NIP with Rental Car Options

[josh1234]

Good Evening all,

I'm new here so go easy

This is a complicated one, and I've absolutely no idea where to go with it.

So... Back in September I hired a car for a family holiday. On the day after we returned I was on the way back taking the car back, I drove past a speed camera van that was parked on the bridge on the motorway. Thought I was going a bit quick, but wasn't expecting anything as my speedo was below 80 (or so I thought).

When it came through in my name it said I was doing 94. Seemed a lot quicker than I remembered but I just went with it, I'd driven past the van, had been at the location on the same day and roughly the same time and although not expecting anything I did have it in the back of my mind, and that was the end of it. Returned my licence, paid the £100 fine and got my 3 points. Lovely The roads are much safer now Anyhow...

I've been looking through the photos from the holiday today, and I've just by chance noticed that a family photo has a picture of the car parked in the background. Here's where it gets complex... The registration on the car I had was different to that on both my rental agreement paperwork, and on the NIP. Only very slightly different I may add ( one digit )
Now when I collected the car, the lady on the counter radioed to a guy in the yard "can you bring XXX round please" (that's the last 3 digits on the number plate of the one caught speeding). I'm suggesting he then brought the wrong one round which I then had for the week, but the paperwork was on a different vehicle, of which I'm guessing someone else was driving and got caught .

The rental firm have two branches opposite ends of the stretch of motorway which I was caught on and I know they regularly are driving vehicles to and from the different branches so this explanation seems perfectly possible to me

My question is, how on earth do I go about proving this, and who do I speak to/where do I start? Is it likely to be a complex issue proving this as I'm not sure I can be bothered with the hassle.... ?

Any help or advice is much appreciated.

Josh

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[Logician]

You have accepted you were driving the car caught speeding, and dealt with the consequences, it would be difficult if not impossible to now backtrack on that and you have only supposition about what happened. You anyway accept you were speeding but in a different car and the fixed penalty would be the same, so all in all I would let matters lie.

[The Rookie]

It seems a bit unlikely a random car with the registration number one different happened to pass the same speed camera at about the same time that you did*.........are you sure you're not misreading the reg number from the photo? Or maybe there is an error on the plates such that front and rear are different and one has the error and one not.

Try a car parts website (such as Eurocarparts, GSF, Halfords) and enter both numbers and see what they come back as.

*31M cars in the UK, say 1000 went past that camera in either lane 2 or 3 in that 15 minute period, that still leaves it as a 310,000 to 1 chance.

[666]

It seems a bit unlikely a random car with the registration number one different happened to pass the same speed camera at about the same time that you did*.........are you sure you're not misreading the reg number from the photo? Or maybe there is an error on the plates such that front and rear are different and one has the error and one not.

Try a car parts website (such as Eurocarparts, GSF, Halfords) and enter both numbers and see what they come back as.

*31M cars in the UK, say 1000 went past that camera in either lane 2 or 3 in that 15 minute period, that still leaves it as a 310,000 to 1 chance.

31,000 to 1, but I still wouldn't put money on it.

[bearclaw]

But the odds are shortened still further by the fact the cars rented are from the same place and were there at the same time.

Regardless though, I cant see how the OP has been disadvantaged although it's a further spur to remind me to always take photos on the phone of any car I rent...

[The Rookie]

the fact the cars rented are from the same place and were there at the same time.

Where has that 'fact' come from? You know the other registration number is assigned to a rental car and based at the same depot, or is that a jump to conclusion?

[josh1234]

I went to the Hire company this morning, Both of the registrations are on cars rented by the same place. They have a fleet of 10 of the same make, model, colour, all registrations are only one or a few digits different. Said hire firm is only about 2 miles from the place where the camera van was parked so it seems reasonable enough that you could have more than one on the motorway, especially Saturday morning which is the day when a lot of people tend to hire/return cars. On the DVLA site both the registrations bring up the same make/model/colour of car.

Yes I know I was speeding but I've been disadvantaged by this because no way was I going 94, If anything my speedo reading below 80 is unlikely to have resulted in anything, at the worst a speed awareness course. I just went along with it because I didnt' have any grounds to query it, I had been there, on said day and the time seemed about right too, so I just accepted it and moved on.
It's only since discovering this new info that has got me really doubting this is all correct

How clear are the photos the police take of the car ? Would they be clear enough to prove it wasn't me in the car?

This post has been edited by josh1234: Wed, 19 Dec 2018 - 10:09

[Steve_999]

the fact the cars rented are from the same place and were there at the same time.

Where has that 'fact' come from? You know the other registration number is assigned to a rental car and based at the same depot, or is that a jump to conclusion?

