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Parked on private land for 2 mins, parking enforcement photographed car
tarugaan
post Thu, 22 Oct 2020 - 16:39
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Entered private land, maneuvered car for around 30 seconds then parked up and got out of the car. Literally was parked up for about 1min30 seconds till the warden came and photographed my car, saw him and then went and moved it off the land. Can I get a parking ticket or is there a 10 min grace period? He wasn't very helpful when I confronted him and pointed to a camera.

Thanks in advance
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post Thu, 22 Oct 2020 - 16:39
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Jlc
post Thu, 22 Oct 2020 - 17:11
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With private parking companies they are keen to issue tickets for anything they can get away with. You will get something in the post...

Do you know which company this is? (My guess that it starts with N)

In terms of grace periods the 10 minutes you refer to is at the end of allowed parking period.

The Code of Practice says:

For BPA members:
QUOTE
13.1 The driver must have the chance to consider the Terms and Conditions before entering into the ‘parking contract’ with you. If, having had that opportunity, the driver decides not to park but chooses to leave the car park, you must provide them with a reasonable consideration period to leave, before the driver can be bound by your parking contract. The amount of time in these instances will vary dependant on site size and type but it must be a minimum of 5 minutes.

but
QUOTE
13.4 Unauthorised motorists will not be entitled to the minimum time period of 5 minutes for a consideration period in spaces designated for specific users e.g Blue Badge holders, pick up/drop off or where parking is prohibited such as hatched areas in front of emergency exits, or on entry and exit ramps etc.


For IPC members:
QUOTE
13.1 Motorists must be allowed a sufficient Consideration Period so they may make an informed decision as to whether or not to enter or remain on the Private Land. If a Motorist chooses to reject the opportunity by entering or remaining on the Private Land without reading terms and conditions, they may be deemed to have accepted them immediately.

but
QUOTE
13.2 Before a Parking Charge is issued Motorists must be allowed a Grace Period save and except when 13.3 is applicable. A Grace Period is a 10 minute period at the end of a Permitted Period of Parking.

13.3 A Grace Period is not required when the Permitted Period of Parking does not exceed 1 hour providing that the signage on the site makes it clear to the Motorist, in a prominent font, that no Grace Period applies on that land.


This post has been edited by Jlc: Thu, 22 Oct 2020 - 17:16


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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The Rookie
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 06:41
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QUOTE (speedfighter23 @ Thu, 22 Oct 2020 - 23:30) *
take it to court and defend yourself

Er, you mean let them take it to court (if they are dumb enough) and you then defend yourself.....


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Jlc
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 07:43
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We don't know the exact circumstances yet. I know of one company that states if you don't and read the signs/pay 'immediately' then they deem that worthy of a ticket. In the good ol' days a clamp would have been on a wheel...

So if you stop, get out and start playing with your phone then they deem that a breach. Manned car parks are the worst - especially as they are likely to be on some sort of 'commission'.

Desperate times.

This post has been edited by Jlc: Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 07:45


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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DancingDad
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 09:48
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QUOTE (Jlc @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 08:43) *
........
So if you stop, get out and start playing with your phone then they deem that a breach. ..........


That's bu55ered up PayByPhone then ?

But you are right, similar will happen in council parking to the unwary.
Park up, go to a cash point but not the machine and a keen CEO could well be starting the process.
In the days before CCTV enforcement was largely banned, ATMs were a prime location to have a camera
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Jlc
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 11:42
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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 10:48) *
That's bu55ered up PayByPhone then ?

There's an actual case in the forum where someone had parked up and was paying over the phone when the ticket was issued because the operative decided the driver hadn't inspected the signs etc.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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DancingDad
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 13:43
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QUOTE (Jlc @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 12:42) *
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 10:48) *
That's bu55ered up PayByPhone then ?

There's an actual case in the forum where someone had parked up and was paying over the phone when the ticket was issued because the operative decided the driver hadn't inspected the signs etc.

Comes as no great surprise
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tarugaan
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 15:13
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Thank you for all the responses.

The land in question is not a pay and display area with a machine etc. There are three parking bays with lines and the camera and no parking sign behind them, can't remember the company name.

I didn't park in any of the bays, I parked opposite them as I was only there for a minute to swap drivers with my mrs who was in another car up the road.

I can provide a link to google streetview but would that not be a good idea?

I have dashcam footage saved with timestamps of when the car was parked, switched off then switched back on

This post has been edited by tarugaan: Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 15:15
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Jlc
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 18:23
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QUOTE (tarugaan @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 16:13) *
I didn't park in any of the bays

Kapow!


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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cp8759
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 19:12
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In the circumstances you describe I think the parking company would really struggle that a contractual relationship was agreed.


--------------------
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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Jlc
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 19:17
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 20:12) *
In the circumstances you describe I think the parking company would really struggle that a contractual relationship was agreed.

I agree but see IPC's interpretation in 13.1 above, particularly the bit that says 'immediately'.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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cp8759
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 19:37
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QUOTE (Jlc @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 20:17) *
QUOTE (cp8759 @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 20:12) *
In the circumstances you describe I think the parking company would really struggle that a contractual relationship was agreed.

I agree but see IPC's interpretation in 13.1 above, particularly the bit that says 'immediately'.

The way I read that, the conditions apply immediately if you park and walk off without bothing to check. But the vehicle was not left unattended, nor was it actually "left" at all.


--------------------
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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Jlc
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 20:22
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You're not thinking like a money grabbing PPC. cool.gif


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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tarugaan
post Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 21:53
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I did leave the car there for a couple of mins whilst I walked to my car around 20 yards away and got the mrs. Hopefully me not parking in any bays persuades them not to pursue. Thank you for all the help
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cp8759
post Sat, 24 Oct 2020 - 00:20
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QUOTE (Jlc @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 21:22) *
You're not thinking like a money grabbing PPC. cool.gif

No I'm looking at it the way I think a court would. What the PPC thinks is largely irrelevant to the final outcome.


--------------------
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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Jlc
post Sat, 24 Oct 2020 - 07:59
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QUOTE (tarugaan @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 22:53) *
I did leave the car there for a couple of mins whilst I walked to my car around 20 yards away and got the mrs. Hopefully me not parking in any bays persuades them not to pursue. Thank you for all the help

Not parking in a bay would make them more likely to pursue!

QUOTE (cp8759 @ Sat, 24 Oct 2020 - 01:20) *
QUOTE (Jlc @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 21:22) *
You're not thinking like a money grabbing PPC. cool.gif

No I'm looking at it the way I think a court would. What the PPC thinks is largely irrelevant to the final outcome.

Absolutely, but not issuing tickets isn't great business sense. No tickets, no income... after all many bow to the pressure even with a strong case.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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The Slithy Tove
post Tue, 27 Oct 2020 - 06:53
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QUOTE (tarugaan @ Fri, 23 Oct 2020 - 21:53) *
I did leave the car there for a couple of mins whilst I walked to my car around 20 yards away and got the mrs. Hopefully me not parking in any bays persuades them not to pursue.

The more you say about this, the less surprised I am that you were issued a ticket.
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