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PCN-, 53J contravention appeal
Piactus
post Thu, 9 Jul 2020 - 15:17
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Hello all,
I would like to find out if there is anyone who knows how I can successfully appeal this PCN.
Contravention occurred as stated on notice and I received this today.

It was my first time in the area, I didn’t see the signage and only realised after my sat navigation had directed me into the road.

Please find a copy of the PCN attached. Edit -
having trouble attaching this however it states and I quote

“The council believes that a penalty charge is payable with respect to the above vehicle for the alleged traffic contraventions

54J Failing to comply with a restriction on vehicles entering a pedestrian zone (camera enforcement)

In place: Alverston Gardens SE25 by selhurst road

On:1/7/2020
At : 14:39:43

The alleged contravention was detected by camera/operator CR999 and is supported by reported footage.”


First time in the area didn’t see the signage and came out after I realised that I had been misdirected by my sat navigation.

I will appreciate any assistance on this please.

Thank you 🙏🏾
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post Thu, 9 Jul 2020 - 15:17
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Piactus
post Tue, 28 Jul 2020 - 07:54
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Sun, 26 Jul 2020 - 19:26) *
The council has completely and utterly failed to consider the representations, so for now I would register the appeal with "Full grounds of appeal to follow in due course should the respondent contest this matter" and tick the boxes for "the alleged contravention did not occur" and "the penalty exceeds the amount due in the circumstances of the case".

If the council does contest the case it will upload its evidence onto the tribunal's appeals portal as a series of PDF files, if this happens you'll need to download them and post them on here and I'll type up the appeal for you.





I have indicated that I would like to have a personal hearing type.
I’m not sure if this is compulsory or Am I able to state that a postal hearing is okay?
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cp8759
post Tue, 28 Jul 2020 - 12:59
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QUOTE (Piactus @ Tue, 28 Jul 2020 - 08:54) *
I have indicated that I would like to have a personal hearing type.
I’m not sure if this is compulsory or Am I able to state that a postal hearing is okay?

You can change to a postal hearing at any stage, having a personal hearing is entirely up to you.


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Piactus
post Tue, 28 Jul 2020 - 14:13
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Tue, 28 Jul 2020 - 13:59) *
QUOTE (Piactus @ Tue, 28 Jul 2020 - 08:54) *
I have indicated that I would like to have a personal hearing type.
I’m not sure if this is compulsory or Am I able to state that a postal hearing is okay?

You can change to a postal hearing at any stage, having a personal hearing is entirely up to you.


Thank you
I will indicate postal
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Piactus
post Thu, 13 Aug 2020 - 10:31
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Having completed the form that I would like to appeal, the council has now sent me the case evidence regarding the appeal.

Kindly advise me what my next options are as I have to put in my appeal now.

I have included the pages of the documents sent to me by post online (please note that the images have been uploaded in ascending order from bottom/last image up) and these evidence can be found in
https://ibb.co/album/wZwHLj

This post has been edited by Piactus: Thu, 13 Aug 2020 - 19:39
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PASTMYBEST
post Thu, 13 Aug 2020 - 10:56
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So what did you submit as an appeal. And you need to upload the council evidence in some sort of order All of one document together and the right way up so we can read it


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Piactus
post Thu, 13 Aug 2020 - 19:25
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QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Thu, 13 Aug 2020 - 11:56) *
So what did you submit as an appeal. And you need to upload the council evidence in some sort of order All of one document together and the right way up so we can read it


Hi
I only completed the form indicating that I wanted to appeal.
I haven't written any formal appeal.
Apologies for the confusion.

I will check the documents uploaded again but it was in order the last time I checked.

This post has been edited by Piactus: Thu, 13 Aug 2020 - 19:27
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cp8759
post Fri, 14 Aug 2020 - 12:33
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The documents from the council will all be in PDF format on the tribunal's online portal, download them and put them in a google drive, dropbox or one drive folder please.


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Piactus
post Mon, 17 Aug 2020 - 20:59
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Fri, 14 Aug 2020 - 13:33) *
The documents from the council will all be in PDF format on the tribunal's online portal, download them and put them in a google drive, dropbox or one drive folder please.



The council have not uploaded any thing online I have checked every single day since Friday.

They sent me documents in the post which I uploaded here.
The whole file sent to me was uploaded online. I will see if I can convert it to PDF and upload here thank you
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Piactus
post Tue, 18 Aug 2020 - 06:57
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QUOTE (Piactus @ Mon, 17 Aug 2020 - 21:59) *
QUOTE (cp8759 @ Fri, 14 Aug 2020 - 13:33) *
The documents from the council will all be in PDF format on the tribunal's online portal, download them and put them in a google drive, dropbox or one drive folder please.



The council have not uploaded any thing online I have checked every single day since Friday.

They sent me documents in the post which I uploaded here.
The whole file sent to me was uploaded online. I will see if I can convert it to PDF and upload here thank you





Please find a link to the Documents sent to me in the post
Drop box

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/uyiftdimfh1gh15/...9PwnPYKV8a?dl=0
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PASTMYBEST
post Tue, 18 Aug 2020 - 08:36
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QUOTE (Piactus @ Tue, 18 Aug 2020 - 07:57) *
QUOTE (Piactus @ Mon, 17 Aug 2020 - 21:59) *
QUOTE (cp8759 @ Fri, 14 Aug 2020 - 13:33) *
The documents from the council will all be in PDF format on the tribunal's online portal, download them and put them in a google drive, dropbox or one drive folder please.



