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Who is policing the police?
cp8759
post Wed, 17 Nov 2021 - 10:06
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Heard this on the radio last night https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0011lfr (it's half an hour but worth the listen)

Before hearing this, I thought it would only be FMOTL / sovereign citizens / criminals and other undesirables who would not call the police even if in need of help. Now, I'm not so sure any more, there does seem to be a systemic problem.

Thoughts?


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post Wed, 17 Nov 2021 - 10:06
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klx250s
post Wed, 17 Nov 2021 - 15:15
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Wed, 17 Nov 2021 - 11:06) *
Heard this on the radio last night https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0011lfr (it's half an hour but worth the listen)

Before hearing this, I thought it would only be FMOTL / sovereign citizens / criminals and other undesirables who would not call the police even if in need of help. Now, I'm not so sure any more, there does seem to be a systemic problem.

Thoughts?


I spent 58 years having respect for the police and also keeping my nose clean, the only time I have ever been in a police station was to pick up the forms for a firearms certificate (years ago), then I made the massive mistake of asking them a question about why they did a certain thing like they did, you would not believe how they escalated the situation to the point that we ended up at the IOPC (who were worst than useless). Two years later this is still an on going situation, the amount of arrogance off them to members of the public is staggering, they will just plain lie to you and anyone else safe in the knowledge that there really is no one to pull them up about their behaviour.
I´m actually sat here fuming just thinking how they treated me, you never get bands singing about ´´F%%K The Firebrigade´´ for a reason.
There is a very large disconnect between the public and the police that is widening each year.
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Richy320
post Wed, 17 Nov 2021 - 15:44
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Years ago I was driving in Wales and I pulled out to overtake a car driving particularly slowly. As I did so, I noticed the flash of his brake lights just as I pulled out and I ended up clipping the rear corner of his car. Ordinarily cut and dried you would think, I hit the back of his car therefore it was my fault despite him hitting the brakes as I pulled out. Unbelievably, whilst we were both sitting in the police car that he insisted were called, the other driver admitted brake testing me as I went to overtake him. The policeman wrote in his little black book “I braked to slow him down,” a phrase that has stuck with me for life. Having admitted to the police that he brake tested me I decided to contest the inevitable driving without due care prosecution that followed. In court, the policeman had no recollection of hearing the phrase or noting it down and it was nowhere to be seen in his notebook, despite me watching him write it down.

Never had any respect for the police after that. Still haven’t. Sometimes on here we see comments like ‘why would they lie? They have no reason to lie’. No idea why they do, but I know that the police do lie!


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notmeatloaf
post Wed, 17 Nov 2021 - 16:08
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They just need to remove the structure where Professional Standards Departments handle complaints. Effectively they are a bunch of old boys who seem to do everything to dismiss the complaint. They seem to be universally useless. Either a senior serving officer at a different station should investigate, or police forces should be paired with each investigating the other's complaints.

I have said before but when I made a complaint and went in "for a chat" after telling me they'd lost the CCTV - "first time ever" apparently - it became clear they'd searched for me on the PNC including all my driving licence information - they were to quote "surprised there was nothing on there". I asked them how they'd feel if I read through their entire medical record if I was investigating a minor complaint they'd made. No answer.

Unfortunately the police seem happy to throw away public trust rather than hold bad offficers accountable for their actions. And like others, there is no way I would have said that ten years ago.
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cp8759
post Wed, 17 Nov 2021 - 17:40
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Well it's easy to come up with solutions:

Require all misconduct complaints to be investigated by the IOPC.
Remove the right of the CPS to take over and discontinue private prosecutions taken out against police officers.
Require any complaint of criminality against an officer to be investigated either by the IOPC, or by a different force acting under IOPC supervision (I'm not sure the IOPC would be equipped to handle a murder enquiry).

The problem seems to be that at the moment the police investigate themselves and if the investigation is fair and firm then it's all fine and dandy, but if it's not then there is no redress for the complainant, literally none at all.


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klx250s
post Wed, 17 Nov 2021 - 18:22
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Wed, 17 Nov 2021 - 18:40) *
Well it's easy to come up with solutions:

Require all misconduct complaints to be investigated by the IOPC.
Remove the right of the CPS to take over and discontinue private prosecutions taken out against police officers.
Require any complaint of criminality against an officer to be investigated either by the IOPC, or by a different force acting under IOPC supervision (I'm not sure the IOPC would be equipped to handle a murder enquiry).

The problem seems to be that at the moment the police investigate themselves and if the investigation is fair and firm then it's all fine and dandy, but if it's not then there is no redress for the complainant, literally none at all.


´´Require all misconduct complaints to be investigated by the IOPC´´,,,,oh to be as innocent and naive as you lol.
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DancingDad
post Thu, 18 Nov 2021 - 12:38
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It's a question that has been asked since the Romans.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Not sure anyone has ever found an answer that satisfies all.
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