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PCN for wheels on faded double yellow
freddy234
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 10:56
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Hi,

So i got this PCN for parking at the end of a road full of cars and my back wheels happen to be on double yellows. I was late for work and genuinely didnt realise my wheels were touching them.

I went back to photograph the lines and i have attached those, they are faded and my wheels are exactly on the faded parts, so i was going to use this initially as the basis for my appeal. (would i even get far with that?)
I am still within the first 14 days and have not made an informal appeal which i was going to do online. I have no access to any information on their website such as photos they took etc. I dont know whether to ask for those first or go straight in with the faded lines?
I have attached the PCN for possible errors?

Many thanks for any help








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post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 10:56
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stamfordman
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 11:06
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Look on council site for council pics. show us the location.

This post has been edited by stamfordman: Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 11:17
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freddy234
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 11:22
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Hi,

I have gone back to cheshire east site and can not find access anywhere, only links to how to pay, appeal and a list of contraventions and mitigating circumstances.
When i go to the appeal page it states:

The civil enforcement officer will have taken photographs of the offence and will have made notes of any conversation that took place. We will review this information, along with your appeal and evidence before making a decision.
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PASTMYBEST
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 11:26
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post the council photos.

regulation 3(2)(b)(ii) is missing from the PCN or at least in a form that complies this is ground for cancelation on its own


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freddy234
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 11:33
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Thanks for the replies,

This is the location, my car would have been exactly behind that black car.
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cp8759
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 11:44
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We know the location, you really need to show us the council photos.


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freddy234
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 11:49
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Can anyone guide me to where exactly i can see the images, i have been looking for them since i got the ticket
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stamfordman
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 11:53
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PM me the car reg and PCN number and I'll have a look. Not all councils put them online.

This post has been edited by stamfordman: Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 11:53
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freddy234
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 12:12
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If this is of any help, its the photo i took when i found the ticket..

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DastardlyDick
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 12:17
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QUOTE (freddy234 @ Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 13:12) *
If this is of any help, its the photo i took when i found the ticket..



We need to see further back to the rear of your car, hence the request for council photo's. At the moment given your photo and that of GSV, the lines are (IMHO) borderline "substantial compliance".
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cp8759
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 12:22
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I also agree the lines are substantially compliant.


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freddy234
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 12:24
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At the minute i have no council photos, what do you reckon is the best way to go about the informal appeal. should i stick to the regulation 3(2)(b)(ii) is missing/request photos or say the lines are not compliant?

thanks
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stamfordman
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 12:30
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Seems you have to enter your details to challenge and there's no indication that you can review pics online. You can though email them and ask.

But you might just as well make a challenge on poor markings and maybe minimal encroachment - they will no doubt produce the pics if (when) they reject and will reoffer the discount.

Adding PMB's point first gives you two grounds to challenge on.

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freddy234
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 12:34
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Thanks for all the help, will keep you posted.
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PASTMYBEST
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 14:12
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You are parked right at a junction, next to a dropped kerb. The lines will not save you


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DancingDad
post Sun, 24 Jun 2018 - 15:00
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Can't see any adjudicator finding on lines being inadequate.
Especially given proximity to corner and Dropped Kerb, both of which should put a driver on notice that they may be in contravention (actually are re the corner but not something council can penalise for)

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freddy234
post Mon, 25 Jun 2018 - 18:21
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Hi All,

I emailed the council yesterday asking for photos and they have sent them today, see below(yes he actually took 10 photos).
Looking at the other replies, would i have a chance with appealing with the 2 points mentioned previously or is it best to pay up? Thanks!











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PASTMYBEST
post Mon, 25 Jun 2018 - 18:56
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Before the end of the 14 day period send this

I challenge PCN number xxxxx on the ground that the authority commit a procedural impropriety, in failing to comply with regulation 3(2)(b)(ii) of the appeals regulations.

Procedural impropriety is a statutory ground and if found the PCN must be cancelled.



Lets see what they come back with before deciding whether to risk the discount or not. Make sure you get and e mail acknowledgement of free proof of posting from the post office


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freddy234
post Mon, 25 Jun 2018 - 20:11
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Hi,
Thank you for your response,
I'm assuming this Procedural impropriety is a statutory ground and if found the PCN must be cancelled., is for my info only?


Would this sound okay?



I challenge PCN number xxxxx Firstly due to the poor markings and minimal encroachment of the vehicle as proved by the photos taken by your CEO. Secondly, on the ground that the authority has committed a procedural impropriety, in failing to comply with regulation 3(2)(b)(ii) of the appeals regulations. I would therefore expect this PCN to be cancelled with immediate effect.





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PASTMYBEST
post Mon, 25 Jun 2018 - 20:54
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QUOTE (freddy234 @ Mon, 25 Jun 2018 - 21:11) *
Hi,
Thank you for your response,
I'm assuming this Procedural impropriety is a statutory ground and if found the PCN must be cancelled., is for my info only?


Would this sound okay?



I challenge PCN number xxxxx Firstly due to the poor markings and minimal encroachment of the vehicle as proved by the photos taken by your CEO. Secondly, on the ground that the authority has committed a procedural impropriety, in failing to comply with regulation 3(2)(b)(ii) of the appeals regulations. I would therefore expect this PCN to be cancelled with immediate effect.



No include it in the challenge

For your benefit, I would not risk the discount on that alone but as they will re offer the discount lets see if we can get a hash of a response to add some meat


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