Received further steps notice when I've never owned a car before Options

[1min2midnight]

Hello,

I’ve been accused of a speeding offence which I found out about through a further steps notice detailing a fine of £816.
Here’s a summary of my situation:

I received a further steps notice in the mail on Saturday 19/02/2022.

On Monday 21/02/2022, I called the number on the letter and asked what it was about. In summary they said I was speeding down a motor way somewhere in surrey where the speed limit is 70. I believe it is surrey police who is prosecuting me.

They claim I was going 108. I do not recall the exact date since I was told about his over the phone, but it was during the first lock down around May 2020.

I currently live in north london and have never gone to surrey. At the time I would have been in my second year of university and living in Stratford with some class mates.

They quoted some license plate to me and some address I’d never heard of and said that I had to pay a fine.

I do not own a car nor have I ever driven a car before in my life nor have I taken lessons for driving. I still only have a provisional license

Yesterday, 03/08/2022 I attended Willesden Magistrates court for a Statutory Declaration. I pleaded not Guilty.

I was informed that I would have my next hearing in december and I was given a piece of paper with the date and nothing else. I don't know how to even get a hold
of documents about the case that I would need to present to a lawyer outlining the offence. Would I even need a lawyer? if at all possible I'd like to represent myself because I would have to pay over 1000GBP for someone else to represent me over an offence I definitely didn't commit.

I’m seeking some guidance on what I can do about it and how I can clear my name for this. Please let me know if you can help.

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[1min2midnight]

I'd suggest we ignore the Electoral Register route to try to detect fraud. the OP seems to be of "student age", moving residence a few times. does anyone of that age really bother with involving themselves in the Electoral Register.

The OP says he's never owned a car, so how did plod get his name and address(es)? Did he tell the DVLA he'd moved to change his driving licence details? Certainly more to this than meets the eye.

Without going into too much of. thread hijack, my own son had something similar abut 20-odd years ago when he had a bit of a prang. Nothing ever heard from the insurance or the other party until he went to get a mortgage and found a CCJ against him. It transpired I'd insured his car on my bus company policy as he'd allowed it to be used on company business. I'd reported it to the insurers, bus company went broke, not a problem. But he never got paperwork from insurance. It transpired he'd had friends living in his flat and mail had been diverted thorugh one of his lodgers, so he wasn't aware of the county court case. the insurers came to the rescue after I contacted them some 5 years after the event, paid up and cleared his CCJ. It goes to show.

Hey thanks for your post. I can confirm that I am not registered on the electoral roll. This has triggered something in my memory that is very important information you should all know:

I just remembered that when I moved to my current address I started making job applications since I had just graduated from university. I found that it was easier to give my drivers license as a proof of ID when making some of these applications. I also thought about finally learning how to drive.

Since I don't drive I didn't really use my drivers license (which if I haven't said so before, is a provisional license). As you can tell I have moved around a lot from parents house to university accomodations. So I had stashed my drivers license away somewhere before I left for university four years ago now. Fast forward to me moving back to my parents house after university (1 year ago) and making the job applications I mentioned earlier, I tried to find my drivers license but no matter how hard I looked I couldn't find it. I assumed it must be somewhere hard to find in my house and since I had moved around so much my drivers license had an old address in it. So I decided to simply get a new drivers license by saying that I simply wanted to update my address. In other words I didn't report it lost or stolen since as far as I was concerned it was still somewhere in my house. I had another look since reading this post but I still can't find it. This could mean that maybe I lost it during one of the times that I moved or when my parents moved addresses.

Thank you everyone who has posted so far the information you have all provided me with is invaluable I really really appreciate it

[cp8759]

Thank you everyone who has posted so far the information you have all provided me with is invaluable I really really appreciate it

Please do let us know how this plays out, it would be really helpful if we get a similar case in the future (which I fear is likely, these seem to be getting more regular).

[1min2midnight]

Hello everyone,
Just a quick update. After your guidance I have requested my SJPN for this which I never got because as I already knew there seems to be an incorrect address on it. I've finally received it. The address that this was posted to is an address I've never lived at before.

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[The Rookie]

The important bit really is does the address used mean anything to you, does a friend (ex-friend by now?) live there, anyone you know etc.

Have you reported this to the police as suggested? Someone has pretended to be you, a much more serious crime than speeding.

We also know it wasn't a roadside stop, so a notice sent to that address was replied to by someone who could access it.

[1min2midnight]

The important bit really is does the address used mean anything to you, does a friend (ex-friend by now?) live there, anyone you know etc.

Have you reported this to the police as suggested? Someone has pretended to be you, a much more serious crime than speeding.

We also know it wasn't a roadside stop, so a notice sent to that address was replied to by someone who could access it.

Hi,
Unfortunately, I don't know anyone who might live at that address or who might have lived at that address in the past. I have reported it to Surrey speeding department ( I can't remember exactly what it's called) I've sent them an email detailing the whole situation. I called them two days ago and they said that they are looking into it but they can't provide me with an update right now and they don't know when they'll be able to update me

[andy_foster]

The important bit really is does the address used mean anything to you, does a friend (ex-friend by now?) live there, anyone you know etc.

