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Britannia Parking, Alleged parking issue
Borg616
post Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 10:16
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I wonder whether you could assist please?
I've received various parking notices about a particular parking event but think there may be a case against the initial notice period as I never got an initial notice from Britannia.

Company - Britannia Parking
Date of alleged issue - 02/09/2017
Never received a notice
Car park is ANPR
So far I've received the following;

1st Comms received 61 days after the issue - letter dated 60 days after event (01/11/2017) - DRP (Debt Recovery Plus) Parking charge for £160
2nd Comms dated 16/11/2017 - DRP Notice for intended court action - £160
3rd Comms dated 01/12/2017 - DRP final settlement offer to avoid court action - £136
4th Comms dated 18/12/2017 - ZC (Zenith Collections) Notice of Debt Recovery - £100
5th Comms dated 09/01/2018 - ZC Notice of intention to commence legal proceedings - £100 going up to £160
6th Comms dated 19/11/2018 - BW (bwlegal) Notice demand for £160 (£100 PCN Charge (that I never received) + £60 legal costs - threatening CCJ
7th Comms dated 04/12/2018 - BW Letter of Claim - balance due £160 to be paid by 9th Jan

Given that the wording is starting to talk about CCJs and Legal, I'm starting to get jittery and would appreciate some input please?
On a matter of principle I don't believe I should pay it, but I don;t particularly want a CCJ if that is the default without responding.
I feel like I now need to respond. Could someone please advise if I've left it too late and what I could do please?
Thank in advance.

This post has been edited by Borg616: Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 13:53
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post Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 10:16
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nosferatu1001
post Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 10:31
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EDIT YOUR POST
You must not state who was driving
Do that now.

Letter of claim MSUT be responded to
Send a SAR to Britannia

Your response to BW Legal will be

- restrict processing my data while the SAR dated X is being handled by Britannia
- do not send your templated resposne that you havea need to process my data, as you are well aware that the Limitations Act gives you another 4 years to file a claim. You have no pressing need to continue processing, so MUST restrict procesingotherwise a complaint will be sent to the ICO and to the SRA
- that in any case, the Keeper has NO liabiltiy as no NtK was every recieved meaning there is NO possibility the keeper is liable. In any case parking was paid for.

I presume youve never ever sent any response to anyone? COnfirm

As you are hopefully aware, CCJ means JUDGEMENT. It has to go to court and be JUDGED that you owe. A company doesnt get one jsut for writing you a letter.
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ostell
post Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 10:36
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They can't just get a CCJ against you. They can only get a CCJ against you IF they start a court claim and IF you lose and IF you don't pay within a month. Lots of IFs.

Edit your post so that the identity of the driver cannot be inferred, the driver bought a ticket.

Zenith and DRP are the same company (look at the light gray writing at the foot of the Zenith letters)

BWL is the problem as they seem to have issued Letter of Claim at the beginning of December and you might well have a claim form from Northampton winging its way to you at this very moment. That letter was giving you 30 days to respond before the issued a claim.

First actions are now issue a SAR to Britannia parking requesting all documents that they hold that are pertinent to you.

Next is a letter to BWL stating that you deny any liability to Britannia as they failed they comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms act 2012 namely failing to deliver a Notice to Keeper within 14 days. You have also issued a SAR against Britannia and they should hold processing until such time as Britannia respond. You also require that BWL furnish you with all documents that they intend to use in any court proceedings.

As the keeper you can only be liable for the amount of the initial NTK (which you did not receive) and not any added on legal costs, except those costs permitted and limited by the courts.
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nosferatu1001
post Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 11:26
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Oh hadnt spotted it was december
You waits the best part of 2 months to respond to a letter giving you 30 days to respond?

Expect a clamii form iminently
Get reading on the claim process. Dont jsut ask "Ive got a claim form what do I do now", that just annoys.
SEND THE SAR and RESPONSE TO LBC (two letters as two places) ANYWAY, today
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Borg616
post Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 13:51
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Thanks all for the speedy response. Thanks for the advice, I'll get onto the letters today.
Quick re-read as I missed a question that was asked - I've not responded to any communication at this point.

