PePiPoo Helping the motorist get justice

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

UKPC Charge, In private bay at my rented flat
boro12856
post Tue, 27 Aug 2013 - 10:43
Post #1


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 52
Joined: 27 Aug 2013
Member No.: 64,741



Hi all, spent a while reading various threads but thought I had best ask for my own personal advice.

Me and my partner rent a flat which has a gated entrance and you have your own space (corresponding to flat number) ours is in the underground section. We had a parking permit which has the number of the space on it to display on a daily basis.

Recently the gates to the carpark have been 'broken' and one side is constantly left open, which now has resulted in three UKPC notices in the space of two weeks.

We currently only have her car at the flat and I very rarely use the car, both occasions I have used it and returned to our parking bay I have once forgotten to put the parking permit on the dashboard, returning to the car next morning to see we had a ticket given to us around 4am for not displaying permit. And the second one for the same reason this time however I am 100% certain the permit was placed on the dashboard, however it wasn't there the next morning and another ticket was given (again around 4am, these idiots love a nightshift)

The third notice we had received was when we had friends staying for a weekend, we have a visitor permit too, which we were not given any advice about how long this could be used for by our landlord. All we were told is that if using a visitor permit please park in the disabled bays. Now this permit was used constantly for around 2 weeks when we first moved in as we had two cars then, and no problems. I have also noticed other cars at the flats always in the disabled spots and not disabled drivers.

But one weekend we gave our permit to friends to park downstairs and my girlfriend parked her car in the visitors bay, on the second night she received another charge notice this time saying that she had over stayed her welcome in the visitors bay.

Now I am just looking for what to do with these pieces of paper I have been given, as there is NO WAY I will be paying them a penny! We need to use an electric fob to gain access to the carpark, and our parking spot corresponds with our flat number. So if they are coming in EVERY NIGHT they must see the car in the same bay using the permit, yet the ONE occasions I genuinely know I forgot to display the permit a ticket is slapped straight on. It is funny however how the influx of tickets corresponds with the gated entrance been broken.

Thanks for any help.

Regards
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
7 Pages V   1 2 3 > »   
Start new topic
Replies (1 - 19)
Advertisement
post Tue, 27 Aug 2013 - 10:43
Post #


Advertise here!









Go to the top of the page
 
Quote Post
emanresu
post Tue, 27 Aug 2013 - 13:59
Post #2


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,022
Joined: 24 Aug 2007
From: Home alone
Member No.: 13,324



I assume since the 28 days have not expired they are still to contact the Keeper about these. Wait until that comes unless it is a hire/lease car.

In the meantime, dig your lease/rental agreement out and see what it says about parking. It would sound as if you have the right to peaceful enjoyment and they are actually trespassing on your property.

Do you rent from a private individual or a company. Either should be able to tell them to cancel.


--------------------
Where there is a claim - there is a counterclaim.
Are Parking companies misusing your personal data or interfering with your lease? Counterclaims are only £25. Makes them sit up and take notice. For leaseholds, join in the Managing agents too. Since the purpose of these claims is to frighten you, give them something to be frightened of.
Subject Access Requests to the DVLA?Find out who accessed your data and when. Try SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gsi.gov.uk. [Apologies if it does not work]
Double Dip / ANPR FaultsThe BPA Report on ANPR Double Dips is here. Ideal case for a counterclaim (see above).
Printing and posting Witness Statements. Easy and cheap way DoxDirect
What is court like. A District Judge's view
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
The Slithy Tove
post Tue, 27 Aug 2013 - 15:30
Post #3


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 2,213
Joined: 5 Jan 2012
Member No.: 52,178



The more of these fake tickets you get, the better. Each one is going to cost UKPC £27+VAT when you appeal, have the appeal rejected, then take it to POPLA, and win.

