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Magistrates' Powers, Speeding - Gathering New Evidence
anoncardriver
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 12:46
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Do the Magistrates have the power to gather their own evidence during trial?

I claimed I had proof that the evidence being used against me (photo) was not the same as the unused evidence (video).
The magistrates looked at the material and decided they were the same.
They are wrong and didn't ask for my evidence.

I thought magistrates weigh the evidence not gather or ignore it?

Does anyone have any acts/cases I can cite for my appeal?

Thanks!
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post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 12:46
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The Rookie
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:17
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There is no negative inference, her evidence in court renders her statement a nullity, especially as it wasn’t legally a statement anyway if it wasn’t signed. In other words it’s a total irrelevance.

Your use of the word traveller is ringing alarm bells at where you may have got some of your information.

The first appeal is held as a fresh trial, anything that went before is irrelevant, no findings of fact will be carried over.

Have you asked for leave to appeal?


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anoncardriver
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:19
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QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:14) *
QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:04) *
2. no, not prepared


Well, that’s a problem. You’re expected to have your evidence ready for trial, not just turn up and then ask for more time.

QUOTE
2. Yes due to non-disclosure, and failure by prosecution to give schedule on time. no reason given for refusal.


I’d be surprised if the court didn’t give a reason. When you say “non-disclosure” what do you mean? Bear in mind you’re not entitled to have sight of everything, only the evidence the prosecution intends to rely on plus anything that (in their opinion) undermines the prosecution case or assists the defence case. Did you tell the prosecution in advance what your defence was? Did you give any evidence to the court as to how what you were asking for would assist your defence or undermine the prosecution case?

QUOTE
4. in person


So the admissibility of her statement is irrelevant. Did she give the same evidence as in her statement?

QUOTE
5. unreliability/authenticity issues

Have to keep evidence to myself for now.


Yeah, that’s not really going to work. For a start we can’t help you if we don’t know what you’re playing with. You do realise you’ll have to disclose it all to the prosecution anyway, right? You can’t just rock up on the day and go “ah ha!”.


QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:12) *
Evidence was the same. But what about the negative inference from not being willing to add her signature in court?

So if the evidence was the same what negative inference is there to draw? She was not required to sign her statement because it was not being tendered in evidence. Nothing wrong with that. If she’d said something different you might have been able to make something out of it but she didn’t.


Any other opinions on this negative inference situation?
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AntonyMMM
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:26
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QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:19) *
Any other opinions on this negative inference situation?


There is no negative inference (again)
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anoncardriver
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:27
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QUOTE (AntonyMMM @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:58) *
QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:55) *
I was hoping you guys with your experience might help a fellow traveller...


Telling you it sounds like you might have messed up is helping if it prevents you digging yourself deeper into trouble (and expense)


Not very constructive, friend. Can you explain how I messed up?
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AntonyMMM
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:40
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QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:27) *
QUOTE (AntonyMMM @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:58) *
QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:55) *
I was hoping you guys with your experience might help a fellow traveller...


Telling you it sounds like you might have messed up is helping if it prevents you digging yourself deeper into trouble (and expense)


Not very constructive, friend. Can you explain how I messed up?


You seem to have gone completely unprepared into a not guilty hearing, presented no real defence and made the common mistake of trying to find clever tricks and loopholes rather than address the actual evidence.

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anoncardriver
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:46
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QUOTE (AntonyMMM @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:40) *
QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:27) *
QUOTE (AntonyMMM @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:58) *
QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 14:55) *
I was hoping you guys with your experience might help a fellow traveller...


Telling you it sounds like you might have messed up is helping if it prevents you digging yourself deeper into trouble (and expense)


Not very constructive, friend. Can you explain how I messed up?


You seem to have gone completely unprepared into a not guilty hearing, presented no real defence and made the common mistake of trying to find clever tricks and loopholes rather than address the actual evidence.


Asking for an adjournment is not a clever trick. I had a sound reason.
You need to read my appeal.
(Troll alert)
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The Rookie
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:08
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Your appeal will be heard as a fresh case as you’ve been told, so reading what you wrote as an appeal is a waste of time, what you need is a defence which currently you haven’t indicated really what it will be.

And your sound reason (or what you think was a sound reason) was?

You don’t need to flag that you may be a troll....

