PePiPoo Helping the motorist get justice

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

465 Pages V   1 2 3 > » 

Incandescent
Posted on: Today, 12:30


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


As you have the NtO, the discount has gone, so you might as well take them all the way to the adjudicators, as the penalty remains the same.

I would appeal on the faded lines following from lines that were in recently maintained, good condition, that lead you to believe the double-yellow area had been shortened. Faded lines on their own are not sufficient to win an appeal. Adjudicators accept councils cannot maintain all lines in perfect condition. Here, however, it looks as if the lines have been maintained, and the length you are on not, because they no longer apply there. You could show the opposite side of the street as an example where they have been shortened.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376579 · Replies: 47 · Views: 1,702

Incandescent
Posted on: Today, 12:18


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


OK, OP, you just carry on.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376571 · Replies: 10 · Views: 114

Incandescent
Posted on: Today, 12:12


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


One thing that needs to go into the guidance is to re-offer the discount if an appeal is made within the discount period. Some councils already do this, but there are some venal and rapacious councils, (Nottingham City Council for instance), that don't.
The current guidance is a joke, still in draft form since 2008, 10 years ago. Councils are absolutely coining it, especially in London where PCN penalties are double the rest of the UK.
  Forum: News / Press Articles · Post Preview: #1376564 · Replies: 4 · Views: 128

Incandescent
Posted on: Today, 12:06


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


Shares up on bad results; the ways of the City of London are wondrous to behold. I suppose the reason is it now looks as if somebody is in charge and knows what he's doing. Until it all goes belly-up of course ! The new CEO is "kitchen-sinking", which is normal when one first takes charge of a bad case.
  Forum: News / Press Articles · Post Preview: #1376562 · Replies: 2 · Views: 32

Incandescent
Posted on: Today, 09:26


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


London councils issue PCNs which have double the penalty to the rest of the UK, so can afford to flood the streets with CEOs to issue PCNs like confetti. Manchester probably doesn't have such ubiquitous coverage so people can park on yellow lines and get away with it, but not all the time, eventually they'll get a ticket. Councils balance revenue from PCNs against costs of enforcement. In London they make huge surpluses. What Manchester earn I don't know but it will be less, I would have thought.

Loading is an exemption, but you'll struggle to convince anyone you needed several hours, you can only take a long as necessary.

  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376516 · Replies: 8 · Views: 102

Incandescent
Posted on: Today, 07:58


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


BBC Business Live today

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/business-43834513

Shareholders whalloped for £700m rights issue, huge £513m loss, and revenues down 4%

No gloating, please.

(OK, maybe a little)
  Forum: News / Press Articles · Post Preview: #1376495 · Replies: 2 · Views: 32

Incandescent
Posted on: Today, 07:46


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


Here is the case that decided the matter and upon which all councils rely when cases like this come up. It's quite clear that the public have free and unfettered access to the area right up to the wall, indeed they have to have that in order to park their bikes.

The Dawood case:

https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/sites/de...n%20refused.pdf

and Dr Dawood actually owned the land on which he parked !!

So better to pay the discount, I reckon
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376490 · Replies: 8 · Views: 102

Incandescent
Posted on: Yesterday, 21:35


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


Adjudicators have ruled on proportionality many times and are entitled to do so under the statutory grounds of "the penalty exceeded the relevant amount in the circumstances of the case"

There is absolutely nothing in the statute that defines what "circumstances of the case" are, or even could be. Not only does the statute have nothing to say on the circumstances surrounding a case, there is nothing in any guidance either. So for an adjudicator to say he is constrained by the statute, whilst true, shows that he is either (1), being disingenuous, or (2) is woefully ignorant of his adjudication powers, because there is a statutory ground available that would cover proportionality. A review is essential on grounds of law, surely ?
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376442 · Replies: 16 · Views: 326

Incandescent
Posted on: Yesterday, 20:28


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


QUOTE (sofnet2000 @ Sun, 22 Apr 2018 - 20:46) *
QUOTE (Incandescent @ Sun, 22 Apr 2018 - 20:16) *
Why didn't you just park on the yellow line that can be seen in the photos ? Boarding/alighting passengers is exempt.


As I said this is a private land owned by the housing association and I never thought traffic wardens will come around here, plus I was just taking the wife upstairs and coming back to go and find parking in neighbouring roads.
Anyway this is too late now, I need to find a way of cacelling this PCN

thanks

Indeed it is too late, but at the moment, just making a point about the future. If you are going to submit an informal challenge then you have several things, one of which is the private land aspect, and also BB holder exemptions, but these may not exempt parking by dropped kerbs, only you can tell us what is in the conditions for your BB. Post up the council reply here when you get it, as they often shoot themselves in the foot when replying.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376421 · Replies: 7 · Views: 97

Incandescent
Posted on: Yesterday, 20:21


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


If by "they" you mean Derby City Council, then no. Councils look upon things like this as "nice little earner", and refuse all appeals as it is they who keep all of the penalty money if you cough-up, (OK they may allow 1 in 25 million). Any argument based on a trivial transgression (de minimis) is only considered at adjudication where a more balanced view is taken. Of course, in order to get the matter placed in front of an adjudicator you have to forego the discount, so most people just cough-up thus reinforcing the council's venality and rapacity.

