Four letters from SIP |
Four letters from SIP |
Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 21:29
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#1
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Member Group: Members Posts: 133 Joined: 26 Nov 2014 Member No.: 74,395 |
To get straight to the point, my brother used my car and parked in an area managed by SIP. He got permission from the manager of the area that it was okay for him to park. I know this probably won't have much weight so I'm not counting on him speaking to the manger and then relying on a chain to be delivered to SIP to cancel the tickets.
I've dealt with SIP before, they took me to court over 2 or 3 tickets and they won. I'm looking to get a mortgage soon (not looking for any CCJs by ignoring the letters) and don't have the time to piece together an appeal with the standard defence similar to what I used last year in court (nor do I have any desire to repeat the same process again even if I had the time). I'm simply going to put down an address my brother has given me and return the slips letters recorded mail. The firm is asking for the name, address and the telephone number of the driver. I will supply for 2 former details, but I feel the telephone would be a little too personal - are they allowed to ask for this? Secondly, once I send these details off, can I relieve myself from the stress that they will come back to bite me months, or even years later? Thanks |
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Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 21:29
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Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 21:48
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#2
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Member Group: Members Posts: 41,510 Joined: 25 Aug 2011 From: Planet Earth Member No.: 49,223 |
You only need to provide a name and serviceable address. Do not provide a phone number of any sort.
If you supply this information then they cannot use PoFA to pursue you. First class with proof of posting is sufficient. -------------------- RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it. |
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Tue, 20 Nov 2018 - 23:58
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#3
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Member Group: Members Posts: 133 Joined: 26 Nov 2014 Member No.: 74,395 |
Does it have anything to do with me if the driver becomes is unresponsive? What is there to stop people doing this for every NTK they receive and hold it as proof? |
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Wed, 21 Nov 2018 - 07:54
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#4
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,126 Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Member No.: 96,238 |
Parking companies like SIP usually say they will return to the registered keeper if the named driver denies it or doesn't respond
Their right to recover payment has, however, ended There are two options : 1 Your brother replies to the first contact and simply states that the vehicle was entitled to park, but does not deny driving This destroys any case against you because SIP cannot deny you provided the information 2 Your brother ignores SIP but provides a witness statement that he was driving if SIP issues a claim against you |
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Wed, 21 Nov 2018 - 08:06
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#5
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Member Group: Members Posts: 133 Joined: 26 Nov 2014 Member No.: 74,395 |
I seriously doubt that he will respond to the letter SIP will send which is why I want to make sure they can't come back to me.
To what extent are SIP acting within the law if they continue to pursue me after I have provided them with his details? I can provide a text message proof that I have asked him for the address and what he replies is what I put on the form and then send off. Naturally they may say that if I had his phone number, why I didn't include this on the slip too (and thus they may reprimand me for not providing all the details I hold) |
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Wed, 21 Nov 2018 - 09:27
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#6
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Member Group: Members Posts: 56,198 Joined: 9 Sep 2003 From: Warwickshire Member No.: 317 |
SIP can continue to mail you, they can use the excuse they believe the drivers details aren’t genuine, but it’s unlikley they would be dumb enough to try court when it would be easily defended.
-------------------- There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!
S172's Rookies 1-0 Kent Council PCN's Rookies 1-0 Warwick Rookies 1-0 Birmingham PPC PCN's Rookies 10-0 PPC's |
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Wed, 21 Nov 2018 - 09:28
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#7
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
All that is required in POFA is for you to provide the name and address of the driver and your liability is ended. Here's the words: "is unable to take steps to enforce that requirement against the driver because the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver." If the name and address are valid then they have no further claim against you.
Continuing to take action against you is contrary to the requirements of POFA and knowing that they cannot hold you liable could make it expensive for them. |
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Wed, 21 Nov 2018 - 10:26
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#8
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Member Group: Members Posts: 28,687 Joined: 27 Nov 2007 Member No.: 15,642 |
You could warn them that, as you have discharged your responsibility under POFA, further communication is actionable harassment.
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Wed, 21 Nov 2018 - 10:40
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#9
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Member Group: Members Posts: 56,198 Joined: 9 Sep 2003 From: Warwickshire Member No.: 317 |
I think if the named driver didn’t reply you’d struggle to show harassment, they could argue they had a reasonably held belief it wasn’t a genuine nomination.
-------------------- There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!
S172's Rookies 1-0 Kent Council PCN's Rookies 1-0 Warwick Rookies 1-0 Birmingham PPC PCN's Rookies 10-0 PPC's |
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Wed, 21 Nov 2018 - 10:51
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#10
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
If you could show it was valid, ie voters reg, then I think that would help if it came to arguments.
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Wed, 21 Nov 2018 - 13:04
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 133 Joined: 26 Nov 2014 Member No.: 74,395 |
I think if the named driver didn’t reply you’d struggle to show harassment, they could argue they had a reasonably held belief it wasn’t a genuine nomination. But no response doesn't imply that the address is incorrect in the same way that if I didn't respond they wouldn't conclude that registered keeper's address was inaccurate (and instead most likely to continue to escalate through the courts). Having read the POFA I can't see where it states the creditor needs to verify that the address is genuine before they can accept it, isn't that what I'm signing the declaration for in the first place on the slip which I'll be sending back? If somehow they determined that I wrote down a false address or someone random then I understand I could be prosecuted, but a non-response doesn't suggest it's incorrect. The only way I can prove that I was acting on the information I was supplied is the text message I received when I asked what his address was, whether he have me an incorrect address or not is beyond me and not my concern, right? (Although one of the reasons I lost my previous case with SIP is because the judge used common sense, and if this matter some how does make it to court, the judge might expect me to satisfy him that there was no room for doubt in the address I was supplying). |
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Wed, 21 Nov 2018 - 13:59
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#12
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,126 Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Member No.: 96,238 |
Then tell your brother to reply, any reply as long as it shows that SIP was given a working address
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