CEO rules, Can CEO stop issuing PCN once process begun? Options

[Gumph]

I have recently befriended a CEO who has been patrolling a drop-off area near my son's primary school. I recently stopped in front of our GP surgery to carry my son inside due to a foot injury. When I return 9 minutes later, a CEO was entering the data into his device, ticketing my car. I told him of the emergency but he claimed that once he began to enter data, he could not stop. I have since been told on this website that this is true and is a rule to protect CEOs from being intimidated should a car owner arrive mid-procedure
My friendly local CEO has just told me that this is not true. He siad that at any point before the PCN is printed, a CEO can cancel it. This makes sense but conflicts with what I have read of PePiPoo
Anyone know any more about it?

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[PASTMYBEST]

It is not law that they cannot cancel, but is normal council policy for the reason stated

See paras 7.14 on here

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/go...traventions.pdf


The authority must have regard to this guidance s87 TMA 2004

[Longtime Lurker]

I wonder if anyone has actually tried using this as a procedural impropriety, fettered discretion defence at the adjudicators? If the council can be shown to be telling it's CEOs they cannot exercise discretion then it might work.... probably a long shot though.

[Incandescent]

It is not law that they cannot cancel, but is normal council policy for the reason stated

See paras 7.14 on here

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/go...traventions.pdf


The authority must have regard to this guidance s87 TMA 2004

But reading on, 7.15 refers to some situations where a PCN may not be served: -

However, the enforcement authority may wish to set out certain situations
when a penalty charge should not be issued. For example, an enforcement
authority may wish to consider issuing a verbal warning rather than a penalty
charge to a driver who has committed a minor contravention and is still with,
or returns to, the vehicle before a penalty charge notice has been served. The
enforcement authority should have clear policies, instructions and training
available on how to exercise such authority. These policies should form the
basis for staff training and should be published.

Of course it is all "should" and "may", so is totally ignored by virtually all councils. The main point is it refers to service of the PCN, so a CEO could well have started to prepare one and even have it ready to serve, so any council that says that the CEO cannot cancel a PCN is talking tosh. But of course, tosh is what they live by,

This post has been edited by Incandescent: Tue, 25 Feb 2020 - 11:02

[hcandersen]

Of course it is all "should" and "may", so is totally ignored by virtually all councils.


No. They develop a policy - 'have regard to' - which instructs CEOs that they may not stop once the process has been started.

And forget about 'fettering discretion'. With respect, it is necessary to know where this power lies, and it is with the council. The council then authorises specified officers under its Scheme of Delegation, and this would not include CEOs, only 'back office staff'.

This post has been edited by hcandersen: Tue, 25 Feb 2020 - 11:10

[southpaw82]

And forget about 'fettering discretion'. With respect, it is necessary to know where this power lies, and it is with the council. The council then authorises specified officers under its Scheme of Delegation, and this would not include CEOs, only 'back office staff'.

That’s what I was going to say. The council often does, on apparently sound grounds, refuse to delegate its authority to CEOs, ergo there is no discretion to fetter.

[Gumph]

So, it seems that CEOs can cancel a PCN before printing or serving, but they may not be allowedto by their bosses

'But of course, tosh is what they live by' LOL

[stamfordman]

There is a difference between discretion and judgement. Nearly all parking sections on council sites say that CEOs are not allowed to use discretion, meaning that they cannot determine at the scene that a contravention that they have started to record is then open to a change of mind. They are given latitude to judge whether a contravention is taking place through guidance on observation.

[southpaw82]

Well, clearly the CEO has to think the contravention has occurred before they can issue a PCN.

[SX4]

As an ex CEO I can tell you how it works ,
To issue a pcn you have to enter all the details into the handheld computer eg vehicle make ,model , colour, and vrm also location and contravention code , some contraventions require observation time some don’t .
To input all these details takes about four different screens on hhc.
Once you have started to input on the penultimate screen the HHC will not let you abort the pcn , the next screen is print so after the CEO starts the penultimate screen too late to abort.
It used to take me about 40 seconds from start of input to print but that was about 5 year’s ago when I did the job.

[stamfordman]

I believe a CEO can cancel an issued PCN but only if it has an error that needs correcting in a reissued one?

[SX4]

I believe a CEO can cancel an issued PCN but only if it has an error that needs correcting in a reissued one?
[/quote]

Once issued a pcn can only be cancelled by supervisors or back office, the CEO can request a cancellation by filling in appropriate form detailing why the Pcn should be cancelled for example issued in error or permit not seen until after issue.
But the pcn can not be cancelled on the HHC by the CEO ,now when a pcn is issued it it is sent immediately by mobile data to back office the CEO has no means to cancel immediately.

[Gumph]

Thanks, SX4. Your contributions are invaluable

[nigelbb]

As an ex CEO I can tell you how it works ,
To issue a pcn you have to enter all the details into the handheld computer eg vehicle make ,model , colour, and vrm also location and contravention code , some contraventions require observation time some don’t .
To input all these details takes about four different screens on hhc.
Once you have started to input on the penultimate screen the HHC will not let you abort the pcn , the next screen is print so after the CEO starts the penultimate screen too late to abort.
It used to take me about 40 seconds from start of input to print but that was about 5 year’s ago when I did the job.

I'm surprised that it's not possible to abort when you suddenly realise that you made a mistake with VRM, location etc

[The Rookie]

Once issued a pcn can only be cancelled by supervisors or back office

So even if the CEO then KNOWS the PCN isn't valid for some reason they cannot then self cancel.

Lunatics and asylum.......

[cp8759]

Once issued a pcn can only be cancelled by supervisors or back office

So even if the CEO then KNOWS the PCN isn't valid for some reason they cannot then self cancel.

Lunatics and asylum.......

There are good reasons for it, after all the CEO can make notes stating why the PCN should be cancelled, but if they could cancel it themselves they'd be openinig themselves to accusations of favouritism, corruption or whatnot (Oh you cancelled a PCN when you realised it was you mate's car, oh you took a tenner of that bloke to cancel his PCN...) and sadly human nature suggests that such accusations would be made, whether warranted or not.