This post has been edited by Borg616: Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 13:55
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nosferatu1001
post Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 14:40
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OK, well in 2017 i do not THINK Britannia were compliant with POFA, meaning as long as the driver is not identified, the Keeper is not liable
However YOU must go and read POFA sched 4 para 9 for yourself, and compare it to the NtK.
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ostell
post Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 17:55
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But at the moment there is no NTK. Hopefully a SAR will uncover it so failures with that can be added to failed to deliver within 14 days
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Borg616
post Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 21:46
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SAR - too much? - slight re-edit owing to my own curiosity

Parking Charge Notice – XXXXXXX
Date of Parking Charge– XX/XX/XXXX
Place – XXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Dear Sir or Madam

Subject Access Request – Data Protection Act 2018 / General Data Protection Regulations (GDPR)

Please supply the data about me that I am entitled to under data protection law relating to me :
- All documents that you hold that are pertinent to me
- Any imagery relating to the parking charge referenced
- Any documentation that you are intending to use as evidence
- Any correspondence either internally within Britannia Parking or externally between any 3rd Party or related companies/departments/organisations that relate to me or the referenced parking charge detailed above in the reference.
- Your retention period for storing my personal data or, where this is not possible, your criteria for determining how long you will store it
- The safeguards you provide if and when transferring my personal data to another organisation.

If you need any more data from me, please let me know as soon as possible. It's my understanding that data protection law requires you to respond to a request for data within one calendar month.

If you do not normally deal with these requests, please pass this letter to your Data Protection Officer, or relevant staff member.
If you need advice on dealing with this request, the Information Commissioner’s Office can assist you. Its website is ico.org.uk or it can be contacted on 0303 123 1113.

Yours faithfully

This post has been edited by Borg616: Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 06:11
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Borg616
post Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 22:18
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and for BW

Parking Charge Notice – XXXXXXX
Date of Parking Charge– XX/XX/XXXX
Place – XXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Dear Sir or Madam

I wish to inform you that I deny any liability to Britannia Parking as they failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms act 2012 namely failing to deliver a Notice to Keeper within 14 days.
I have issued a Subject Access Request to Britannia dated XXXX XXXXXXX XXXX. I request that you hold any processing of my data until such time as Britannia respond.
I believe the Limitations Act gives you another 4 years to file a claim. You have no pressing need to continue processing so I must insist that you restrict any processing until my Subject Access Request has been fulfilled otherwise a complaint will be sent to the ICO and to the SRA.

Please also supply me with all documentation that I am entitled to under the data protection law that you intend to use in any court proceedings.
If you need any more data from me, please let me know as soon as possible. It’s my understanding that the data protection law requires you to respond to a request for data within one calendar month.
If you do not normally deal with information requests, please pass this letter to your Data Protection Officer, or relevant staff member.
If you need advice on dealing with this request, the Information Commissioner’s Office can assist you. Its website is ico.org.uk or it can be contacted on 0303 123 1113.

Yours faithfully

This post has been edited by Borg616: Thu, 24 Jan 2019 - 22:25
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nosferatu1001
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 09:52
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- Any documentation that you are intending to use as evidence
how does that count for a SAR? While SOME data would be data that is personal to you, some - such as signage - would not be

If you need any more data from me, please let me know as soon as possible.
- dont give them that get out. Just state "you have a copy of my V5C, which is the only documetnation the ICO has state you will need to prove my identity. Do not attempt to delay your response by requesting further identification; this will result in an immediate complaint to the ICO, and your deadline will not be extended"

To BW

Dont ask for cos "under data protection law". State that you require all documents tthey intend to rely upon in this claim, under the overriding objective that this will help narrow the topics under dispute. If you will not provide this, you must explain why. Please note that any claim that the contract proving your clients authority to operate on this land is NOT privileged, and CAN be sent now to avoid unecessary delay. A failure to produce documetns now will be documented and used to claim costs on teh indemnity basis.

