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S172 Request for Driver Details, Driving without due care, failing to stop and report collision
s1mondinho
post Tue, 6 Dec 2022 - 23:22
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First post here – any advice, help, recommended specialist motor solicitors etc. would be most welcomed.

Received a requirement to provide name and address of Driver Section 172 Road Traffic Act 1988. Letter was issued on 28/11/22 and this was posted to my home address on 6/12/22.

Is alleged to have committed the following offence(s) DRIVING WITHOUT DUE CARE AND ATTENTION, FAILING TO STOP, AND FAILING TO REPORT A COLLISION at > location < on > date < at > time <.

I was the driver at the time of the collision so will fill this in as requested within 28 days. Here is what happened: I was driving and in a stationery car/vehicle at a set of traffic lights being on red. There is also a pelican crossing and further up the road – I'd say 20-30 metres – is another set of traffic lights/pelican crossing. As the traffic lights hit green, I accelerated (on the right lane) and the car on the left lane accelerated at the same time.

As we approached the second set of traffic lights, a young woman dashed across the road, and because she ran so abruptly, I stood no chance of braking in time and I, unfortunately, hit her. My speed was no more than 25mph. I immediately stopped to see if she was ok – and other pedestrians and bystanders came to her aid on the road/pavement. Emergency services and the police were called but shockingly nobody from the public service sector helped her, attended the scene of the collision, recorded details of the incident, question me about what had happened, etc.

As a law-abiding citizen, I did not drive off and passers-by blamed me for the collision, as they would always do without observing closely what happened. Thankfully, the young woman survived and had no serious injuries (at the time of the collision). As far as I knew she suffered a swollen ankle. Because it happened so quickly in a very busy part of a major UK city, I did not have a chance to exchange details with her and I was advised not to go near her by some bystanders and wait for the Police to arrive.

No emergency services were present after 20min of waiting, and traffic police were nowhere to be found, so it was decided by a friend of the injured young lady that they would take a taxi and go to the nearest Hospital A&E. A witness and bystander who saw everything said to me; you must report the collision to the local Police which I did less than an hour after the accident. I have the case reference number.

Now, my question is there is another A4 page of guidance sent by the Road Traffic Collision Investigation Unit of the Police Force to tell them my version of the collision - should I tell them what I have already said in this post? Be honest and own up to what happened, as I believe there is CCTV video evidence capturing the car and pedestrian collision, coupled with a witness or maybe the victim submitting the details of the incident. In the letter, it is currently worded 'At this stage of the investigation, there are allegations only, and in order to investigate the allegations we need to identify the driver of the vehicle at the time of the alleged incident.'


The offences: failing to stop and failing to report a collision should not be offences as I have clearly reported them to the Police. Now, with the driving without due care and attention allegation, I feel they will charge me with this. Should I get a specialist motor lawyer involved in readiness for this charge and a possible court appearance?

I am presently at my wit's end and fearing the worst-case scenario – I could see myself getting a criminal conviction, losing my job over this, and my driver's license if I don't fight and defend my actions. I have never broken the law or even been to court so this is a very scary experience and what could be a severe outcome for myself and my family. Any comments, past experiences or known experiences, advice or anything would be most welcome – thank you.





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post Tue, 6 Dec 2022 - 23:22
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TMC Towcester
post Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 12:54
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I'm more confused than before!

you were where the Peugeot is in the GSV? The car to your left was in what appears to be a (worn) left turn lane - did it turn left in fact? We assume the lights were green, therefore the pedestrian ignored the 'red man' at the other side of the junction?

Assuming you were driving a 'typical' road car, your contact would have been at her thigh height or above (depending how tall she was) so a swollen ankle seems unlikely? Was she knocked to the ground or 'travelled' up your bonnet to wards the windscreen? I'm assuming you were doing much less than 25 mph at the time of impact?
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s1mondinho
post Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 13:13
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QUOTE (TMC Towcester @ Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 12:54) *
I'm more confused than before!

you were where the Peugeot is in the GSV? The car to your left was in what appears to be a (worn) left turn lane - did it turn left in fact? We assume the lights were green, therefore the pedestrian ignored the 'red man' at the other side of the junction?

