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[NIP Wizard] 2 NIPs within 1 hour with mitigation??
MickMackPaddyWac...
post Sun, 7 Jan 2018 - 03:01
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NIP Details and Circumstances
What is the name of the Constabulary? -
Date of the offence: - December 2017
Date of the NIP: - 5 days after the offence
Date you received the NIP: - 6 days after the offence
Location of offence (exact location as it appears on the NIP: important): - M6 NORTHBOUND (BETWEEN JUNCTION 16-17) BETCHTON, UNITED KINGDOM
Was the NIP addressed to you? - Yes
Was the NIP sent by first class post, second class or recorded delivery? - First
If your are not the Registered Keeper, what is your relationship to the vehicle? -
How many current points do you have? - 3
Provide a description of events (if you know what happened) telling us as much about the incident as possible - some things that may seem trivial to you may be important, so don't leave anything out. Please do not post personal details for obvious reasons - received 2 NIPs in the post this morning. both from Cheshire police. both alleged offences where on 31/12/17, one at 5.15am (Northbound) 58mph in temp 50, and the other at 6.15an (southbound) 59mph in temp 50.
i was on the motorway at these times and do not dispute the speeds alleged. however, there are mitigating circumstances that i wish to be taken into account.
i have Bladder Cancer. i was 1st diagnosed in August 2015, and have had 2 further recurrences since.
since being diagnosed in have been under going a course of treatment, that is still on going, i have further sessions booked in a couple of months.
this treatment has several side effects, one of which is sudden, painful urges to urinate and an inability to "hold on" too long without sever discomfort.
both these NIPs i received have a location very close to sandbach services on the M6.
i was suffering a water infection (also a side effect of my treatment) on that morning and had to stop at Sandbach in both directions. and on both occasions my need was very painful and urgent. it was this urgency that caused me to stray over the speed limit in my haste to get to the services.
the motorway was empty and there was no sign of any workers (it was 5am & 6am on New Years Eve).
as i said, i would like these circumstances to be taken into account.
do i have mitigating circumstances and what kind of consideration is given to such circumstances by the courts


NIP Wizard Responses
These were the responses used by the Wizard to arrive at its recommendation:
Have you received a NIP? - Yes
Are you the Registered Keeper of the vehicle concerned (is your name and address on the V5/V5C)? - Yes
Did the first NIP arrive within 14 days? - Yes
Although you are the Registered Keeper, were you also the keeper of the vehicle concerned (the person normally responsible for it) at the time of the alleged offence? - Yes
Were you driving? - Yes
Which country did the alleged offence take place in? - England

NIP Wizard Recommendation
Based on these responses the Wizard suggested that this course of action should be considered:
  • The law requires you to provide the information requested in the Section 172 notice within the 28 day period, naming yourself as the driver. If you are considering obtaining formal legal advice, do so before returning the notice.

    You should note that there is nothing to be gained by responding any earlier than you have to at any stage of the process. You are likely to receive a Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty (COFP) and further reminder(s). If you want to continue the fight, you should ignore all correspondence from the police until you receive a summons. You need to understand from the outset that while you will receive much help and support from members on the forums, you will need to put time and effort into fighting your case and ultimately be prepared to stand up in court to defend yourself.

Generated by the PePiPoo NIP Wizard v3.3.2: Sun, 07 Jan 2018 03:01:19 +0000
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post Sun, 7 Jan 2018 - 03:01
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Jlc
post Sun, 7 Jan 2018 - 08:56
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It won't be straightforward.

You can ask the Police to consider the circumstances but they probably say only a court can make such decisions.

Without the factors you mention we'd normally advise that it's also unlikely the offences would be considered as one. (Given the different directions and time between)

So that would likely require you to take the matter to court. You are probably aware of the Alex Ferguson case - slightly different but he travelled along the hard shoulder with a desperate need for the toilet.

A strict defence of duress (necessity) would require you to show there was a imminent threat to life or serious injury - that doesn’t seem appropriate here. The court does have discretion though and can consider special reasons not to endorse or discharge.

Those offences would normally see 1 CoFP (3 points £100) and a course (no points, around £100) - those are lost if you opt for court. The court would usually fine according to income and there are prosecution costs and the surcharge to consider.

I'd also add that the small excesses would have made negligible different to the journey time - what the court would infer from that is debatable. Also, there's a discussion about whether you should consider alternative arrangements for travel and mitigation should issues occur if at all possible.

This post has been edited by Jlc: Sun, 7 Jan 2018 - 08:58


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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glasgow_bhoy
post Sun, 7 Jan 2018 - 10:04
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Just my opinion here- you might manage to use that mitigation once, but to use it twice within an hour might make it look like your using it as an excuse. I'm not saying this is the case, but it could come across that way.

If you have a smartphone with Google Maps, get onto your timeline and save copies of your movements that morning. The maps will show stops at Sandbach twice and indeed any other services you stopped at during your journey. Anything you have which can prove you stopped at Sandbach will make the mitigation much more plausible.

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cp8759
post Sun, 7 Jan 2018 - 16:45
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I think the recurrence might create a bit of a problem here. If it had been a one off it would be different, but it is arguable that once you know the problem might occur suddenly while you're driving on the motorway, you should refrain from driving altogether.

As JLC says, if you simply name yourself as the driver you should be offered a course and a fixed penalty, this will see you walk away with 3 points (and £200 out of pocket). Even with mitigation, you're not likely to do better in court; while with very solid arguments you might get away with little or nothing for the first offence (let's say an acquittal or an absolute discharge), the second offence would probably be dealt with in a more "standard" way which would probably cost you over £600 just in costs if you want to defend it and go to trial (+fine, points, victim surcharge and so on).

Of course, it would cost you nothing to ask the police to consider the two offences together, the worst that can happen is they'll decline / ignore your request. Just remember you shouldn't "challenge" them in any way or they may take that as an indication that you wish for the matter to be dealt with at court. I would suggest you reply to the NIPs identifying yourself as the driver, outlining your predicament, accepting responsibility for the excess speed and asking whether in the circumstances they would consider dealing with the two instances as a single offence.


--------------------
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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