This post has been edited by The Rookie: Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:09


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anoncardriver
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:15
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:17) *
There is no negative inference, her evidence in court renders her statement a nullity, especially as it wasn’t legally a statement anyway if it wasn’t signed. In other words it’s a total irrelevance.

Your use of the word traveller is ringing alarm bells at where you may have got some of your information.

The first appeal is held as a fresh trial, anything that went before is irrelevant, no findings of fact will be carried over.

Have you asked for leave to appeal?




Rookie and AntonyMMM - please don't add further opinions and find someone else to troll.

This post has been edited by anoncardriver: Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:16
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The Rookie
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:15
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No, they can just turn up with the witness again. (Question now edited from the above post)

You’ve been asked a whole raft of questions to try and understand what your actual defence was (you have to share it before a trial anyway) and other details, of you don’t answer then you can’t realky expect much help.

Also please don’t block quote, edit to what your answering it makes it a lot easier to follow your thread.

We’ll add opinions until you can add facts we can comment on. The moderators on this sight like to do the moderating ethemselves by the way.

This post has been edited by The Rookie: Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:17


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S172's
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Council PCN's
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Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
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anoncardriver
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:17
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Rookie and AntonyMMM - please don't add further opinions and find someone else to troll.

You are preventing real people from helping. If you want to help me, go away.

This post has been edited by anoncardriver: Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:20
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nosferatu1001
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:42
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OP - you need to actually answer questions, with facts, if you want any help

If instead you want "of course you were robbed, robbed blind I tell you" then you wont get that here. So far, you went not guilty, failed ot havea defence, and failed to have a sound well articulated reason as to why disclosure was needed, why its lack of disclusure was relevant, and as such why you should be allowed to waste court time by being granted an adjournment.
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anoncardriver
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:44
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New question: how do we delete a thread?
Probably "that's not how it works" lol

This post has been edited by anoncardriver: Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:46
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ohnoes
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 15:56
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Do come back and let us know how you got along with your secret defence.
Based on what you have/haven't told us, I expect some hefty costs along with the punishment for the original offence.


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Fredd
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 16:08
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 16:15) *
We’ll add opinions until you can add facts we can comment on. The moderators on this sight like to do the moderating ethemselves by the way.

It seems perfectly reasonable to me for an OP to ask that you don't post in their thread if they don't feel that you're helping them - you don't have some God-given right to shove your advice down their throat, any more than you (or any of the other people leaping to post their opinions of the OP here) have an obligation to help them.


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anoncardriver
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 16:13
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QUOTE (Fredd @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 17:08) *
QUOTE (The Rookie @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 16:15) *
We’ll add opinions until you can add facts we can comment on. The moderators on this sight like to do the moderating ethemselves by the way.

It seems perfectly reasonable to me for an OP to ask that you don't post in their thread if they don't feel that you're helping them - you don't have some God-given right to shove your advice down their throat, any more than you (or any of the other people leaping to post their opinions of the OP here) have an obligation to help them.



Thank you Fredd.

(Rookie, learn to recognise the difference between helping and being a pain in the butt)
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anoncardriver
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 21:38
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Does anyone have the specs and manual for this device please? Or individual specs for laser and camera?
Truvelo website has some info, but not detailed enough.

Cheers!

This post has been edited by anoncardriver: Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 21:39
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cp8759
post Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 22:06
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QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 22:38) *
Does anyone have the specs and manual for this device please? Or individual specs for laser and camera?
Truvelo website has some info, but not detailed enough.

Cheers!

Has this got anything to do with your other thread?


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Unzippy
post Tue, 23 Oct 2018 - 04:10
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QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 21:38) *
Does anyone have the specs and manual for this device please? Or individual specs for laser and camera?
Truvelo website has some info, but not detailed enough.

Cheers!



What device?
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The Rookie
post Tue, 23 Oct 2018 - 06:28
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QUOTE (anoncardriver @ Mon, 22 Oct 2018 - 22:38) *
Or individual specs for laser and camera?
Truvelo website has some info

Hope you don't mind a fact (no opinion), Truvelo uses buried sensors in the road surface, no laser is used. So the Truvelo details are no good if you were caught using a laser and vice versa.

This post has been edited by The Rookie: Tue, 23 Oct 2018 - 06:29


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There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
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Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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anoncardriver
post Tue, 23 Oct 2018 - 08:39
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Does anyone have the specs and manual for LaserWitness Lite please? Or individual specs for laser and camera?
Truvelo website has some info, but not detailed enough.

Cheers!
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