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Arrested and Handcuffed for Parking in an Unmarked Bay
bananaskin
post Sat, 20 Feb 2021 - 08:43
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Hello, I've not had the best day and would really appreciate some help. It started with getting ran over by some middle aged man-child riding a stupid Lime bike on the pavement... then got a lot worse. (Apologies for the LONG rant).

I'd pulled into the car park at our local park and there were no marked bay spaces left, so I parked in an unmarked tarmac area that I've used for years without any problem. There are always cars parked there, and a couple of years ago I asked a parking attendant if it was ok and he told me the park doesnt have a policy of only parking within marked bays, uses the area as an overflow car park so it was ok to park there and they dont issue tickets to people that do.
As I was getting out a Parks Police van pulled up and the officer said "you cant park there, move on." I told him there werent any marked spaces and that the I'd been told I was allowed to park there, and he threatened me with a ticket, asking for my name and address. I asked why he needed my details if he was issuing a parking ticket, and he threatened to caution me. I asked him why, and he started the caution. I asked him what offence he was cautioning me for and he said "refusal to provide details". This seemed really odd, because he'd skipped the bit about what offence I was accused of.

Again, I asked why he needs my personal details for a parking ticket and by this time I'd told him I was unhappy with his overzealous attitude and had started videoing him, so he grabbed me by the arm and tried to cuff my hands behind my back.

After he'd cuffed me really tightly I told him I have blood cirulation issues and take blood thinning meds (I had an emergency card in my back pocket) but he refused to loosen the cuffs. I asked what offence I had committed and he said "parking byelaws". I tried to tell him that the parking regulations are posted on a huge board by the payment machine, and there is nothing to say you must park in a marked bay. Every time I queried him, he was vague and evasive, citing different reasons each time.

He then got on the phone for 5 minutes and told me he'd called the Met Police to come down and take me to a police station. I have 2 dogs in my car, I'm handcuffed (he cuffed me whilst the car door was open and my dogs werent secured) and he's refusing to release me unless I identify myself. By now I'm furious that he's bullying me, he also wasnt wearing PPE and was standing 12 inches from me (his colleague put on PPE as soon as I complained) and I'd told him I have serious respiratory medical complications but he still refused to wear PPE or keep his distance and he said "Its ok, I've been vaccinated".

He constantly asked me for my ID, saying that he'd release me if I complied, but I felt I was being bullied, so refused. He then said that I'd flouted a council byelaw whereby a police officer can ask a vehicle to move on, and refusal is an offence. So,.. he's now changed the reason for my detention.

I asked him how long the Met police would be and he made several calls, over about half an hour, until, finally, he finished the call and made one last threat. It seems the Met had decided they had more important things to be doing and had told him to release me, which he reluctantly did.

I think that there was some confusion too: I assumed he wanted to issue a parking ticket, but the female officer explained afterwards that they needed my personal details to issue a Fixed Penalty Notice. At no time did the other officer make this clear, indeed I think he he was being deliberately vague.

I'm utterly furious with his behaviour and not letting me secure my dogs safely was the worst thing for me. I was not aggressive, I asked reasonable questions about the reasons for his actions, i feel that cuffing me was overkill for what was a parking offence.

I've turned the incident over and over in my head to decide whether or not I should make a complaint. Was I in the wrong and what rights do I have?
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post Sat, 20 Feb 2021 - 08:43
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The Rookie
post Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 07:34
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As far as I’m aware no police force keeps revenues from any FPN which would render that argument somewhat moot?

He also asked the OP to move on first, so appeared to have no intent to issue an FPN from the outset.

This post has been edited by The Rookie: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 11:30


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cp8759
post Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 10:19
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+1, FPN revenue goes to HMCTS and is mostly spent on running the Magistrates' Courts. The tiny surplus (£50 million a year out of around £1 billion in revenue) goes into the consolidated fund at the Bank of England.


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notmeatloaf
post Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 12:12
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Unless the Inspector running the unit is wrong, or using "police budget" somewhat loosely. I don't know what legislation they are issuing them under to keep the money.

QUOTE
Insp Biggs said [...] the introduction of Fixed Penalty Notices on June 10th [2019] meant that offences could now be punished immediately, whereas prosecutions could take up to six months. The maximum fine was £80, reduced to £50 if paid within 14 days. There was an appeals procedure. The police could also continue to issue written warnings. Paper work would be reduced considerably, freeing up patrol time. Money raised will go back into the police budget.


https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5a8a...+17%2C+2019.pdf
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Steve_999
post Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 12:47
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QUOTE (notmeatloaf @ Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 12:12) *
Unless the Inspector running the unit is wrong, or using "police budget" somewhat loosely. I don't know what legislation they are issuing them under to keep the money.

QUOTE
Insp Biggs said [...] the introduction of Fixed Penalty Notices on June 10th [2019] meant that offences could now be punished immediately, whereas prosecutions could take up to six months. The maximum fine was £80, reduced to £50 if paid within 14 days. There was an appeals procedure. The police could also continue to issue written warnings. Paper work would be reduced considerably, freeing up patrol time. Money raised will go back into the police budget.


https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5a8a...+17%2C+2019.pdf


It's often said that the last thing you should ask a police officer about is the law. Perhaps that should be the second to last thing, the last being about public service financial arrangements?
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The Rookie
post Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 12:55
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Given there is no appeals procedure for fixed penalties, I’d take the rest with a pinch of salt as well.


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notmeatloaf
post Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 14:35
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Presumably he has responsibility for the budget if he is Inspector. He may not know the law but I would expect him to know whether he is getting the money.