As emanresu says, wait for the NtK, but meanwhile, the LEASE is the important document (not the rental agreement). The LEASE that you landlord has will have something about parking, especially if there's an allocated, numbered space. It will be very useful to get the exact wording in that document. Beyond that, your rental agreement may say something, if only to confer you the rights that the leaseholder has over the space. In other words, does the rental agreement impose any additional restrictions over your parking?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
boro12856
post Wed, 4 Sep 2013 - 11:14
Post #4


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 52
Joined: 27 Aug 2013
Member No.: 64,741



QUOTE (emanresu @ Tue, 27 Aug 2013 - 14:59) *
I assume since the 28 days have not expired they are still to contact the Keeper about these. Wait until that comes unless it is a hire/lease car.

In the meantime, dig your lease/rental agreement out and see what it says about parking. It would sound as if you have the right to peaceful enjoyment and they are actually trespassing on your property.

Do you rent from a private individual or a company. Either should be able to tell them to cancel.



QUOTE (The Slithy Tove @ Tue, 27 Aug 2013 - 16:30) *
The more of these fake tickets you get, the better. Each one is going to cost UKPC £27+VAT when you appeal, have the appeal rejected, then take it to POPLA, and win.

As emanresu says, wait for the NtK, but meanwhile, the LEASE is the important document (not the rental agreement). The LEASE that you landlord has will have something about parking, especially if there's an allocated, numbered space. It will be very useful to get the exact wording in that document. Beyond that, your rental agreement may say something, if only to confer you the rights that the leaseholder has over the space. In other words, does the rental agreement impose any additional restrictions over your parking?


We rent from a company in Portsmouth and when we moved in it sounded like the agents were handing this for a 'friend' of hers but on moving in we received a letter from a estate company outlining details of the parking restrictions in the 'site' as they name it on the letter.

I will contact the estate agent we signed the rental agreement with and ask for the details from her.

The NtK arrived yesterday anyway biggrin.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
The Slithy Tove
post Wed, 4 Sep 2013 - 11:38
Post #5


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 2,213
Joined: 5 Jan 2012
Member No.: 52,178



If the estate company is just a management company, they can make up all the rules they want, but they cannot impose conditions over private parking spaces (unless the lease allows).

When this gets as far as POPLA, among all the other appeal points, you will require UKPC to supply and POPLA to review -

• A copy of the current signed site agreement or contract with the landowner/occupier of that site
• A copy of the wording of the current imposed permit scheme with proof that the landowner and the current residents have agreed to/been informed about it
• Evidence that UKPC are legally enabled to override the prior rights, covenants and easements enjoyed by the residents under their lease/rental agreements
• A current map of all the areas and bays of that car park where the permit scheme is and is not applicable, as agreed with the landowner/occupier
• Contemporaneous photos of the actual signs on site taken from the view of the driver of a car at the entrance and in the car park
• A definitive map of where these signs are in that particular car park
• A detailed breakdown of how the amount of the 'charge' was arrived at.
Sice their agreement will be with the management company, and not the landowner/occupier, this is going to be hard for them.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
SchoolRunMum
post Thu, 5 Sep 2013 - 01:10
Post #6


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 18,425
Joined: 20 Sep 2009
Member No.: 32,130



http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showth...37&posted=1

HTH with the challenge at this stage.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Lynnzer
post Thu, 5 Sep 2013 - 11:30
Post #7


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 8,194
Joined: 9 Feb 2006
Member No.: 4,813



I take it that the scumbag ticketing you is also a resident?
They will be operating a self ticketing scheme with a kickback to the $hithead giving you a rough time of it.
Print off a few posters to put through other residents letterboxes telling them of the scam

Keep your eyes open, literally and see who has their lights on in their flat that early in the morning. That'll be them,,,,,

This post has been edited by Lynnzer: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 - 11:31


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
boro12856
post Sat, 7 Sep 2013 - 20:40
Post #8


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 52
Joined: 27 Aug 2013
Member No.: 64,741



Should I be making a 'soft appeal' now the first NtK has arrived?

