the

1.the right to park roadworthy motor cars (but not vans lorries or commercial vehicles) in the parking space
2. the car aprking space allocated for the exclusive use off the lessee shall be used individuallyfor the parkingof a single roadworthy motor car only and not at any time whatsoever as a parking space for commercial vehcile or trailer of any discription and use of any visitor parking space will be only for a short stay parking by visitors or invitees to the property.

but has another clause which say

3.at his own expense observe all conditions all conditions on any planning or permissions relating to the property and all sanitary and other regulations required to be observed by lawful authority whether by the owner or occupier on or in connection with or in relation to the property or any part thereoff

4 in using the communal areas and the access ways neither the lessee nor any member of the lessee household are to
(a) contravene any reasonable parking or trafic regulation arrangements displayed on notices there?

there is also a conenenat that says the lessee paying the rent and observing and performing the said covenants conditions and provisions herein contained shall and may peaceably possess and enjoy the property for the term without lawful interruption from or by the lessee or any person rightfully claiming through under or in trust for it

so as you can see, not sure which clause takes precident?? there doesn't,t seem to be any requirement for the manament company to give notice of any intention to invoke rules or permits etc?

any adviee would be welcome??

This post has been edited by captainkirk: Tue, 11 Dec 2018 - 17:56
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cabbyman
post Tue, 11 Dec 2018 - 19:29
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Your no. 4 refers to using the communal areas and the access ways.

Your exclusive parking space is outwith that definition.


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nosferatu1001
post Wed, 12 Dec 2018 - 11:37
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Indeed. 4 does not apply to your exclusive parking space

You should now be telling your MC to INSTRUCT their agent to cease trespassing on your demised space, and cancell all unlawfully issued "parking charges", else you will start proceedings agaisn the MC for breach of your lease, trespass to goods and land, and harassment. You will also seek an injunction against them and their agent from entering your exclusive parking space. This is their only warning.
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Eljayjay
post Mon, 17 Dec 2018 - 18:08
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As the lease talks about "the car parking space allocated for the exclusive use off the lessee", no party to the lease can make it available to the parking operator for the purposes of its business because, to do so, would derogate from the right already granted to you to its EXCLUSIVE use. If you have never heard of the legal principle of non-derogation from grant, I would suggest that you google it.

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cabbyman
post Mon, 17 Dec 2018 - 18:17
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Pages 1 & 2, in the link below, give a concise summary of your arguments:

https://www.cilex.org.uk/pdf/SA%20Unit%2010...Web%20Final.pdf


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SchoolRunMum
post Mon, 17 Dec 2018 - 21:09
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QUOTE (nosferatu1001 @ Wed, 12 Dec 2018 - 11:37) *
Indeed. 4 does not apply to your exclusive parking space

You should now be telling your MC to INSTRUCT their agent to cease trespassing on your demised space, and cancell all unlawfully issued "parking charges", else you will start proceedings against the MC for breach of your lease, trespass to goods and land, and harassment. You will also seek an injunction against them and their agent from entering your exclusive parking space. This is their only warning.


Do the above, and add that if the parking firm sue over these unlawful charges you will add the MC to the case and will require them to attend court to explain their position in allowing this third party to cause you a repeated private nuisance and to interfere with your exclusive amenity, and then compounding the matter by refusing to exercise their clear right to tell their agent to cancel the meritless PCNs and to cease and desist with this trespass.
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Churchmouse
post Tue, 18 Dec 2018 - 12:52
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QUOTE (captainkirk @ Tue, 11 Dec 2018 - 17:55) *
ok i now have the lease, its say several things some that support my parking and some contradictory

1st good one it states i have the

1.the right to park roadworthy motor cars (but not vans lorries or commercial vehicles) in the parking space
2. the car aprking space allocated for the exclusive use off the lessee shall be used individuallyfor the parkingof a single roadworthy motor car only and not at any time whatsoever as a parking space for commercial vehcile or trailer of any discription and use of any visitor parking space will be only for a short stay parking by visitors or invitees to the property.

but has another clause which say

3.at his own expense observe all conditions all conditions on any planning or permissions relating to the property and all sanitary and other regulations required to be observed by lawful authority whether by the owner or occupier on or in connection with or in relation to the property or any part thereoff

4 in using the communal areas and the access ways neither the lessee nor any member of the lessee household are to
(a) contravene any reasonable parking or trafic regulation arrangements displayed on notices there?

there is also a conenenat that says the lessee paying the rent and observing and performing the said covenants conditions and provisions herein contained shall and may peaceably possess and enjoy the property for the term without lawful interruption from or by the lessee or any person rightfully claiming through under or in trust for it

so as you can see, not sure which clause takes precident?? there doesn't,t seem to be any requirement for the manament company to give notice of any intention to invoke rules or permits etc?

any adviee would be welcome??

Paragraph 3 also has nothing to do with this situation. It refers to compliance with planning and permissions issued by governmental authorities. Even if it was applicable, like the other restrictions in the lease, violation of such restrictions results in a breach of the lease--not the breach of an irrelevant third-party parking contract.

--Churchmouse
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