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CPM, Received a PCN was just dropping off my daughter!
bellarose
post Thu, 29 Sep 2016 - 16:53
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Hi,
I took my daughter to the hairdresser. I took her into the salon whilst my other daughter stayed in the car (only few seconds inside) when I came out there were 2 guys standing on the other side of the road, one had a body camera around his chest. I thought nothing of it until I received the PCN through the post. I'm fuming as I didn't see a sign but when I've gone back to check there's a sign on the other side of the rd from where I parked. Any advise much appreciated
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post Thu, 29 Sep 2016 - 16:53
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bellarose
post Sat, 29 Oct 2016 - 21:52
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Hi cabbyman yes I have contacted my local authority & was told that somebody would get back to me but I have yet t receive a reply.
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nosferatu1001
post Sat, 29 Oct 2016 - 23:20
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Chase them when you can

They state there is categorically no cNtract was ever offered - no roadway parking - yet claim a breach of contract occurred. Usual legal nonsense from them.
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Churchmouse
post Sun, 30 Oct 2016 - 23:13
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QUOTE (nosferatu1001 @ Sat, 29 Oct 2016 - 23:20) *
Chase them when you can

They state there is categorically no cNtract was ever offered - no roadway parking - yet claim a breach of contract occurred. Usual legal nonsense from them.

It would also be helpful to see the wording on the signs, but the general idea is that they cannot offer a "parking contract" if they're not giving you anything in return for your agreement (e.g., allowing you to park there).

--Churchmouse
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bellarose
post Wed, 2 Nov 2016 - 14:07
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Hi chrurchmouse I will return & take some photos but one of them is halfway up a post!
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cabbyman
post Wed, 2 Nov 2016 - 14:31
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Even better! Make sure the post and ground are in shot to give it context!


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Cabbyman 8 PPCs 0
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Lynnzer
post Wed, 2 Nov 2016 - 15:33
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From the rejection letter it is clear this is yet another prohibitive parking case.

I would be interested in the response you get to the letter I knocked up today for just such an event.
I've suitably altered it to fit your own circumstances.

By the way, since this is a CEL case and a further appeal isn't worthwhile I think this letter will give you wriggle room if they fail to address it properly.

----------------------------------------------
Name and address
Date

Ref PCN *****

I acknowledge receipt of the rejection to my appeal in connection with an alleged parking situation.

I have considered this matter in some depth and sought legal advice on it.

I am not at all convinced that there was a breach of a contract for parking, as you allege. In fact I dispute that any contractual arrangement was offered to the driver.

To fall foul of a contractual arrangement, there must be an offer, consideration then acceptance of the terms and conditions of the contract, followed by a breach of them.

The signs at the mentioned location do not satisfy this legal requirement.
Instead they are prohibitive by nature stating "NO PARKING ON ROADWAY AT ANY TIME". This is also shown clearly on your rejection letter.

It's clear then that parking is forbidden thus cannot become a contractual agreement as you cannot contract with a driver to do something you disallow.

Whilst you may have reason to believe that some sort of contravention took place I would happily agree to it being an accidental matter of trespass, which is actionable only by the landholder, whoever that party may be.

If you would pass on my details to the rightful landholder I will answer directly to them by way of an apology for the oversight in this matter and if they wish to continue the dialogue at least you are not further disadvantaged by having to act as a go-between.


This post has been edited by Lynnzer: Wed, 2 Nov 2016 - 15:34


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bellarose
post Tue, 8 Nov 2016 - 16:43
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These are the photos that I've taken today. I still haven't heard back from the council in regard to the current status of the rd. I called again today & was told that someone would be in contact.








Thank you Lynnzer for your letter its very much appreciated :-)













please note that the last photo is a close up of the sign that is half way up a post. The other sign is on the other side of the rd. Sorry that the photos are angled to one side.
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cabbyman
post Tue, 8 Nov 2016 - 20:22
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I have just found this:

http://www.kent.gov.uk/__data/assets/pdf_f...teer-report.pdf

Have fun!!!!!!


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Cabbyman 8 PPCs 0
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bellarose
post Wed, 9 Nov 2016 - 14:33
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Hi, I've just received a phone call from the council. They have informed me that there is no such road called "The Meads" which is where CPM are saying that the offence has taken place. The name of the road is Quartz Way Sittingbourne ME10 5AB. The current status is public rd.