I am struggling to find any sort of definitive way of doing this, however I am working nights right now and I am a little tired but will keep searching the forums for what to put down on the appeal.

Thanks
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
boro12856
post Sat, 7 Sep 2013 - 20:51
Post #9


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 52
Joined: 27 Aug 2013
Member No.: 64,741



QUOTE (Lynnzer @ Thu, 5 Sep 2013 - 12:30) *
I take it that the scumbag ticketing you is also a resident?
They will be operating a self ticketing scheme with a kickback to the $hithead giving you a rough time of it.
Print off a few posters to put through other residents letterboxes telling them of the scam

Keep your eyes open, literally and see who has their lights on in their flat that early in the morning. That'll be them,,,,,


Not sure if this will be the case as the only time I have saw tickets on the car is when the gates into the parking were broken. I even had a little test one night since the gates were fixed and didnt display permit next morning no ticket.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
kirkbyinfurnessl...
post Sat, 7 Sep 2013 - 21:04
Post #10


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 1,413
Joined: 14 May 2013
From: Sheffield
Member No.: 61,888



Yes appeal to them now. All you need to say is this.

*I don't believe you have the legal right to issue invoices on my parking space.

If you disagree and thus decline my appeal then please send me a popla appeal*

Nothing else is needed

This post has been edited by kirkbyinfurnesslad: Sat, 7 Sep 2013 - 21:05


--------------------
www.parkingticketappeals.org.uk
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
boro12856
post Sat, 7 Sep 2013 - 21:08
Post #11


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 52
Joined: 27 Aug 2013
Member No.: 64,741



QUOTE (kirkbyinfurnesslad @ Sat, 7 Sep 2013 - 22:04) *
Yes appeal to them now. All you need to say is this.

*I don't believe you have the legal right to issue invoices on my parking space.

If you disagree and thus decline my appeal then please send me a popla appeal*

Nothing else is needed


Thanks Kirby, will get this done and posted on Monday
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
boro12856
post Thu, 26 Sep 2013 - 15:59
Post #12


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 52
Joined: 27 Aug 2013
Member No.: 64,741



Just an update, appeal was sent off but yet to receive anything back from UKPC. Also still no letters yet received with regards to the other two tickets I have collected.

I did ring my letting agent and speak to them who told me they would get them all cancelled no problem, however the agent is a little useless and when I rang her a few days later she hadnt contacted anyone with regards to it yet. But due to the fact we are yet to receive anymore NtK's for the other invoices I believe they MAY of been cancelled.

Anyway here's a good one for you all, I recently misplaced the permit I was issued and spoke to my letting agent who have requested a new permit but in the meantime I was told to keep parking in my bay but use my visitors permit. Now I didnt really trust this but last night I parked in my own bay, in the same vehicle which is always parked in the bay even displayed my visitors permit and I even had the courtesy to write a little note stating that the permit was lost but I was informed to still use my bay and display visitors permit. LOW AND BEHOLD AT 4:09AM THIS MORNING!!!!!!!!!! (who the heck works at this ungodly hour issuing invoices) I received another ticket for "failing to display a valid parking permit" I have rang my letting agent again to inform her of this and she has said she will get it cancelled, but seriously this mob are taking the **** and its starting to really annoy me.

If I receive anymore NtK's should I keep appealing? As I am tempted just to ignore all of this from now on.

Regards
Paul
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
andy_foster
post Thu, 26 Sep 2013 - 16:26
Post #13


Member
Group Icon

Group: Life Member
Posts: 20,400
Joined: 9 Sep 2004
From: Reading
Member No.: 1,624



It is perfectly safe to ignore fake parking fines from UKPC. You might be able to have a bit of fun at their expense, but if you really can't be bothered to deal with them, don't.


--------------------
Andy

If you're going to try to contradict me, please at least try to get your facts straight.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Jlc
post Thu, 26 Sep 2013 - 16:41
Post #14


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 29,492
Joined: 25 Aug 2011
From: With Mickey
Member No.: 49,223



QUOTE (boro12856 @ Thu, 26 Sep 2013 - 16:59) *
LOW AND BEHOLD AT 4:09AM THIS MORNING!!!!!!!!!!