If you're worried about having to pay an additional £30 if you take it to adjudication, remember that you won't get an adjudication for several weeks, even months.This gives plenty of time to save it up and if you win you can buy a nice bottle of champagne with the savings. It's a double-or-quits gamble, really.

Let's be clear on it - it is ruthless, venal, and rapacious to enforce a restricted bus stop when there is no bus service, and an abuse of power in my opinion.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376419 · Replies: 7 · Views: 81

Incandescent
Posted on: Yesterday, 19:19


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Sun, 22 Apr 2018 - 20:10) *
QUOTE (Incandescent @ Sun, 22 Apr 2018 - 20:04) *
I can just about see a broad yellow line indicating a bus stop. To be restricted there must be a sign indicating "No stopping except buses". No sign=no contravention. The really stupid thing is if you had stopped on the double yellow lines to drop-off passengers this is an exemption. I would have thought an appeal based on de minimis could work especially if you can find out the buses calling there at the time you did the drop-off. However this argument would involve going to the Traffic Penalty Tribunal as the council will never give way, they love the money too much. They keep every last cent of any penalty you pay them, so hardly unbiased when it comes to dealing with an appeal.


Meant to post this.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.9215265,-...3312!8i6656

OK, so the sign is there, so that's one argument shot down. However when do buses start calling at that bus stop ?
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376410 · Replies: 7 · Views: 81

Incandescent
Posted on: Yesterday, 19:16


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


Why didn't you just park on the yellow line that can be seen in the photos ? Boarding/alighting passengers is exempt.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376408 · Replies: 7 · Views: 97

Incandescent
Posted on: Yesterday, 19:14


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


Yes.

If the PCN has fatal errors of content, you need to appeal on these as well. Others will point them out, as I'm not an expert.

The really important thing is - don't miss the deadline date.

You have already paid all there is to pay; there is nothing extra in taking them to London Tribunals if they refuse the appeal, (as it is 99.99999% certain they will). Newham have a lot of form on disproportionate towing and the suspicion has to be the nature of the contract with the towing contractor. How are they paid for towing ?
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376407 · Replies: 12 · Views: 197

Incandescent
Posted on: Yesterday, 19:04


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


I can just about see a broad yellow line indicating a bus stop. To be restricted there must be a sign indicating "No stopping except buses". No sign=no contravention. The really stupid thing is if you had stopped on the double yellow lines to drop-off passengers this is an exemption. I would have thought an appeal based on de minimis could work especially if you can find out the buses calling there at the time you did the drop-off. However this argument would involve going to the Traffic Penalty Tribunal as the council will never give way, they love the money too much. They keep every last cent of any penalty you pay them, so hardly unbiased when it comes to dealing with an appeal.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376403 · Replies: 7 · Views: 81

Incandescent
Posted on: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 - 20:34


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


QUOTE (John U.K. @ Sat, 21 Apr 2018 - 18:33) *
QUOTE (Incandescent @ Sat, 21 Apr 2018 - 16:42) *
I would say you did, because they have removed the vehicle access to the gateway via a dropped kerb, so it could be considered to be all footway. However I'm not expert on the interstices of highways law, so see what the others say.


DK looka pretty obvious in both GSV and Council pic?

Mea culpa. "should have gone to Specsavers !"
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376272 · Replies: 23 · Views: 422

Incandescent
Posted on: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 - 16:42


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


I would say you did, because they have removed the vehicle access to the gateway via a dropped kerb, so it could be considered to be all footway. However I'm not expert on the interstices of highways law, so see what the others say.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376221 · Replies: 23 · Views: 422

Incandescent
Posted on: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 - 07:57


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


QUOTE (iFlip92 @ Sat, 21 Apr 2018 - 01:23) *
I gave up and paid in the end. Seems like the hassle outweighs the benefits here for £65 where I've spent more than a day on the matter. I'm not sure how or to who to complain about it as a follow-up really. I think these types of chicanes are inappropriate for the road considering some people have modified vehicles with wider wheelbases or even for eg. if you have a Lamborghini or some US import you can't go through the narrow bit of the road at all. There should be some law about the minimum road width or at least remove the metal side posts and level the pavement so you don't scrape your rims. Nevermind the fact there should be transparency about why that was needed there and built with tax payer money as well as by what regulations has that been built. You don't see this dumb **** anywhere else in Europe.

Complaining about this installation is a political matter you need to take up with your councillor(s).
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376117 · Replies: 23 · Views: 716

Incandescent
Posted on: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 - 07:54


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


Put aside any stress you may have. Is the address on the Charge Certificate correct ? If yes, then it looks as if the NtO went astray either in their office or in the post. All you have to do now is wait for the Order for Recovery which will include forms to make a Witness Statement. One of the grounds on the form is "I did not receive the Notice to Owner". This Witness Statement procedure is the back-stop to deal with cases where documents go astray. If the address is not correct you need to check your V5C and get it updated asap.