Not my area of expertise but if they are employed by the council is there not the possibility of using byelaws to issue fines? I imagine the volume is so low that even if legally dodgy they are unlikely to be challenged anywhere significant.
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The Rookie
post Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 14:41
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They can't 'issue fines' only a court can do that.

They can issue penalties which recipients can pay or not. As far as I am aware all fixed penalty monies go to HMCTS. Whether the byelaws allow them to issue penalties along the lines of the Railway or airport byelaw penalties which they could keep, I don't know.


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There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
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Council PCN's
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Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

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notmeatloaf
post Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 14:47
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Presumably GLC Parks ones

QUOTE
Offenders, Penalties, etc.
46. Any person (not being an officer of the council acting execution of his duty or other
persons acting in lawful exercise of any authority) committing any breach of these
byelaws shall be subject to a penalty and to a further penalty for each day on which
such offences shall continue after written notice of the offence shall have been given by
the Council.


So penalty from council but issued by police.

https://www.wandsworth.gov.uk/media/4704/gl...rks_byelaws.pdf
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The Rookie
post Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 17:39
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That would require enabling legislation to set the details, amounts etc.


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There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
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Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
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notmeatloaf
post Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 21:36
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Wed, 24 Feb 2021 - 17:39) *
That would require enabling legislation to set the details, amounts etc.

I thought the council could just publish their own fixed penalty amounts under the London Local Authorities Act 2004 s17, unless the SoS objects?

Either way they did, at a London Councils meeting in 2017.

QUOTE
8. GLC Parks Byelaws – Setting Penalty Levels
The Committee considered a report that provided members with the results of the
GLC Parks Byelaws consultation which was run over the summer on behalf of TEC.
The Chair asked whether the old byelaws would be brought up-to-date. Jennifer
Sibley, Principal Policy Officer, London Councils, said that it was a complex process
to try and update the byelaws, although the consultation was part of efforts by the
London borough of Wandsworth to modernise its Parks Byelaws.
Decision: The Committee:
• Noted the consultation outcome;
• Agreed to set a fixed penalty level of £80 for breaches to the GLC Parks
Byelaws; and
• Agreed to set the level of reduced payment at £50 if the fixed penalty was
paid within 14 days from the date of the notice.


https://www.londoncouncils.gov.uk/download/file/fid/21705
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The Rookie
post Thu, 25 Feb 2021 - 07:27
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Interesting find, it would be interesting to determine the true legitimacy of it.

Like station parking invoices it appears little more than an offer to avoid prosecution which you would be free to ignore, likelihood of prosecution unknown!

This post has been edited by The Rookie: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 - 07:53


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There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
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Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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cp8759
post Thu, 25 Feb 2021 - 09:15
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Thu, 25 Feb 2021 - 07:27) *
Interesting find, it would be interesting to determine the true legitimacy of it.

Like station parking invoices it appears little more than an offer to avoid prosecution which you would be free to ignore, likelihood of prosecution unknown!

Well one interesting example of this is the current TT2 thread the council forum, seems they just missed the 6 month deadline. I sometimes wonder how many PCNs were issued if all revenue went to the treasury, and the only interest councils had in issuing were the interests of justice, rather than their own financial interests...


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hcandersen
post Fri, 26 Feb 2021 - 12:05
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Rather than speculate, I suggest the OP works from this policy:

https://www.wandsworth.gov.uk/media/7328/pa...ment_policy.pdf

And then consider whether they have a case.

The fact that an attested Parks constable may do something within the scope of their powers is not the issue, it is whether the exercise of these powers has been circumscribed by the council under a policy, which it has and whether that policy sets out overarching considerations e.g. 'Fair, proportionate' etc.


It also sets out the legislation under which the constables act and what they may and may not enforce.

I suggest the OP reads the above.

And as regards to whom penalties are paid and how they are to be applied, it's not as simple as prior comments might suggest:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/go...t-guidance1.pdf

This post has been edited by hcandersen: Fri, 26 Feb 2021 - 12:09
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southpaw82
post Fri, 26 Feb 2021 - 14:55
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QUOTE (hcandersen @ Fri, 26 Feb 2021 - 12:05) *
Rather than speculate, I suggest the OP works from this policy:

https://www.wandsworth.gov.uk/media/7328/pa...ment_policy.pdf

And then consider whether they have a case.

The fact that an attested Parks constable may do something within the scope of their powers is not the issue, it is whether the exercise of these powers has been circumscribed by the council under a policy, which it has and whether that policy sets out overarching considerations e.g. 'Fair, proportionate' etc.

That raises the question of whether the council has the authority to limit the actions it’s employees who are attested as constables may take. It is settled law that a constable exercises his or her powers as such as an independent officer of the Crown. They are subject to operational control by their employer but I’m not convinced an employer can direct them when to, or not to, exercise their powers. If the same applies to parks constables then no policy can restrict the exercise of their powers as a constable.


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cp8759
post Fri, 26 Feb 2021 - 19:33
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QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Fri, 26 Feb 2021 - 14:55) *
That raises the question of whether the council has the authority to limit the actions it’s employees who are attested as constables may take. It is settled law that a constable exercises his or her powers as such as an independent officer of the Crown. They are subject to operational control by their employer but I’m not convinced an employer can direct them when to, or not to, exercise their powers. If the same applies to parks constables then no policy can restrict the exercise of their powers as a constable.

I was thinking the same thing. Also are park constables actually employees, or are they just office holders like territorial constables?


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southpaw82
post Fri, 26 Feb 2021 - 23:05
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Fri, 26 Feb 2021 - 19:33) *
I was thinking the same thing. Also are park constables actually employees, or are they just office holders like territorial constables?

I would guess (and it is a guess) that they are employees who are also attested as constables - rather than “just” constables. I’ve seen similar, eg airport police.


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