Assuming you were driving a 'typical' road car, your contact would have been at her thigh height or above (depending how tall she was) so a swollen ankle seems unlikely? Was she knocked to the ground or 'travelled' up your bonnet to wards the windscreen? I'm assuming you were doing much less than 25 mph at the time of impact?


Cars can make a left turn but it's actually two lanes that divert into one lane – the impact is where the Grey Peugeot is, outside Boots thereabouts. She never travelled up my bonnet and hit my windscreen, but I did knock her to the ground and clipped her leg/ankle. The other guy in the car was in the left lane.

As traffic lights hit green, we both moved and I hit the pedestrian as she ran across L-R.

QUOTE (Manx_Tom @ Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 12:30) *
QUOTE (TMC Towcester @ Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 09:27) *
QUOTE (s1mondinho @ Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 08:40) *
QUOTE (TMC Towcester @ Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 07:43) *
What did the car in the adjacent lane do? Did the pedestrian run L-R or R-L?


The car accelerated on the left lane, the pedestrian ran L-R.


But missed the pedestrian who would have been in front of the other car even more unexpectedly/suddenly? ...


I also don't understand from the OP's account how - if the pedestrian ran out suddenly from left to right - the car in the left-hand lane managed to avoid her (and carried on without stopping!) but the OP hit her.

Also - is it at all possible that in the confusion post-accident that witnesses have told the police that the OP failed to stop rather than the driver of the other car?

I suspect others are right that the OP's best bet is to reply identifying himself as the driver but providing evidence that (1) he did stop at the time, and (2) he did report the incident to the police.

Two other points - the OP says that both police and ambulance services failed to turn up despite being called. Does the OP know for certain that they were called?

And does the OP have contact details of witnesses to the accident and who called police and ambulance?


It happened so quickly, from the initial impact to the young lady pedestrian leaving in a taxi to go to the hospital. Ambulance was definitely called and I heard from a passer-by it was gonna take something like 90min to arrive. No sign of police. I stood there for a good 20min after the collision and then decided to ring them up and report the incident.

There were witnesses and once the pedestrian left the scene, everyone left. It was a scary and terrible moment for me, and I just didn't think about getting contact details from witnesses. My head was just all over the place at the time, trying to process everything.

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disgrunt
post Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 13:33
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you appear to have a solid defence against the failing to stop and failing to report (assuming they believe you and can find the incident number at the other station).

I suggest that any offer to dispose of the driving without due care before court (course or fixed penalty and 3 points) is grabbed with both hands.

A lot of people would look at that road layout and your description of what happened and conclude you were racing the other driver away from the lights to stop them cutting in and hit a pedestrian that hadn’t finished crossing at the other side of the junction.

I can’t see how a pedestrian could dash across 2 lanes of traffic and almost make it without you seeing her and braking? Unless you weren’t paying attention, in which case it’s careless. If you were racing the other vehicle you could be looking at dangerous driving.
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TMC Towcester
post Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 14:46
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I can't see Boots! I assume(d) she ran L-R from the 'Circus' towards 'Paramount? If so -and you were at the front of the outside lane, I too am stumped how she was missed by the car alongside you (maybe has was slower off the lights) and how you couldn't see her unless she was an Olympic sprinter at full pelt.

If you get the offer of course or point/fine for the driving - take it! The FTR is clearly a non-starter as you have the call reference - there will be call logs to emergency services too.
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Manx_Tom
post Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 18:49
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QUOTE (TMC Towcester @ Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 14:46) *
I can't see Boots! I assume(d) she ran L-R from the 'Circus' towards 'Paramount? If so -and you were at the front of the outside lane, I too am stumped how she was missed by the car alongside you (maybe has was slower off the lights) and how you couldn't see her unless she was an Olympic sprinter at full pelt...


I think she was hit at this crosssing, going from the left (from the side with Wetherspoons "Paramount" pub, building with "Circus" on it, Premier Inn just up the road, a small Boots behind the tree) across to the right (to the side with "Philpotts" and "Giorgio Italian Restaurant).

Just before two lanes begin to merge into one...

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.4762419,-2....6384!8i8192
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mickR
post Wed, 7 Dec 2022 - 20:25
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like I said if there are statements from other witnesses they "might"
confirm the race theory.
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