The council have not uploaded any thing online I have checked every single day since Friday.

They sent me documents in the post which I uploaded here.
The whole file sent to me was uploaded online. I will see if I can convert it to PDF and upload here thank you





Please find a link to the Documents sent to me in the post
Drop box

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/uyiftdimfh1gh15/...9PwnPYKV8a?dl=0


Think there should be a lot more than that, you may feel its not needed or that it is elsewhere in the thread, but put it all together so it is easier for people to help


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cp8759
post Tue, 18 Aug 2020 - 21:11
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I'll write your appeal for you, but please download the PDF version of all the council evidence from the appeals portal and post it in your dropbox.


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Piactus
post Mon, 24 Aug 2020 - 04:44
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Tue, 18 Aug 2020 - 22:11) *
I'll write your appeal for you, but please download the PDF version of all the council evidence from the appeals portal and post it in your dropbox.



Thank you

The tribunal have updated the docs and I have updated the Dropbox.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/uyiftdimfh1gh15/...9PwnPYKV8a?dl=0


Thanks for your assistance
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cp8759
post Mon, 24 Aug 2020 - 10:53
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Draft appeal: https://bit.ly/3hks65w

All you need to do is upload it to the tribunal portal, whether you want to attend a hearing or not is up to you, sometimes it helps but for a case like this I'm not sure it is absolutely essential.


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Piactus
post Wed, 26 Aug 2020 - 05:26
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Mon, 24 Aug 2020 - 11:53) *
Draft appeal: https://bit.ly/3hks65w

All you need to do is upload it to the tribunal portal, whether you want to attend a hearing or not is up to you, sometimes it helps but for a case like this I'm not sure it is absolutely essential.



Thank you very much. So so grateful
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cp8759
post Fri, 4 Sep 2020 - 09:35
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A bit harsh for Jack Walsh I think:

I bore in mind all the written and oral submissions made by Ms Ogun, which were very clearly expressed, and all the evidence in the case. I find on the balance of probabilities that there are two signs on either side of the carriageway, angled towards the carriageway of Alverston Gardens. As a result, they are sufficiently visible to motorists turning left into Alverston Gardens so as to be adequate. There is no dispute that the appellant's vehicle entered Alverston Gardens in contravention of the restriction indicated by the signs. I find that the signage was adequate and that the contravention is proved.

The representations related to the signage. Equally, the notice of rejection devoted at least a paragraph to the issue of signage. Having regard to the representations and to the notice of rejection I find that the representations were considered, within the meaning of Jones v. LB Havering.

I do not find that there has been a procedural impropriety and so there are no grounds to allow the appeal.


I can't see any grounds to ask for a review unfortunately.

This post has been edited by cp8759: Fri, 4 Sep 2020 - 09:35


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PASTMYBEST
post Fri, 4 Sep 2020 - 10:23
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Fri, 4 Sep 2020 - 10:35) *
A bit harsh for Jack Walsh I think:

I bore in mind all the written and oral submissions made by Ms Ogun, which were very clearly expressed, and all the evidence in the case. I find on the balance of probabilities that there are two signs on either side of the carriageway, angled towards the carriageway of Alverston Gardens. As a result, they are sufficiently visible to motorists turning left into Alverston Gardens so as to be adequate. There is no dispute that the appellant's vehicle entered Alverston Gardens in contravention of the restriction indicated by the signs. I find that the signage was adequate and that the contravention is proved.

The representations related to the signage. Equally, the notice of rejection devoted at least a paragraph to the issue of signage. Having regard to the representations and to the notice of rejection I find that the representations were considered, within the meaning of Jones v. LB Havering.

I do not find that there has been a procedural impropriety and so there are no grounds to allow the appeal.


I can't see any grounds to ask for a review unfortunately.


agree no chance of review


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Piactus
post Wed, 9 Sep 2020 - 13:56
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Fri, 4 Sep 2020 - 10:35) *
A bit harsh for Jack Walsh I think:

I bore in mind all the written and oral submissions made by Ms Ogun, which were very clearly expressed, and all the evidence in the case. I find on the balance of probabilities that there are two signs on either side of the carriageway, angled towards the carriageway of Alverston Gardens. As a result, they are sufficiently visible to motorists turning left into Alverston Gardens so as to be adequate. There is no dispute that the appellant's vehicle entered Alverston Gardens in contravention of the restriction indicated by the signs. I find that the signage was adequate and that the contravention is proved.

The representations related to the signage. Equally, the notice of rejection devoted at least a paragraph to the issue of signage. Having regard to the representations and to the notice of rejection I find that the representations were considered, within the meaning of Jones v. LB Havering.

I do not find that there has been a procedural impropriety and so there are no grounds to allow the appeal.


I can't see any grounds to ask for a review unfortunately.



Thanks for your assistance with this. I got the letter yesterday...
So I don't even get any other chance to pay half the amount or can I approach the council?

Thanks
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cp8759
post Thu, 10 Sep 2020 - 11:05
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Unfortunately at the tribunal stage the discount is no longer an option, and the council is not going to be persuaded to accept the reduced amount.


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Piactus
post Fri, 11 Sep 2020 - 05:48
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Thu, 10 Sep 2020 - 12:05) *
Unfortunately at the tribunal stage the discount is no longer an option, and the council is not going to be persuaded to accept the reduced amount.

Thank you
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