Have you reported this to the police as suggested? Someone has pretended to be you, a much more serious crime than speeding.

We also know it wasn't a roadside stop, so a notice sent to that address was replied to by someone who could access it.

There is compelling* evidence that it was not a roadside stop - the statement of facts states that it was Hadecs 3.

However, I seem to have missed the bit where we established that the miscreant responded to a NIP/s, 172 in the OP's name as the OP.
As mentioned previously, that would be consistent with the speeding conviction, but as also mentioned previously, sloppiness from the SJ seems far more likely.
The charge sheet provided only lists a single charge - speeding - but absent further evidence that says little. Many forces issue the s. 172 and speeding charges separately. If it is well known that Surrey always list both charges on the same sheet, then the "simpler" perverting would require 2 separate acts of incompetence to explain it (the police issuing the wrong charge as well as the SJ convicting without evidence. Otherwise, if the written charges are issued separately, it would seem that the OP was simply sent the one they were convicted of.

* I was involved in a case some years back in which the LTi2020 operator's signed witness statement detailed how he loaded and unloaded the wet film cartridge into the Gatso BV 24 +AUS and exhibited the still from the LTI session video as the gatso photo. When questioned about the 'discrepancy' he explained that someone else writes his witness statements and he simply signs them without reading them. The accused got 6 points for 117 on a DC.

[The Rookie]

However, I seem to have missed the bit where we established that the miscreant responded to a NIP/s, 172 in the OP's name as the OP.

As the OP was not dual charged, absent a significant louse up by the camera team (who do this every day after all) it seems significantly more likely than not that someone replied claiming to be the OP.

[andy_foster]

Unless you know something that I don't (entirely possible), the fact that there is only the speeding charge on the charge sheet that she has been given does not mean that she was not dual charged.

[1min2midnight]

Hello everyone,

I attended court on the 12th for a hearing. I had to wait for a long time to be seen. After the prosecution read their statement and showed the evidence that they had, the judge simply told me that the case was dismissed as there was no way that it could be me given the evidence. They also had no idea how the police would have gotten my details in the first place.

The evidence was just a few pictures of the back of a vauxhall car and it's license plate. The prosecution statement said a few things worth noting:

1. They had received a form that was signed by me saying that I was the driver.
2. They don't know how they got my address (The address that was filled out was not an address that I'd ever lived in)

So it was as Andy_Foster and The Rookie suspected all long!

I never heard back from surrey speed camera department about this I kept calling and they always came up with some excuse as to how either the person who dealt with the case was not in or they would contact me again...

In summary, before coming to this forum I contacted a bunch of solicitors to ask for more information. They all wanted to charge me upwards of 1200GBP for taking on my case. Thanks to all of you I was able to resolve it without the need of a solicitor. Big thank you to everyone who provided me with the information I needed! I really really appreciate it!

[Suziboy]

Great result, well done.

It's massively frustrating for you that it even got as far as it did, but it worked out in the end.

[Newbie David]

It's unlikely to happen but it might be worth checking up on your driving licence status occasionally:
https://www.gov.uk/view-driving-licence
just in case someone has your details and manages to use them again.

[The Rookie]

Well done on getting the right result.

Shame the Police couldn’t have made it easier by responding earlier rather than waiting until court to admit it was a mess.

Be interesting to see if they take it further on any miscreant.

[roythebus]

I wonder if they'll bother trying to find out who actually sent the forged paperwork. PCOJ springs to mind.

[cp8759]

I wonder if they'll bother trying to find out who actually sent the forged paperwork. PCOJ springs to mind.

I would push the police to investigate this. Otherwise it could happen again, and whoever the perpetrator is will likely continue to do this to others even if not to you.

[1min2midnight]

I wonder if they'll bother trying to find out who actually sent the forged paperwork. PCOJ springs to mind.

I would push the police to investigate this. Otherwise it could happen again, and whoever the perpetrator is will likely continue to do this to others even if not to you.

I've tried to report it to the police but unfortunately they just direct me to action fraud and I've already reported it to them. I'm not sure if there's anything else I can do

This post has been edited by 1min2midnight: Fri, 16 Dec 2022 - 00:50

[The Rookie]

You shouldn't be reporting it as fraud but as perverting the course of justice. AF don't deal with PCOJ.

Read up on Sussex's police 'Operation Pinocchio' as an indication.

This post has been edited by The Rookie: Fri, 16 Dec 2022 - 09:10

[cp8759]

You shouldn't be reporting it as fraud but as perverting the course of justice. AF don't deal with PCOJ.

Read up on Sussex's police 'Operation Pinocchio' as an indication.

+1. Most forces have now done similar operations, find out if the force local to where the vehicle was used / local to you have done something similar. If they have, try and get in touch with whoever is running it as they will no doubt be very interested to hear about your case.