You are not asking BW for data under a SAR
They will not hold as much as BW does, and MAY hold documetns you SHOUDL be able to see that a SAR does not cover
You must understand the difference between PERSONAL DATA and DATA USEFUL TO THEM FOR A CLAIM - one is a subset of the other.
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Borg616
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 10:53
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Brilliant thanks for that - modified below, will print and send today. Thanks again for your ongoing help.
SAR
Subject Access Request – (Data Protection Act 2018 / General Data Protection Regulations (GDPR))
Please supply the data about me that I am entitled to under data protection law relating to me:
- All documents that you hold that are pertinent to me
- Any imagery relating to the parking charge referenced
- Any correspondence either internally within Britannia Parking or externally between any 3rd Party or related companies/departments/organisations that relate to me or the referenced parking charge detailed above in the reference.
- Your retention period for storing my personal data or, where this is not possible, your criteria for determining how long you will store it
- The safeguards you provide if you transfer my personal data to another organisation.
You have a copy of my V5C, which is the only documentation the ICO has stated you will need to prove my identity. Do not attempt to delay your response by requesting further identification; this will result in an immediate complaint to the ICO and your deadline will not be extended.
It may be helpful for you to know that data protection law requires you to respond to a request for data within one calendar month.
If you do not normally deal with these requests, please pass this letter to your Data Protection Officer, or relevant staff member.
If you need advice on dealing with this request, the Information Commissioner’s Office can assist you. Its website is ico.org.uk or it can be contacted on 0303 123 1113.
Yours faithfully

and BW
Dear Sir or Madam
I wish to inform you that I deny any liability to Britannia Parking as they failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms act 2012 namely failing to deliver a Notice to Keeper within 14 days.
I have issued a Subject Access Request to Britannia dated XXX XXXXXX XXXX. I request that you hold any processing of my data until such time as Britannia respond.
I believe the Limitations Act gives you another 4 years to file a claim. You have no pressing need to continue processing so I must insist that you restrict any processing until my Subject Access Request has been fulfilled otherwise a complaint will be sent to the ICO and to the SRA
I also require all documents that you intend to rely upon in this claim, under the overriding objective that this will help narrow the topics under dispute. If you will not provide this you must explain why.
Please note that any claim that the contract proving your client’s authority to operate on this land is NOT privileged, and CAN bet sent now to avoid unnecessary delay. A failure to produce documents now will be documented and used to claim costs on the indemnity basis.
Yours faithfully


really stupid question born out of my own paranoia and I'm happy to accept any resultant mockery for such a basic question) but on the letter to them, I'm still OK to write my own details (name and address) aren't I or should they be using their details on file?
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nosferatu1001
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 12:14
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Use your name and address on the letter

Please note that any claim that the contract proving your client’s authority to operate on this land is privileged is false, and CAN be sent now to avoid...

Check spellign and that I switched half way through. Dont just blindly copy and paste, this is YORU court document, not mine!
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cabbyman
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 12:41
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QUOTE (nosferatu1001 @ Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 12:14) *
Check spellign


Check spelling, as well! laugh.gif


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Borg616
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 14:16
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Yep, got it, speed read fail feeling the requirement for urgency - "More haste less speed". Thanks again, I'll get them sent.
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Borg616
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 20:20
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All posted earlier today but bad news. I got home to be greeted by the letter from Northampton tonight. :-(
Is it all bets off or do I still have options please?

This post has been edited by Borg616: Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 20:21
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ostell
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 22:12
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Yes, you fight it in court. First of all acknowledge the claim using the address and password. Do not put anything in the defence. You now have 33 days from the date of issue to get your defence into the court.
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Borg616
post Sat, 26 Jan 2019 - 02:20
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Hmm, that’s starting to get beyond my level of comfort and sounds quite time intensive.
Given the letters I have sent, is there any likelihood that I can get this stopped before then or are we talking a full court appearance do you think?
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cabbyman
post Sat, 26 Jan 2019 - 06:58
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It's not at all unusual for BWL to pull out at the last minute but you must prepare to go all the way to court.


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Borg616
post Sat, 26 Jan 2019 - 19:27
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OK thanks.

I've logged in though (on the back of the suggestion to login online and don't add any defence).

I have a section that is the acknowledgement service (AOS) which says;
"If you need 28 days (rather than 14) from the date of service to prepare your defence, or wish to contest the court's jurisdiction, complete the Acknowledgment of Service (AOS)."

With the option to "Start AOS".
I take it this is the one you were referring to (the 33 days being the 28 days here + 5 days service date).

This has asked whether I intend to defend all or part of this claim and whether I intend to contest jurisdiction.

My planned response is "defend all" but "do not intend to contest jurisdiction" - I assume i'm not about to make a massive blunder with this approach please?
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cabbyman
post Sat, 26 Jan 2019 - 20:11
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Yes. Defend all, do not contest jurisdiction and leave the defence box completely blank.


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