I would suggest that the OP having a photo of the car he was driving (reg "A") and the original paperwork which had been responded to by the same hire company with car reg "B" would be pretty conclusive that both were operated by the same rental company.

[The Rookie]

the fact the cars rented are from the same place and were there at the same time.

Where has that 'fact' come from? You know the other registration number is assigned to a rental car and based at the same depot, or is that a jump to conclusion?

I would suggest that the OP having a photo of the car he was driving (reg "A") and the original paperwork which had been responded to by the same hire company with car reg "B" would be pretty conclusive that both were operated by the same rental company.

I'd suggest its just supposition, plus there are other explanations as I put in my first post as to why it actually is the right car.

Even if it is at the same company, most hire companies have dozens of depots.

[bearclaw]

the fact the cars rented are from the same place and were there at the same time.

Where has that 'fact' come from? You know the other registration number is assigned to a rental car and based at the same depot, or is that a jump to conclusion?

It's neither. It appears that both cars were rented or likley rented or held from the same company at the same depot so it's likley that they could be in the area at the same time. It's not impossible that both could have been through the same road at near the same time as a course of pick up and drop off - what the odds are though is something that no one could really guess on, just that it's perhaps more likley that you would ordinarly think by working on 31 million licence plates and dividing down from there...

[southpaw82]

I’m not aware of any convenient mechanism for the OP to challenge an FPN that has been paid and points applied.

[The Rookie]

It appears that both cars were rented or likley rented or held from the same company at the same depot so it's likley that they could be in the area at the same time..

That's not 'likely', that's a 'complete guess' until the OP clarifies.

[bearclaw]

Well I was going on what the OP said here...

"Now when I collected the car, the lady on the counter radioed to a guy in the yard "can you bring XXX round please" (that's the last 3 digits on the number plate of the one caught speeding). I'm suggesting he then brought the wrong one round which I then had for the week, but the paperwork was on a different vehicle, of which I'm guessing someone else was driving and got caught ."

Which does seem to suggest that the two cars were at the same depot at the time of hire. But I think this is perhaps more for the flame pit.

[Jlc]

I’m not aware of any convenient mechanism for the OP to challenge an FPN that has been paid and points applied.

Which is the relevant conversation - it is still within the 6 months (to prosecute) but going about reversing the FP isn't going to be easy and the matter will almost certainly end up at court as I doubt it would be simply dropped. The conditions not to be prosecuted have been met by accepting the CoFP.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing but it's going to be too messy to undo.

[josh1234]

I’m not aware of any convenient mechanism for the OP to challenge an FPN that has been paid and points applied.

Which is the relevant conversation - it is still within the 6 months (to prosecute) but going about reversing the FP isn't going to be easy and the matter will almost certainly end up at court as I doubt it would be simply dropped. The conditions not to be prosecuted have been met by accepting the CoFP.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing but it's going to be too messy to undo.

Thanks all for your help, I got in touch with a motor offfence solicitor and he’s said also that it’s not going to be an easy process, so I think I might have to bite the bullet and just leave it . Very frustrating but I don’t think I can be bothered with all the hassle and certainly don’t like the idea of going to court .
How clear are the photos the police take of the speeding vehicle , would it show enough detail to see it wasn’t me ?

[peterguk]

How clear are the photos the police take of the speeding vehicle , would it show enough detail to see it wasn’t me ?

Without seeing them no one can tell. The photos are primarily to identify the vehicle, not the driver.

[Redivi]

Can't see that the OP has a hope of unravelling this unless the two vehicles are completely different or at least different colours

If they are, he might have the basis of a claim against the rental company responsible for wrongly providing his details

[The Rookie]

IF they are wrong, I suspect he was driving the car in question and either his photos doesn't actually show the plate clearly for some reason, or maybe the car has odd plates front and rear (especially if both cars were PDI'd at the same time)

Personally I find that an order of magnitude more likely than a different car one character different being on the same road at pretty much the same time and both cars exceeding the limit, that just stretches credulity too far for me.



This post has been edited by The Rookie: Wed, 19 Dec 2018 - 12:16

[josh1234]

IF they are wrong, I suspect he was driving the car in question and either his photos doesn't actually show the plate clearly for some reason, or maybe the car has odd plates front and rear (especially if both cars were PDI'd at the same time)

Personally I find that an order of magnitude more likely than a different car one character different being on the same road at pretty much the same time and both cars exceeding the limit, that just stretches credulity too far for me.

In the photo I have it is very clear what the reg on the car I had was, it shows the front reg plate which is what I assume the motorway camera van would've read because it was facing me parked on the bridge.

Either way I think I'm going to just leave it and accept that I've got no easy way out of this