No tickets, no income... The middle of the night one works wonders for them.........


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
instrumentsofjoy
post Thu, 26 Sep 2013 - 17:31
Post #15


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 430
Joined: 10 Apr 2011
Member No.: 45,808



Sue them for trespass. They have what is known to the BiB as "form".

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum...ass-**SUCCESS**

We pressed on with our county court Claim against UK Parking control Limited
( UKPC ) in the Winchester County Court.
On 21.1.2013 UKPC in an Order by consent gave undertakings to the Court not to enter our land and not to place any parking chargeNotices on our cars and the Court ordered:
1. Judgment for the Claimants ( ourselves )
2. Damages for trespass in a total of £150.00
3. UKPC to pay our costs in the sum of £ 1280.26 ( now paid )
R.L.Davey
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
boro12856
post Fri, 28 Nov 2014 - 19:56
Post #16


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 52
Joined: 27 Aug 2013
Member No.: 64,741



So it has been a while since I last posted but I am after some further advice.

I have searched both on here and on MSE and found some threads regarding my issue, but I am wondering if anyone can give me personal advice for my situation.

Background info: We continued to get tickets on both our vehicles which were parking in our parking spaces inside an enclosed parking for our flat we rent from a landlady.

I contacted the owner of the land and continued to hassle them regards the workings of UKPC at our flat and in the end it seems the issuing of tickets has now seized (considering neither myself or my partner display any sort of permit)

However in the interim I did begin with responding to every charge, denying to pay and requesting a POPLA. Only on ONE occasion did I ever receive a POPLA code, and as we became barraged with tickets I gave up responding to them all and just began to ignore as people said in other threads and mine that UKPC can be ignored.

Queue today when I received a message from my partner saying she has been issued with a letter from SMALL CLAIM SOLICITORS regarding three PCN received that we had ignored.

I am wondering how to proceed with this, we will not be paying a penny to anyone as we already pay enough in rent which states we have parking spaces in the contract.

Can we continue to ignore or should we send an email back? I have saw that lazydaisy (ex solicitor) recommends responding but doesnt say you should respond.

I have attached the letter to the post, just it personally has both me and my partner worried as we are in the process of arranging our first mortgage and dont want something like this to come and bite us in the a**e!

I havent received one of these myself but I am expecting one in the near future.

Appreciate any help anyone can give me.

Thanks
P


Attached thumbnail(s)
Attached Image
 
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ostell
post Fri, 28 Nov 2014 - 22:27
Post #17


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 8,945
Joined: 8 Mar 2013
Member No.: 60,457



Did you notice the expression "May issue legal....". Only may.

I would write back to them pointing out again that you have a right to use the land without interference. If they issue a claim then you will counterclaim for the aggravation. If you receive any more letters from them, other than a cancellation, then there will be a charge of £100 per letter. This will be held to be accepted by their actions (someone knows the correct wording).

Point them in the direction of the Winchester case.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
farmerboy
post Fri, 28 Nov 2014 - 22:34
Post #18


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 1,235
Joined: 8 Nov 2013
From: an alternate dimension
Member No.: 66,580



QUOTE (boro12856 @ Fri, 28 Nov 2014 - 19:56) *
However in the interim I did begin with responding to every charge, denying to pay and requesting a POPLA. Only on ONE occasion did I ever receive a POPLA code, and as we became barraged with tickets I gave up responding to them all and just began to ignore as people said in other threads and mine that UKPC can be ignored.


Did you use it and win?

QUOTE (boro12856 @ Fri, 28 Nov 2014 - 19:56) *
Queue today when I received a message from my partner saying she has been issued with a letter from SMALL CLAIM SOLICITORS regarding three PCN received that we had ignored.


