Help on plea |
Help on plea |
Tue, 20 Feb 2018 - 20:43
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#1
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: 20 Feb 2018 Member No.: 96,668 |
Received a speeding ticket through the post,so I asked for pictures as I can’t remember who was driving between me or the wife.I received pictures but this showed me nothing apart from my car.
I filled in the form stating I’m not sure who was driving at the time as I requested pictures to try and see who was driving but due to these not showing the driver due to the car been registered to my name I will take the rap for this ticket.I received a letter saying they can’t take this and my file will be passed on. Months later got court papers to fill out charge is failing to give information relating to the identification of the driver. Now I explained all this to them months ago that I wasn’t sure who was driving but I will take it as I was the owner of the car. Can someone advise what I should plea and say do I plead guilty as I haven’t named the driver or not guilty |
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Tue, 20 Feb 2018 - 20:43
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Tue, 20 Feb 2018 - 20:53
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#2
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Member Group: Members Posts: 41,510 Joined: 25 Aug 2011 From: Planet Earth Member No.: 49,223 |
What did you do to identify the driver?
Did you ask potential drivers? What records did you check etc.? Simply stating you did not know and the pictures didn’t help won't cut it. You have to unequivocally name the driver, there's no option to 'take it'. What was the alleged speed/limit? Have you only been charged with one offence? (Not the speeding?) It's a 6 point offence. -------------------- RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it. |
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Tue, 20 Feb 2018 - 20:57
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#3
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: 20 Feb 2018 Member No.: 96,668 |
Thanks for the reply,the only people who it could be is either me or the wife was clocked at 47 in a 40.
Neither of us can recall who was driving at that time as we share driving and it wasn’t on a local road to us. I requested photos To Hopfully see who was driving I’ve zoomed in on the pictures but they don’t show anything apart from the car Looking at the papers speeding offence isn’t mentioned just the failing to provide This post has been edited by toffee1878: Tue, 20 Feb 2018 - 20:58 |
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Tue, 20 Feb 2018 - 21:39
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#4
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Member Group: Members Posts: 41,510 Joined: 25 Aug 2011 From: Planet Earth Member No.: 49,223 |
As it's just the single offence then you only realistically have the option to decide whether to defend or accept the charge.
What else did you do to identify the driver? But fundamentally you can defend with the statutory defence that you did not know who was driving and could not identify them with reasonable diligence after receiving the request. Without knowing what you did it's hard to say whether you have a chance but it's usually a high hurdle to clear to convince the bench that two adults couldn't identify who was driving. (Especially on an unfamiliar road). However, it's not impossible and some Mag's may accept husband/wife uncertainty if convincing. Failure will see 6 points, large fine, surcharge and costs. Costs alone are likely to be at least £300 (but the CPS list a contested trial at £620). A guilty plea will see a 33% reduction in the fine (listed around 150% weekly earnings) but costs of £85. The surcharge is 10% of the fine (min £30). In hindsight, naming the most likely driver probably would have been a pragmatic decision. This post has been edited by Jlc: Tue, 20 Feb 2018 - 21:55 -------------------- RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it. |
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Wed, 21 Feb 2018 - 01:49
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#5
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Member Group: Members Posts: 13,572 Joined: 28 Mar 2010 Member No.: 36,528 |
How long ago was the speeding? I am wondering if there is time within the 6 months limit for you to get the case transferred to a full court (presuming what you have is a SJPN) see the prosecutor before court and ask for speeding to be added to the charge, so that you can offer to plead guilty to the speeding in exchange for the s.172 being dropped, assuming it is as least likely you were driving as that your wife was. They do actually prefer a conviction for speeding to s.172.
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Wed, 21 Feb 2018 - 13:01
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#6
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,126 Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Member No.: 96,238 |
If you had taken your best guess and named only one driver, the result would have been a £100 speed awareness course and a few hours of wasted time for somebody
This is yet another example where an attempt to provide an honest reply has turned what would have been a trivial matter into a potentially expensive prosecution that can create insurance problems for years A friend of mine was convicted in an identical situation An agreement with the prosecutor on the morning to substitute the charge is a good option if you can genuinely state that you were probably the driver Otherwise you might have a chance if the journey was one that you both make regularly and no reason to remember the occasion You can also argue that you had nothing to gain by failing to identify the driver if you both have clean licences, the financial consequences would be the same and neither of you would receive points Can't see that it will ever happen but a fairer solution to the husband/wife scenario with no points at stake would be the option that both could pay for and attend a speed awareness course The guilty party receives exactly the same outcome as if he's been identified and the other has, at worse, paid for some driver education |
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