Should I write a letter stating that the name of the rd given is incorrect?

Thank you all for your help & advice :-)
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nosferatu1001
post Wed, 9 Nov 2016 - 14:42
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State both!

That the road is adopted, and that the road they are claiming the contravention occured does not exist

Suggest they carefully review their records, to ensure they have not been ticketing on an adopted road, which could be seen as an offence under the Fraud Act 2006
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cabbyman
post Wed, 9 Nov 2016 - 17:41
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Be absolutely certain the car was parked on Quartz Way and then write to Swale BC and Kent CC (No harm in both!) advising them that CPM are attempting to charge drivers for parking on public roads.


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Cabbyman 8 PPCs 0
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bellarose
post Thu, 10 Nov 2016 - 10:22
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Morning,

I wanted to make sure that before I write the letter everything is correct. I called the chemist which is on the rd where I "parked" & asked for their full address as there seems to be some confusion with KCC as they're saying that they don't recognise this rd but instead refer to "The Meads Avenue" which is in a different location.

The address given by the hairdressers is;

Unit 2
Quartz Way
The Meads
ME10 5AB


KCC have now told me that they don't own the road "Quartz Way".

I'm totally confused by all this now & unsure as to how I should proceed.

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emanresu
post Thu, 10 Nov 2016 - 10:51
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QUOTE
KCC have now told me that they don't own the road "Quartz Way".


But it is adopted as a public highway. That's the key issue. It's on their list.


--------------------
Where there is a claim - there is a counterclaim.
Are Parking companies misusing your personal data or interfering with your lease? Counterclaims are only £25. Makes them sit up and take notice. For leaseholds, join in the Managing agents too. Since the purpose of these claims is to frighten you, give them something to be frightened of.
Subject Access Requests to the DVLA?Find out who accessed your data and when. Try SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gsi.gov.uk. [Apologies if it does not work]
Double Dip / ANPR FaultsThe BPA Report on ANPR Double Dips is here. Ideal case for a counterclaim (see above).
Daily Court List. See who is doing what and where here
Printing and posting Witness Statements. Easy and cheap way DoxDirect
What is court like. A District Judge's view
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nosferatu1001
post Thu, 10 Nov 2016 - 10:59
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Theyve adopted it. not the same thing as owning it

Adoption is the key point; it is public highway, PPCs cannot ticket there as they cannot have authority from the landholder, the council.
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bellarose
post Mon, 14 Nov 2016 - 09:05
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Hi, I've totally confused myself & unsure now as to how I should be addressing my letter now confused2.gif
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nosferatu1001
post Mon, 14 Nov 2016 - 11:25
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They have adopted the road
Therefore the council is in charge of enforcing any parking controls THEY put in place
NOT a private company

It doesnt mean they own the actual land the road goes over.

Stop. Reread. Youre still telling the council that a road THEY are controlling has a private car company claiming THEY are controlling it and colelcting money for the privilege.
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bellarose
post Mon, 14 Nov 2016 - 13:44
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I’m going to send this letter, before I do wanted to make sure that I’ve worded it ok? & if I need to add anything.

Dear Sir/Madam,

In regard to your letter sent on the 27th October 2017. I would like to point out that the rd your are claiming the offence took place is indeed owned by the council therefore you’re unable to issue tickets.
I would suggest that your carefully review your records to ensure that you’re not issuing tickets on an adopted road as this could be seen as an offence under the Fraud Act 2006.


Does this sound ok?
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nosferatu1001
post Mon, 14 Nov 2016 - 13:54
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OK

We told you four times the phrase: ADOPTED.

Not an offence. Breach of contract. Offence would be criminal.

I would talk to the council about a private company ticketing on public roads...

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bellarose
post Tue, 15 Nov 2016 - 10:09
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thank you for pointing that out nosferatu1001 but my confusion is that I'm not sure what I should be replying back to CPM as I need to make sure that I'm accurate in what I say & I'm sure you can appreciate from my previous posts that I'm baffled by it all & unsure on the correct terminology.
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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 15 Nov 2016 - 10:10
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Talk to the council first. htey should be interested in a company ticketing on their adopted roads

Use the phrase "adopted road". post 50 gave you some pointers.

Adoption is not the same as owning. adoption is "we will look after this..." as opposed to "we own this"
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