What you don't want to do is pay the CC. However, you need to contact them again and ask them when they will be issuing the OfR, and then keep contacting them every week until they say it has been sent, OR, you actually receive it. You then fill in the forms, send them off and the process is reverted to the Notice to Owner stage.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376116 · Replies: 39 · Views: 1,628

Incandescent
Posted on: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 22:23


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


QUOTE (dan79 @ Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 16:48) *
Its my fault I miss red the date sorry, I was in a rush I always park there I read as it starts 16/4/18 23.59, there was a lot in that area, id parked somewhere earlier like that where it was still ok.

Was that the actual date on the suspension sign, as that indicates it starts at a minute before midnight on the 16th April, but your PCN whilst on the same date, was issued before that time.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376099 · Replies: 11 · Views: 228

Incandescent
Posted on: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 22:17


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


Having now seen the location, (thanks CP8759), I would say, yes the signs are very prominent, but that it is impossible to read all the information quickly enough to make a decision. There is a load of text that can only be read when quite close up.

There was an adjudication on this in London, I think, where the adjudicator said that the information on the sign could not be read unless the driver stopped. What does the time 7 pm-7am apply to for instance ? Typical Nottingham, of course; set a load of traps and get rich on the proceeds

There is also the vague locus argument too.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376096 · Replies: 7 · Views: 202

Incandescent
Posted on: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 19:07


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


QUOTE (Motofun99 @ Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 19:15) *
Thank you for coming back to me.

The car hire company wasn't involved, I paid myself for everything, as I have to drive back to the airport.

I understand what are you saying, but how can I prove to the adjudicator that there was some parking space available?

Thank you for your help.

Difficult, but nothing to stop you saying there were spaces even after you had parked-up. However, as you paid for a different car, as far as the council is concerned at the time the car was seen, no payment had been made to park. In circumstances like this, the tow could be considered justifiable, at least that is what the council will argue at London Tribunals.

I do hope it goes your way tomorrow, but I suspect it won't.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376040 · Replies: 16 · Views: 326

Incandescent
Posted on: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 18:58


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


+1
The problem we face is that the YBJ legislation is decades old when traffic was a lot lighter and there was no CCTV. Needless to say, YBJs are now a huge money earner to London councils and TfL, and their installation is now so widespread that one has to ask what their purpose now is - traffic management or cash generation. You can bet your bottom dollar that if councils didn't earn shedloads of money from these devices they would not be enforcing to the extent that they do. The legislation has never been pdated to reflect the locations where YBJs have been installed. I expect Parliament considered they would only ever be placed at cross roads. The only hope is that MPs get loads of PCNs for them; then you'll see prompt action !!

  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376037 · Replies: 4 · Views: 141

Incandescent
Posted on: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 18:48


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


QUOTE (soobee11 @ Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 18:47) *
Thanks guys

Anglers lane is narrow, two cars cannot go up at one time even though it is allowed. As I mentioned my focus was straight ahead and then when I got to the junction I looked to my right. However, are they not legally obliged to give a reason to refuse my appeal?

They have a duty at Common Law to act fairly, so just rejecting with no reason is against that. The statutory grounds for this would be "the penalty exceeded the relevant amount in the circumstances of the case". For parking under the TMA 2004, there is a statutory grounds of "procedural impropriety" to cater for things like this, inter alia "failure to consider". In your case you have to rely on a higher law that trumps the law they are enforcing. The only place this sort of thing gets considered is at adjudication.

If it were me, I'd take them to LT - badly placed CPZ sign, and failure to consider.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376034 · Replies: 30 · Views: 1,063

Incandescent
Posted on: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 18:37


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


QUOTE (stamfordman @ Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 18:12) *
If you don't ask you don't get - so could be worth a polite appeal on minimal contravention. They should reoffer the discount if they reject.

+1
It looks on the borderline for a de minimis appeal (which is normally <20 yards in the bus lane). I'd say you'd probably lose at London Tribunals but it could succeed. Depends on what the adjudicator had for breakfast !
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376032 · Replies: 14 · Views: 264

Incandescent
Posted on: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 - 18:33


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 11,644
Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Member No.: 54,455


You need to find out when the Order for Recovery was issued because until that is issued, and the statutory days for submitting a Witness Statement/Statutory Declaration have expired, they (TfL) cannot instruct bailiffs. As you received the Charge Certificate it would seem your address is getting the mail from them, unless you moved after the CC was issued.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1376030 · Replies: 3 · Views: 125

465 Pages V   1 2 3 > » 

New Posts  New Replies
No New Posts  No New Replies
Hot topic  Hot Topic (New)
No new  Hot Topic (No New)
Poll  Poll (New)
No new votes  Poll (No New)
Closed  Locked Topic
Moved  Moved Topic
 

RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: Monday, 23rd April 2018 - 13:05
Pepipoo uses cookies. You can find details of the cookies we use here along with links to information on how to manage them.
Please click the button to accept our cookies and hide this message. We’ll also assume that you’re happy to accept them if you continue to use the site.