Heres a thread with some info on your small claims solicitors.
Not giving a popla code is a no no and a complaint to the BPA would have sorted it out. If you'd have approached this with a bit more effort you could have cost them a significant amount of money and they would have left you alone by now. If its a significant amount of tickets they feel its worth pursuing you in the hope that you'll give in but that's not the case is it though you may have to put some effort in.
This needs a gan letter. You could probably still ignore but I would engage. Look up Davey v UKPC in Winchester. See what others say.

This post has been edited by farmerboy: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 - 22:37
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
boro12856
post Fri, 28 Nov 2014 - 23:16
Post #19


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 52
Joined: 27 Aug 2013
Member No.: 64,741



QUOTE (farmerboy @ Fri, 28 Nov 2014 - 22:34) *
QUOTE (boro12856 @ Fri, 28 Nov 2014 - 19:56) *
However in the interim I did begin with responding to every charge, denying to pay and requesting a POPLA. Only on ONE occasion did I ever receive a POPLA code, and as we became barraged with tickets I gave up responding to them all and just began to ignore as people said in other threads and mine that UKPC can be ignored.


Did you use it and win?

QUOTE (boro12856 @ Fri, 28 Nov 2014 - 19:56) *
Queue today when I received a message from my partner saying she has been issued with a letter from SMALL CLAIM SOLICITORS regarding three PCN received that we had ignored.


Heres a thread with some info on your small claims solicitors.
Not giving a popla code is a no no and a complaint to the BPA would have sorted it out. If you'd have approached this with a bit more effort you could have cost them a significant amount of money and they would have left you alone by now. If its a significant amount of tickets they feel its worth pursuing you in the hope that you'll give in but that's not the case is it though you may have to put some effort in.
This needs a gan letter. You could probably still ignore but I would engage. Look up Davey v UKPC in Winchester. See what others say.


I did appeal in the beginning, but to be quite frank I just got sick of it all and I have a life without sitting and conducting letters none stop to these idiots.

With regards to the POPLA we received no we didnt win, we got another response saying the lowered charge we were offered was to be upheld. With regards to that one it was my car parked in our bay for our flat, and I parked overnight but forgot to display the permit they request me to show. I argued the case saying due to human error blah blah and got the response from UKPC saying they are offering me a lower fee, along with POPLA code.

What is a gan letter? And when you said heres a thread with some info there was no link, can you please share again?

Thanks
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Fleagle
post Sat, 29 Nov 2014 - 00:05
Post #20


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 451
Joined: 25 Mar 2009
Member No.: 27,300



You say your parking space is attached to your flat... What exactly does your lease say?

Just that, if the wording is right, you can sue the private parking company should they fail to stop issuing "parking tickets" after you've sent them an appropriate letter - as long as your lease says 'certain' things wink.gif .

We're talking significant financial sanctions and negative return on 'their' funds here (especially if every leaseholder indulges) wink.gif .

Alternatively (and more blatantly but more simply wink.gif ) - though no-one will suggest this *ahem* - the leaseholders could *allegedly* arrange to park "illegally" in turns of (say wink.gif ) five for every night each week, followed by the next five (or whatever number) parking "illegally" the next week, then the following five (as above) the week after - rinse and repeat until the "parking tickets stop being applied (to quote Jack Carter wink.gif , "I told you it wouldn't take long!!") wink.gif .

The leaseholders who parked "illegally" each week then each have seven "parking notices" which they will individually appeal and request POPLA codes each time (at 27 groats each wink.gif ) every time and it soon multiplies up - at which time the PPC soon exits stage left laugh.gif .

Not that anyone would recommend this organised sabotage.

Oh NO!! wink.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

7 Pages V   1 2 3 > » 
Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



Advertisement

Advertise here!

RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: Wednesday, 19th December 2018 - 00:23
Pepipoo uses cookies. You can find details of the cookies we use here along with links to information on how to manage them.
Please click the button to accept our cookies and hide this message. We’ll also assume that you’re happy to accept them if you continue to use the site.